Need Help ! Trick flow top end kit problems

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Thanks for reading my post I recently purchased a 93 lx 5.0 with a manual trans.

It was way to slow with basic bolt ons. So I decided to order from summit the trick flow top end kit (link below)

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=TFS-K514-360-350&autoview=sku

The mods the car already had when I bought it is a bbk cold air intake, 3.73 gear, short throw, bbk shorty headers, and full exhaust I think flow master.

The car ran perfect prior to the install of the top end kit along with this kit I put on a ford racing 30lb injecters, 73mm vortech mass air, with a 30lb sample tube, 70mm throttle body and egr, and a bbk 190 fuel pump/bbk fuel pressure regulator

The issues I am having

fuel pressure drops about 3 to 4 psi after car warms up with vac off or on
Checked for fuel leaks and changed pump same problem

On part throttle or crusing speeds 2500 rpm or less car feels like its missing or bucking
replaced plugs cap rotor cables still same problem

Car stalls sometimes on cold starts and on hott starts also idle with hunt every now and then.

Overall at WOT the car pulls hard and is smooth but my normal driving just doesn't feel right the bucking, surging of the idle, And stalling got me going nuts I have even paid for a dyno tuner to put in a sct chip that claimed it would fix all issues but just leaned it up and by far didn't fix the problem.

Anyone have any ideas ? This has been going on for two months. I just want to drive the car and enjoy it not throw money at it with no results. I tried alot of things to many to list but any new taughts or ideas would be a great help.

Thanks


Dyno results below 280 at the rear is before the chip 295 is after the tune pulls harder but still have problems listed above

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ShortThrow50

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Oct 22, 2006
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Car stalls sometimes on cold starts and on hott starts also idle with hunt every now and then.

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I installed the kit recently a well and have this issue i quoted you on above. That issue i was told, alot of people have after install. The only thing to fix that is for someone reputable to custom tune it. I had sort of the bucking issue when i had the cold air induction on but swppaed back to the stock airbox and fixed that. Other than that, i went with 24 pound injectors , maf calibrated, and a 190 pump. Did you set your base idle and tps?
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Yeah I have been hearing that the stock air box is better. The bbk cold air thats in my right fender messes with the air flow or something. This week its going to a good shop with a dyno to reset my idle and tps and go through alot of other things to locate the issue I seem to think that its my mass but don't know if it could be anything else or I just need a stock air box or this guy below

http://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/new_products/new-50.html
 

backfocus

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Sep 3, 2004
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Have you pulled codes? That is the first thing you need to do! I would also question the Mass air, is it more for a supercharged setup, I am not familiar with the votec Mass air. Could also be a vacuum leak, have you checked manifold vacuum?

Just some places to start!
 

cobradvm

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Sep 2, 2003
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First thing I would do before going back to the dyno is toss the C&L and get the PMAS you linked to above. These threads pop up quite frequently with guys running C&Ls. Also 30# injectors might be a little large for the combo - they might be contributing to some of your problems as well - I know Jay Allen thinks the 30 lbers are junk (but I run mine anyway in a 331 - for a 302/306, 24s might work better for idling etc
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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yeah I think I might ditch that c & l also I will pull codes to see what I get. The 30 lb injectors might be alittle big for that set up but I have near future plans for a 6 pound kit from vortec. Plus I figured the chip from sct would be able to lean out my idle and my whole rpm band which it did for sure on wot if you look at my air fuel on my dyno you can see how rich it was before.

Also what would you say is the quickest easiest way to check for vacum leaks ? I already sprayed starting fluid around the lines at idle to see if I get a surge but nothing.


P.s I had same issues with 19lb injectors which is why I went to 30lb thinking is was to lean but no luck
 

ShortThrow50

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Oct 22, 2006
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I forgot to mention that i have c & L as well. As soon as I free up some cash, im ditching it. Everyone told me to stay away from it due to the numerous problems of driveability but i bought it anyway.
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Well I will keep anyone interested posted on progress if the c & l was the cause this whole time I will be pissed


any one have taughts of he fuel pressure drop when it warms up
 

smallstang393

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Oct 18, 2004
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Why ditch the c&l when all you need to do is get a stock airbox the CAI are junk
and the stock airbox is a CAI I would see if a buddy had a stock box and try that before spending a bunch on a new meter . This will probly help a lot with your problems and not cost much. I ran a 393 with a C&L and it ran great (while it was FI) I had stock box tho. Many people have a problem with C&L but most are runing CAI and no stock box. Try stock box before you go back to get it tuned and also try clocking the mass air this sometimes helps.
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Yeah thats sounds like a good idea to me. I will try the stock air box tonight One question though since my chip is tuned with the bbk cold air intake I wonder if I put the stock air box on it will cause bigger problems or not. I guess I will find out
 

smallstang393

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Oct 18, 2004
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i wouldn't think it would cause problems because stock box is a cold air intake also and it just has better flow for the design for the C&L (dont forget to try clocking mass air in differant locations for better idle also
 

stangjunkie

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Nov 15, 2004
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WOW! almost the same setup as me... and i have the exact SAME PROBLEM i mean to the T i can't wait to see this get resolved please update when you do
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Ha thats funny

Yeah I will for sure let you know when I figure it out I am already over 1 grand in parts and labor with no luck I am putting on the stock air box tonight I have high hope for that also it going to a professional friday to go through everything and have it retuned if he can correct the problem
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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Picked a stock air box actually made it surge worse and stills bucks. Kinda sucks had high hopes it would fix the problem :bang:
 

jrichker

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Try clocking the MAF (rotating the MAF housing ) and see if that changes the symptoms. Sometimes uneven airflow will cause turbulence that upsets the MAF.

Dump the codes and see what the computer says is wrong…Codes may be present in the computer even if the Check Engine light isn’t on.

Here's the link to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great.
See http://www.troublecodes.net/Ford/





IF your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

Codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see http://www.actron.com/product_detail.php?pid=16153 for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is less than $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see http://www.midwayautosupply.com/p-7208-equus-digital-ford-code-reader-3145.aspx– It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.
 

93lxdm78

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Jun 19, 2007
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How do you rotate the mass it only goes in one way ? Also I tried to check codes but nothing everything checked out ok
 

backfocus

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Clocking the mass air refers to loosening the clamps and rotating it clockwise or counter-clockwise. Don't actually remove it just turn it while still attached. Do it in small steps let it set at idle and you will be able to tell if it has helped or hurt, if it hurts the idle trying going the other direction. Same process!
 

ShortThrow50

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Oct 22, 2006
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Clocking the mass air refers to loosening the clamps and rotating it clockwise or counter-clockwise. Don't actually remove it just turn it while still attached. Do it in small steps let it set at idle and you will be able to tell if it has helped or hurt, if it hurts the idle trying going the other direction. Same process!

Wouldnt tha require bending the bracket. Mines mounted pretty good