Just installed performer: No Power?

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

ok i finished installing my edelbrock manifold a couple of days ago and today i finally got a chance to time it.....anyways I set the timing at 10 degrees and when i go to drive it has no power and at low rpms it pops out the intake....I checked for vac leaks and didnt find any so i donno wtf the prob is....

Basicly is drives fine NORMALLY but when you want to get-up-and-go.....its not there.

CManT1914 · Sep 28, 2005

How did you check for vacuum leaks? I'd hook a guage up to it to make sure there aren't any. Do you have a CEL coming on?

final5-0 · Sep 28, 2005

CManT1914 said:
How did you check for vacuum leaks? I'd hook a guage up to it to make sure there aren't any. Do you have a CEL coming on?

Your dizzy ain't right.

I bet it is a tooth off one way or the other from where it originally was installed.

Put the hb on 0 and the rotor on 1 and see if it fires.

If not, it is most likely 180 out and just point the rotor the exact opposite way.

Grady

legalize420 · Sep 28, 2005

SM0k3 said:
anyways I set the timing at 10 degrees and when i go to drive it has no power and at low rpms it pops out the intake

i would check to make sure the firing order is right, and what do you mean pops out the intake

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

i have a engine light coming on but thats because during the install i accidently broke my EGR pipe so i just deleted it

and when i say "pops out the intake" i mean when you "stab" the throttle to rev, it backfires from the intake. Also I thought there was no such thing as "one tooth off" just as long as you can reach your timing mark? anyone wanna clear that up becuase its set at 10 degrees right now.

CManT1914 · Sep 28, 2005

SM0k3 said:
i have a engine light coming on but thats because during the install i accidently broke my EGR pipe so i just deleted it

Not a good idea. Your EGRless stang can have some problems now, but not like you're discribing, so I wouldn't look into that as the cause.

SM0k3 said:
and when i say "pops out the intake" i mean when you "stab" the throttle to rev, it backfires from the intake. Also I thought there was no such thing as "one tooth off" just as long as you can reach your timing mark? anyone wanna clear that up becuase its set at 10 degrees right now.

I also thought there was no such thing as 1 tooth off. If it's timed, it's timed. I guess you could always try and restab the dizzy though, it never hurts, and it doesn't take any time at all to do it. Like Grady said, HB on 0, piston 1 at TDC on compression stroke, then stab the dizzy in where the rotor is at the #1 contact.

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

CManT1914 said:
Not a good idea. Your EGRless stang can have some problems now, but not like you're discribing, so I wouldn't look into that as the cause.

I also thought there was no such thing as 1 tooth off. If it's timed, it's timed. I guess you could always try and restab the dizzy though, it never hurts, and it doesn't take any time at all to do it. Like Grady said, HB on 0, piston 1 at TDC on compression stroke, then stab the dizzy in where the rotor is at the #1 contact.

without the EGR what kind of problems will I have? and i have no choice accept to goto the junkyard and find a complete EGR system with pipe cause the pipe off, so i just smashed the end of it shut and left the connection hooked up until i can order a delete plate.

Also when i get my headers installed how will the EGR hook up?

CManT1914 · Sep 28, 2005

SM0k3 said:
without the EGR what kind of problems will I have? and i have no choice accept to goto the junkyard and find a complete EGR system with pipe cause the pipe off, so i just smashed the end of it shut and left the connection hooked up until i can order a delete plate.

Mainly just part-throttle detonation, maybe a little less mpg, but no power loss. EGR is shut off at idle and WOT anyway.

SM0k3 said:
Also when i get my headers installed how will the EGR hook up?

Same way as factory, our headers have the EGR bung on a primary, so it will hook up no problem.

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

hmm I guess once i get the problem sorted out ill hook it back up......Also what a safe, easy way to check for vac leaks around the intake?

final5-0 · Sep 28, 2005

The wording I used was from where it was originally installed because I knew some would question that, lol.

Anyway.......................................

The dizzy being one tooth off is all about your normal reference point of how the dizzy sits.

If you got room to twist the dizzy enough in the direction needed to make the time be correct then ................................

All is fine

however

In the real world, how it really is, and the like.............................

you usually can't twist the dizzy enough to get things right cause the wires won't stretch enough, the dizzy bangs up against something, etc.

But for those who might loose sleep at night about what I said ...............

There is no such thing as the dizzy being one tooth off,

Don't wanna mislead any new peeps

Grady

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

final5-0 said:
The wording I used was from where it was originally installed because I knew some would question that, lol.

