Made the switch to Royal Purple today...

ceracer33 · Mar 16, 2008

CobraRed_96_GT said:
not calling you guys stupid, just saying you'll find whatever you want to find with oils. What works for your app based on what you see as results is not externally valid, i see way too many blanket recommendations based on little more than a hunch. And my guess is RP gets 80% of its business from this, cuz its certainly not from analytical data tests

I worked for Royal Petroleum for 3 years and many of the owners and bosses worked with or around John Williams during his hay-day, master of marketing and proprietary "secrets" yes, but what's produced today they wouldn't want to be compared in USE tests against most any major manufacturer on the market.

this is not the first time i have heard u talk about different oils and working for that company, can i ask u what brands u prefer since u seem to have the inside scoop on engine oil. lets hear ur top 5 oil choices.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 16, 2008

ceracer33 said:
this is not the first time i have heard u talk about different oils and working for that company, can i ask u what brands u prefer since u seem to have the inside scoop on engine oil. lets hear ur top 5 oil choices.

hmm maybe i mention i work for the company in OIL threads so that it shows im not just wildly throwing around opinions. I don't openly push any brand, all i can vouch for are the oil's that i've seen having or not having problems. Oil that comes back with good analysis results or where customers can tell the difference after taking their application apart on intermittent schedules slowly gain my respect. Where oils that don't do this and customers see problems related to the oil whcih can be shown based on free anlysis tend to not get my seal of approval - is Rp the only oil like this? No. But i see it supported so frequently on boards and it seems to be one of the most expensive options as well - so i'd like to think making people think twice is a good thing over blindly buying whats priced higher.
I'm not going to list off oils i think are good, it depends on the application and my opinion is limited to my experience in distributing. So you can go back through more of my threads to see what i've recommend for different components and why - but at least i have a basis that expends further than just using it in my engine and noticing it running "smoother" to judge oil on.

BTW, I have RP in my diff right now, notice no problems. Was it wise to use RP over other oils? Perhaps not, is it the best stuff my diff could hope for? It's certainly possible. But im not going to go around telling every one how great it is on the basis of me not shooting the pinion out of the pumpkin. I'd rather base my choice on MSDS listed spec sheets that I can interpret or independent tests: http://www.performanceoiltechnology.com/Gear Lube White Paper.pdf

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 16, 2008

i you or anyone here cares enough to take this to pm's im more than willing to explain myself with data (beyond the provided link). I'll explain myself if needed, i wont just throw data at ya. I don't want to appear like i'm after RP, just trying to take the hype down a notch for what in my opinion is needed.

san~man · Mar 17, 2008

enyawix said:
I recommend oils based on "MY" dyno numbers and track times. Unless you are clueless you can tell when your engine sounds good. I could hear I had more power! My 347 made 17MPG at over wheel 400HP. Do not label us as stupid. I built the 347 and the 351 in my sig. I call 3hp at the wheels from oil a BIG deal. Turbo engines tend to punish oil, but Amsoil RP hold up and go the distance.

How can you attribute a 3HP difference on a dyno to oil?

A variance of a few degrees in temperature from sequential runs could easily cause that difference

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 17, 2008

san~man said:
How can you attribute a 3HP difference on a dyno to oil?

A variance of a few degrees in temperature from sequential runs could easily cause that difference

RP's "independent" tests attribute 1.2-4% gains from oil and up to 5% fuel savings. But these are done by, but not limited to, Horsepower TV, Hotrod TV, Tuner Performance Reports Magazine, Performance Auto & Sound Magazine who all run adds for RP in their magazines or during commercial breaks.

enyawix · Mar 18, 2008

san~man said:
How can you attribute a 3HP difference on a dyno to oil?

A variance of a few degrees in temperature from sequential runs could easily cause that difference

The dyno is indoor at 70 degrees. I no longer have the 347; because I sold it to help pay for the 351. The 351 has only run Amsoil. I stopped using RP in favor of Amsoil when I started rebuilding transmissions. RP is known to create issues in the T5. Soon as I get my new pistons installed I will dyno. I just switch to E85 so I can get away with higher compression. I will do a Amsoil vs whatever oil is in san~man's car just to prove a point.

san~man · Mar 18, 2008

I've used Amsoil, RP and Mobil 1, so take your pick. Makes no difference to me.

So you're going to dyno a run on Ams, drain the oil, refill with brand "X," then re-dyno again?

I still say that a small variance in temperatures will cause a slight difference in HP read. Are you going to allow for proper cool down, etc?

I'm just a skeptic, that's all.

