Is a tweecer worth it on a pretty much stock GT?

The Green GT · May 30, 2007

I have been thinking about getting a tweecer, but I dont know if its worth it yet. What all would I be able to change on a stock motor?

reddy351 · May 30, 2007

I would say so. I guess the "tune" that the factory put on these cars was pretty conservative. I'll bet you could still find some power, just my maximizing some of the things you can play with. The rev limiter, timing, fuel curves can all be made "better". Maybe a tuning device should be the first "mod" we make. Opinions?

sage2k · May 31, 2007

just removing the shift retard is worth it lol

The Green GT · May 31, 2007

What exactly is the shift retard? Does it pull timing when you first shift into a gear?

Labora · May 31, 2007

IMO for the cost vs. power and improvement no. Sure the shift retard sucks but not enough to drop 450~ on a used tweecer. (and more on a new one)

If you wish to learn to tune some, and plan to have a power adder or HCI at a later time I'd consider it but only after all the basic mods.

sage2k · May 31, 2007

The Green GT said:
What exactly is the shift retard? Does it pull timing when you first shift into a gear?

yeah it pulls an arse load of timing when you shift from one gear to the next,assuming you lift off the gas pedal

I noticed a huge difference when i removed the shift retard

Stanger007 · May 31, 2007

I would vote "no" -- based on knowing you and your plans for your car I've got sort of an insider's point of view.

I think the $700 you'd spend on a twEECer and wideband could be better spent elsewhere for you at this point. Once you get a supercharger/stroker re-evaluate the situation then. You may decide you just want a chip and be done with it.

To get a feel for what the twEECer is all about, go download the software from the website, load it up and start reading all you can about it. The included PDF in the download is an excellent starting place.

At this point in the game you can go a lot faster with your money spent on other parts than you will with the twEECer on your car... and you'll need it to keep up with me and Sam next time at the track.

Wes

final5-0 · May 31, 2007

reddy351 said:
I would say so. I guess the "tune" that the factory put on these cars was pretty conservative. I'll bet you could still find some power, just my maximizing some of the things you can play with. The rev limiter, timing, fuel curves can all be made "better". Maybe a tuning device should be the first "mod" we make. Opinions?

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=702728

See the ranking of priority I placed on tuning equipment in my 12 month
plan for taking a Stock GT to 300 at the wheels with an oem block
after market parts NA combo.

Grady

final5-0 · May 31, 2007

Labora said:
IMO for the cost vs. power and improvement no. Sure the shift retard sucks but not enough to drop 450~ on a used tweecer. (and more on a new one)

Agreed

I'm always concerned about Gain vrs Buck spent to get it

For a stocker or bolt on Stang ... the gain vrs the cost ... it sucks
however
Self Tuning should be considered with a long term plan in mind ...
more on this later

$450

I wish

A used laptop with good battery $200-$400
A wide band $200
Supporting software $50-$100

Conservative reality figures to be an effective tuner

If you wish to learn to tune some, and plan to have a power adder or HCI at a later time I'd consider it but only after all the basic mods.

Many do it that way and I'm not saying it is wrong at all
but
Consider a different view point ... if you will

You bring up that long term plan
so
I say if one really has got a plan ............

They should look at the tuning equipment no differently than any
other part included in the parts list of that plan

Get the equipment early on in the plan

This allows you to get a two fold benefit of ...........
1) Easier to learn on a stocker than a modded h/c/i or forced combo
2) You can learn self tuning while you save cash and grow the combo

Bottom Line here ... Like others have said
Too much money
if
Stock or bolt on is all that is planned for the combo

Grady

HISSIN50 · May 31, 2007

Forget all that. The fox puter retrofit is the way to go.

Sorry, but we knew someone would rave about it, so I thought I'd get it out of the way.

On a serious note, WTF is a Tweeker (other than an illiterate kid on drugs)? I just saw a reference to that in a car mag article.

Pokageek · May 31, 2007

You've already heard my rant on tweecer 9 times, lol. So I'll tell you the good part. You can tune your stock fans and save your engine from sweating so hard in the summer months...also good for auto trans..good for stoping the car from PULLING timing at the end of the quarter if yer going fazt, removing speed limiter..if you desire...