Anyway.......................................

The dizzy being one tooth off is all about your normal reference point of how the dizzy sits.

If you got room to twist the dizzy enough in the direction needed to make the time be correct then ................................

All is fine

however

In the real world, how it really is, and the like.............................

you usually can't twist the dizzy enough to get things right cause the wires won't stretch enough, the dizzy bangs up against something, etc.

But for those who might loose sleep at night about what I said ...............

There is no such thing as the dizzy being one tooth off,

Don't wanna mislead any new peeps

Grady

lol yea i was just checking....but i was able to get my mark fine so that must mean i have a vac leak then? I checked all over and couldnt find jack crap....wtf

CManT1914 · Sep 28, 2005

SM0k3 said:
hmm I guess once i get the problem sorted out ill hook it back up......Also what a safe, easy way to check for vac leaks around the intake?

With the engine idling, spray carb cleaner around the intake gaskets, throttle body gaskets etc. If the idle raises, you got a vacuum leak right where you jus sprayed.

SM0k3 · Sep 28, 2005

ok ill try that after work tomorrow. thanks

Grn92LX · Sep 28, 2005

Did you verify with a timing light that the timing is good? Marking it doesn't help, you have to check with a light.

Also sounds more like a vacuum leak since that'll cause a lean condition and you said it pops through the intake. I had that problem when I first got my 347 running, I hooked the wideband up and it was running very lean. What did you tq the lower intake to? Did you go through the sequence until ALL bolts were tq'd properly? I'm guessing no. Fyi, it will take more than 3 times to get the bolts right.

TrueBlue95GT · Sep 28, 2005

Make sure when you set the timing, that you set it at 10 BTC and not 10 ATC.

WhiteDevil · Sep 28, 2005

Yeah screw the marking and teeth stuff, you need to get a timing light on there and make sure its at 10 degrees.

GRGT1994 · Sep 28, 2005

CManT1914 said:
Mainly just part-throttle detonation, maybe a little less mpg, but no power loss. EGR is shut off at idle and WOT anyway.

I'm not familar with this? I have been running my car w/o the EGR pipe (capped both ends off - hope you got your cash BTW!! and THX). Anyway, I am on the stock computer, no chip, no tune, and no detonation anywhere.

CManT1914 · Sep 28, 2005

GRGT1994 said:
I'm not familar with this? I have been running my car w/o the EGR pipe (capped both ends off - hope you got your cash BTW!! and THX). Anyway, I am on the stock computer, no chip, no tune, and no detonation anywhere.

Yea, when EGR is active (part throttle), the computer sends exhaust gasses back through the motor (exhaust being cooler than combustion chamber, thus to help cool the combustion temperatures), and dials in a lot of timing to help with fuel efficiency. Thus, without it hooked up, and it not deleted from the PCM, the computer thinks there's still cool exhaust gases flowing through the motor, and the timing it dials in, mixed with the now hotter combustion temps (due to lack of cooler exhaust gases) causes detonation. It seems not every guy has problems with this though, it's hit or miss from what I've seen. Glad you're not having problems. I did get the cash, did you get my PM? I sent you one saying I got it. No problem about the caps, always glad to help a fellow stanger out.

GRGT1994 · Sep 28, 2005

CManT1914 said:
Yea, when EGR is active (part throttle), the computer sends exhaust gasses back through the motor (exhaust being cooler than combustion chamber, thus to help cool the combustion temperatures)

Still not following. Most of the air flowing into the upper intake is cool air coming from outside of the car, at ambiant air temp. The air added by the EGR is hot exhaust gas fresh out of the scalding hot header - recirculated, combusted air and exhaust gases. So deleting the EGR pipe without telling the computer would lead to cooler (rather than hotter) air temp in teh combustion chamber than the computer expects. The EGR valve still opens, just no air flows in because it's capped off.

I guess it's not an issue for me (for whatever reason) because I have been running it like this for a few weeks with no issue. But I got a little concerned when I read your comment about part throttle detonation.

Mrgreen94gt · Sep 28, 2005

I had an occasional ping before I got cats. Went away right afterwards, despite a bad vacuum leak. Not entirely sure if the cats were the cause of the ping going way, it just correlated.

For the thread starter: one place to check would be the vacuum T-fitting at the back of the intake. That thing can crack or split apart entirely with some age on it.

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