Limited Slip or Lockers?

69Rcode_Mach1 · Nov 16, 2004

So im gonna have to buy the regular open gears right, the ones you find on summit or jegs for the open rear in the ratio i want, and then i buy the locker and they go together on the install? Can you guys also recommend any good links and sights to specific detroits. All i get are offroading ones when i search so i don't know if its the same or not. Thanks

usedtobe 67p51d · Nov 17, 2004

Gapony farm....dude you're all about making friends arn't you.
I never said "detroit" locker...just "locker"

and yes I still like my torsen better.

GaPonyFarm · Nov 18, 2004

Usedtobe: There is a very big world off difference between the two... and bad info doesn't make friends.

I've never used the Torsen piece, but have heard elsewhere its a good compromise.

69Rcode: Check GEFRacing.com for the gears and Ford Trac-Lok (which is rebuildable). They have some of the best prices.

You'll probably want to go directly to Moser, or Superior for your axles, if you need them. If you plan on keeping below 300hp, the stock 28 spline axles will work fine, otherwise go to a 31 spline axle.

Looks like you need the gears of your choosing (Gears don't care if its a posi or open rearend), a differential, and a set of axles that match your differential (28 spline, 31 spline, etc). If you have a shop do the install, they should have all they need to do the job. If you do it at home, you'll also need an installation kit for the gears. I would highly recommend farming it out, because its a pretty technical installation and very easy to do wrong, which could destroy your new rearend.

Hope this helps...

69Rcode_Mach1 · Nov 18, 2004

Hey thanks a lot gapony that does help a good deal. Ill check it out, so i should definently go with the 31 spline axles then. Im shooting for 350 rwhp with my c6, and more with the t5. this is gonna get pricey.

nosaj122081 · Nov 18, 2004

My 393C should make 350-400 RWHP through a Toploader, I'm using my 28 spline axles 'cause its what I have... If you have 28's, don't intend on running a full slick, I wouldn't worry about 'em. If you decide to upgrade in the future, you can do what I was planning for LONG down the road and get a set of alloy 28 splines that can take more abuse. I remember a thread on the 351C forum a while back discussing this and a surprising number of guys were running the piss outta 28 spliners.

Edbert · Nov 18, 2004

No-slip is not a locker, it is a spool. Even the toughest "locker" out there will slip if there's enough traction differential. An LSD can last for many years under normal and even moderately agressive driving. But get one burnout where a wheel is in the water and the other is not and the LSD will be fried in a few seconds.

The old style detroit lockers WERE noisy, but that was with a stock ehaust Look into one of the newer "soft lockers"...they have 90% of the slip prevention and brute strenght of the old DL, and are 90% as smooth and quiet as an LSD.

69Rcode_Mach1 · Nov 18, 2004

Anybody wanna tell me where i can find these soft lockers? Ive never heard of them. Any previous experiences. Also give me some more input on the axle question. I have one, but i want more opinions. Thanks guys.

69Rcode_Mach1 · Nov 18, 2004

Anyone Anyone?

GaPonyFarm · Nov 19, 2004

Most of the larger performance parts houses carry the most of the brands.

GaPonyFarm · Nov 19, 2004

69Rcode_Mach1 said:
Hey thanks a lot gapony that does help a good deal. Ill check it out, so i should definently go with the 31 spline axles then. Im shooting for 350 rwhp with my c6, and more with the t5. this is gonna get pricey.

That depends on what you already have. If you already have a 9", 28 spline, rear, you can most likely dig up a used (posi of some type) differential real cheap and install your new gears into it... If or when you break it, you can then buy the new stuff and not be out much money over the long haul.

The other option is to build it up, from the beginning, and sleep well knowing its not going to break. I've seen guys put big power to 28 spline axles and never miss a beat... I've seen others break 28 splines repeatedly. Its a crap shoot, but with 350 hp (rwhp) I'd probably spend the $$$ up front.

Pricey? I just keep telling myself its only money... I can always make more. I also keep telling myself, that I hope I'm right.

Edbert · Nov 19, 2004

A perfect example of a "soft" locker is the Lock-Rite from True Trax. Google for it and you'll find it has a popular following, nearly 100% positive from the 4X4 crowd, a bit less from the drag racers. But if you are under 550HP they'll hold up great, and much stronger than an LSD, without the abrupt disengagement of the Detroit Lockers from the '60s.