The Green GT · May 31, 2007

Ok. So the majority is no. the main things I would get it for would be to change the fan cut on temps, and remove the shift retard. I am going to need one sooner or later. Dont you guys think it would be better for me to get it early in the game so I can get used to it?

Basically my plans are one of two things. Explorer motor with Vortech, or a bored 351.

And I already have a good laptop, so I wont need to drop extra money on that like Grady said. All i would need is the tweecer and the wideband. I would rather get it early, becasue it takes me a while to save that much money. I wouldnt want to get the S/C or 351 and have it, then have to save up even longer to get it tuned so I can use it.

Ill sleep on it and let you guys know what I think.

sage2k · May 31, 2007

cobra intake

final5-0 · May 31, 2007

Self Tuning can be like ... Modding a Stang

You know how we all say
"I'll be happy with ... Just a little more power"

Then we go out and buy parts for that little bit more power

Only to find

Those parts are no longer good cause

We are no longer satisfied with ... Just a little more power

Same kind of thing could happen with Tweecer Self Tuning

You could save cash with the basic unit cause it will make simple
changes like fan on/off temps, tip in spark retard (shift retard) and
other similar changes.

Doing just the above ... thats such a tiny part of Self Tuning

There is a whole other world that exists which could be beneficial
to you such as datalogging sensors, wide band output in sync with
those sensors, using gathered data to solve drivability issues,
and so forth, but the base unit does not allow those options.

So you see ... Look within yourself right now
Make sure you don't fool yourself now and have to pay later

Only you can decide if You or a Pro should tune your Stang

IMHO ... You are wise to look way ahead for all possible options
so you can work up a good game plan

Grady

The Green GT · May 31, 2007

When you say the base unit will not do that you dont mean the RT right?

EDIT: Cause I plan on getting the RT, not the $380 base model.

Pokageek · May 31, 2007

I did that wit hthe base model yes, not r/t. Worked fine mostly except when it kept turning the car off cuz I could never get a good seal on my puter.

rj95svt · May 31, 2007

Yes I'm sure he's talking about the base unit. I am looking at doing the same thing you are because my planned mods will require either a chip tune or a tweecer. I too will be getting the RT when I decide to buy. I will not be getting the wideband o2 as of yet but will before too long. I have already deleted the smog and egr so I have the dreaded and annoying check engine light. So I would use the tweecer to turn those two things off too. I also love to learn how things work and while things like this can be aggrivating due to their steep learning curve I think I would love to learn how to self tune.

final5-0 · May 31, 2007

The Green GT said:
What exactly is the shift retard? Does it pull timing when you first shift into a gear?

This is one of those things that is a bit misunderstood

Peeps call it a Shift Retard when it really is ......
A retarding of spark when the throttle is tipped in

In the Tweecer software it is a scalar that is described as ..............
spark_min_for_tip-in_retard

btw ... The default value is 5 degrees

What happens is if you are at a light load, slight throttle opening condition
like a low speed cruise in say 3rd gear and then ... tip-in ... the throttle
to a WOT condition ... you will see a retard of spark to 5 degrees for
about 1/2 of a second.

So you see ... shifting is NOT necessary for the event to happen
although
Shifting can be involved as it happens too

Here is an example of how it hurts performance in an untuned Stang

Consider the fact the spark table is calling for 25 degrees at WOT
and
Most peeps keep the dizzy above stock value at say 4 degrees more

You are in second at WOT and do a quick shift to third and back to WOT

You were in second with a total spark advance of 25+4 for 29 total

You now gotta go through a time interval of about 1/2 of a second
with your spark reduced to 5 degrees right after you get back on
the skinny pedal before you return to your normal 29 degrees of
total advance under WOT conditions.

Hope that helps you to see it a bit more clearly

Grady

The Green GT · May 31, 2007

Yea, that explains it a good bit.

But you were not talking about the RT earlier were you?

final5-0 · May 31, 2007

The Green GT said:
Yea, that explains it a good bit.

But you were not talking about the RT earlier were you?

Well I guess I called it a basic unit
and
By the way you guys make it seem in this thread

The more accurate name must be a ... base unit

I would not advise getting a ... base ... unit
because
It can do nothing more than ... basic ... stuff

IIRC The more advanced unit is called the RT unit
and
I would advise using it as it affords you more tuning options

Grady

Is a tweecer worth it on a pretty much stock GT?

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