Notchbck93 · Mar 18, 2008

I've known plenty of mod motors to go well over 200G on Castrol GTX and still not burn a drop of oil.

If you want to extend your oil change intervals to 5 thousand plus to better utilize syn confirmed with UOA's... go for it; otherwise I run dyno and change out at 3G or 3 months, which ever comes first.

I've know air cooled motorcylce engines to go over 100G with castrol GTX dyno 10-40. No fancy cycle oil was used nor syn... just religious oil/filter changes.

I also have done my own placebo with several owners to prove a point... Looking for the redline/rp tranny mix on manuals and I would simply refill with factory ford tranny fluid... Boy they would tell me how much smoother the car shifts and it must really be the oil. Man, they even felt stronger acceleration; it was incredible. I would later let them on to what I did as to not cheat anyone, but the look on their faces was absolutely priceless. You mean... you mean... yup that's right, exact same fluid you already had but with refreshed modifiers.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 18, 2008

i would never recommend anyone to base their oil choice based on hp number differences. In that circumstance your relying on viscosity more than anything, an oil that shears bonds over extended heat periods and even causes wear due to moly attributes can still net more power, after all thinning means less resistance to flow (yay! ). Doesn't mean the oil is doing anything positive for your tranny or engine. Unless you have the car on a dyno for 4k miles and actually measure cut depth from wear you're not measuring squat.

Uncle Meat · Mar 18, 2008

Isn't RP notorious for using high levels of sulphur in their oils?

U.M.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 18, 2008

Uncle Meat said:
Isn't RP notorious for using high levels of sulphur in their oils?

U.M.

synthetics should not contain sulfur. You get contaminants of sulfur and ash (+reactive hydrocarbons and other materials that cannot be completely removed during the refining process) in crude oils (minerals) but sythetics should elimiate this although there are trace amounts in many brands due to processing methods. I believe RP claims an index of <.5% sulfur mass: http://www.ro-quip.com/Technical_Docs/Royal Purple/Industrial fluids/RP Motor Oil_ps.pdf
not sure what independent studies show. One of the last things i'd be concerned with as far as RP goes tho. Sulfur usually only deals with diesel engines anyways

BadboyGT · Mar 18, 2008

It has been proven that Amsoil oil is a TRUE synthetic and the BEST synthetic you can by for your Mustang

streethorse · Mar 18, 2008

BadboyGT said:
It has been proven that Amsoil oil is a TRUE synthetic and the BEST synthetic you can by for your Mustang

And it has been proven..... that sheet cost way too much.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 18, 2008

Gotta pay to play. Not saying i disagree, but where was it proven?

Uncle Meat · Mar 18, 2008

BadboyGT said:
It has been proven that Amsoil oil is a TRUE synthetic and the BEST synthetic you can by for your Mustang

May be, but if you're like most of us who change their oil religiously every 3000 miles the additional cost for Amsoil is not justified in any way, shape, or form.

U.M.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 18, 2008

Uncle Meat said:
May be, but if you're like most of us who change their oil religiously every 3000 miles the additional cost for Amsoil is not justified in any way, shape, or form.

U.M.

Differential

Uncle Meat · Mar 18, 2008

CobraRed_96_GT said:
Differential

Huh? Are you saying his statement about Amsoil only referred to their differential oil? Or the added cost is worth it when replacing the differential oil.

U.M.

streethorse · Mar 18, 2008

CobraRed_96_GT said:
Gotta pay to play. Not saying i disagree, but where was it proven?

IMO I guess, Ive tried every oil known to mankind over a long period of time,
and have gone back to conventional oil every 3K.

Notchbck93 · Mar 18, 2008

streethorse said:
IMO I guess, Ive tried every oil known to mankind over a long period of time,
and have gone back to conventional oil every 3K.

I was just like you with my first couple of trucks... Mobil one all the way... I would trade them in and no one cared what I ran in them.

I also read many topics that say as long as you do regular 3mo/3G oil changes you are golden no matter what dyno goo you run.

Syn is only worth it if you are going to extend the OCI's to 6 month 10G miles and of course confirm with a UOA. I see many guys taking penzoil platnium to 10G OCI's with spectacular results judging by their UOA.

CobraRed_96_GT · Mar 18, 2008

Uncle Meat said:
Huh? Are you saying his statement about Amsoil only referred to their differential oil? Or the added cost is worth it when replacing the differential oil.

U.M.

I'm just noting that with the differential it's well worth it due to the extended period of time its in use.

Made the switch to Royal Purple today...

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