Here's a brief but accurate write-up:
http://www.4x44u.com/pub/k2/am4x44u/truck_stop/parts/lckrt.htm

Exploded view:

69Rcode_Mach1 · Nov 20, 2004

Hey guys check out this link and tell me what you think.

http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/prod...DRI&man=DETL&prodline=DETL&catName=Drivetrain

Hissing Cobra · Nov 20, 2004

Edbert, my No-SPIN unit is not a spool. It is a Locker unit that engages/disengages when cornering. It's not too bad. Most of the times when I'm cornering, I automatically lift off of the gas pedal. This disengages the rear and allows the inside rear wheel to slip while cornering.

If you try to "gas it" while cornering, it will lock up and you could be in trouble. This is something that you figure out on your first test ride and get used to. It truly is not a problem.

When in a straight line, both rear wheels are locked and performance is great!

burnout289 · Nov 21, 2004

seems to me like most people in favor of the newer lockers vs LSD make a comment about having to be careful in turns and "you get used to it". I like to carve corners. I don't want to be careful! but it sounds like everyone is crapping on LSDs so what would you recommend? ...thx

Hissing Cobra · Nov 21, 2004

I'm not putting down LSD's at all. I recommended the Locker unit because that's what I have. It is rock solid reliable and works great if you want to drag race (which is something that he plans to do occasionally.)

Obviously, if you want to "carve corners," then this is not the unit for you. I can't recommend something for you because I've never used another unit for that purpose.

I built my car for street driveablility with the occasional trip to the dragstrip (same as 69Rcode Mach I) and I wouldn't go with anything else. I wanted to build a car with components that last (my brother's entire drivetrain is identicle to mine and it's been going for 8 years without a single problem.)

I've had mine in the car for two months now and I've driven it for close to 2,000 miles and I wouldn't change a thing.

By the way, I drive my car to work 2 to 3 days per week and cruise in it constantly. The engagement/disengagement of the locker unit doesn't bother me at all.

69Rcode Mach I, I've checked out your link and it looks like they'll have the unit that you may be interested in. If you plan to race it occasionally the 28 spline axles will work, but may be a wink link. I thought this would be the case with me too, so I upgraded to the 31-spline axles (bought them through SUMMIT) to be on the safe side. I bought my locker from www.drivetrainspecialists.com . You may want to price shop and compare their pricing.

Good luck in your decision making process.

nosaj122081 · Nov 21, 2004

burnout289 said:
seems to me like most people in favor of the newer lockers vs LSD make a comment about having to be careful in turns and "you get used to it". I like to carve corners. I don't want to be careful! but it sounds like everyone is crapping on LSDs so what would you recommend? ...thx

IIRC, theres several guys that run lockers on road courses (I think 2BAV8 is one of 'em, as well as MAYBE opentracker and roadracer of the VMF, can't remember) and love them. I guess even I blew the "get used to it" thing a little out of proportion; I "got used" to mine the first time I took it out... Thats another beauty of a locker; it's predictablility. You'll find the amount of throttle it takes to lock or unlock it almost immediately, and how to get in and out of parking spots without dragging the outside tire. Don't think if you hit the gas in a corner that you'll go flyin' out of control, it just doesn't happen (at least on dry roads, I didn't drive the Mach 1 in the rain), it just causes some more understeer. I lived out in the sticks for a while and had to drive a windy road to get there, I'd run some of those turns under WOT with no control problems.

Mosse · Nov 22, 2004

I´m right now looking for an option for my LSD too... It seems that after 2000 km with my mild 351w, the slipping isn´t so limited no more... Only one black line. snif. Is there lockers for 8" too, or do I have to ad that 30kg to my rear...

usedtobe 67p51d · Nov 22, 2004

look at a torsen or goldtrak diff for corner-carvers.

66P51GT · Nov 22, 2004

usedtobe 67p51d said:
look at a torsen or goldtrak diff for corner-carvers.

You can get these from Griggs Racing.

Darkhorse845 · Nov 22, 2004

Locker for sure.

Limited Slip or Lockers?

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