need some turbo help....

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

alright before any of you guys tell me to go to turbomustangs.com, or to use the search button, i spent about 3 hrs last nite, and about 2 hrs today researching DIY turbo setups...i talked to my dad last nite, and he thinks it would be a really fun project for us to work on, and we could do the whole thing for about $1500....

heres what i want to know.....what is the path of exhaust, and the path of intake....im going to use these pics from oink as reference....i understand the path of exhaust as i think i've made clear in these photoshops ive done....
View attachment 494985
View attachment 494987

what i don't get is once the exhaust goes through the flange on the turbo, the inpeller spins the gasses around and shoots them down the downpipe....but where does the intake come into place??? does it come outta the front of the turbo and go into the MAF and eventually the tb inlet?? like the pic below??
View attachment 494988

im sorry for all the questions but i've been trying to figure this out on my own, and its not really workin out too well....i figured a few of you guys could point me in the right direction....also if any of you have any pics showing your setup totally complete that shows everything pipe wise that'd be amazing....

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

Cold intake air - having already been drawn through the maf - goes INTO the impeller on the compressor side of the turbine (where you have your blue line above is where the impeller shaft from the exhaust side passes through to the compressor side which seems to be missing from that turbo); so the path is air filter to maf to inlet/impeller side of compressor. The compressor compresses it, and it comes out of the outlet scroll (same place the exhaust goes IN on the exhaust side of the housing), usually through a rectangular flange, into piping where it is routed either INTO the intercooler or directly to the throttle body if you're not intercooled.

Biggest challenge for DIY turbo set ups is proper sizing of the turbo, and management of heat. Be VERY careful.

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

Michael Yount said:
Cold intake air - having already been drawn through the maf - goes INTO the impeller on the compressor side of the turbine (where you have your blue line above); so the path is air filter to maf to inlet/impeller side of compressor. The compressor compresses it, and it comes out of the outlet scroll (same place the exhaust goes IN on the exhaust side of the housing), usually through a rectangular flange, into piping where it is routed either INTO the intercooler or directly to the throttle body if you're not intercooled.

Biggest challenge for DIY turbo set ups is proper sizing of the turbo, and management of heat. Be VERY careful.

thanks for the info michael....im still not 100% sure on exactly what you've explained.....i know its asking a lot, but if you could elaborate on my photoshops in anyway that would be awesome.....before i start planning out specific parts, i want to fully understand this....

EDIT: i think this pic clears it up a bit...

so are there 2 impellers inside the turbo, or one that forces gasses on either side.....??? i think oink's pics threw me off because he is missing half the turbo which im assuming is the compressor side?

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

...case you haven't noticed - part of the confusion is because the turbo in the picture is missing the compressor side completely.

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

Michael Yount said:
...case you haven't noticed - part of the confusion is because the turbo in the picture is missing the compressor side completely.

yea i just realized that....once i realized that i think i undestand now....gimme one min to photoshop a pic and i need you to tell me if its correct....thank you so much for helpin me out...

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

Pressurized fluid flow on the compressor side is essentially the opposite of the exhaust side. ON the exh. side, pressurized fluid (exhaust from the cylinders) hits the impeller (through the rectangular port) imparting it's energy to the turbo shaft which is connected to the compressor side. After it spins up the shaft (as high as 120,000 rpm), it leaves out the center of the impeller (round hole) and exits through the down pipe as you've shown it.

On the compressor side, atmospheric pressure air is DRAWN into the center of the impeller (through the round hole - center of impeller) and the impeller pressurizes it forcing it to the outer edges of the 'scroll' where it exits under pressure (5-15 psi in most street set ups) and goes ultimately to the throttle body. It may or may not pass through an intercooler first -- although I'd highly recommend you incorporate one into your design.

Boost pressure is usually controlled by monitoring pressure downstream of the impeller, and either bypassing exhaust around the turbo with a valve (internal bypass - waste gate) and/or with a blow off valve on the downstream side of the compressor which simply relieves the pressure to atmosphere. External BOV's usually aren't recommended with mass air systems because it's necessary to measure all the air entering the engine -- which you can't do on a draw-through system if you're venting some of it to atmosphere after it's been measured. Often the external BOV's are only used to vent excess pressure that builds up when the throttle is closed quickly.

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

View attachment 494980

hows that look??? if this is correct, then i also inderstand now how to incorporate an intercooler....i have seen many pics of them because its easy to take pics of the front end when the fron bumper if off, so you can see the path of those pipes pretty well....

J90GT · Dec 10, 2005

Simple.

Your Intercooler goes to your TB, your airfilter/intake goes to inlet on the turbo. the compressor housing for tthe turbo has something called "J" pipe that connects to the other end of the intercooler

J90GT · Dec 10, 2005

No that arrow on the inlet side of the turbo goes to your intercooler

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

Your graphic is correct -- except I'd like to see an intercooler between the compressor outlet and the t/b. And the tricks to making it work well are the boost control (waste gate and bov actuation and coordination), as well as how you tune it. For a really efficient system you can count on a chip/tweecer/pms to tune the system -- or convert to MegaSquirt as many do (user friendly speed density system).

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

J90GT said:
No that arrow on the inlet side of the turbo goes to your intercooler

****!!!!! not sure if i understand that....got a pic of a setup?

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

Michael Yount said:
Your graphic is correct -- except I'd like to see an intercooler between the compressor outlet and the t/b. And the tricks to making it work well are the boost control (waste gate and bov actuation and coordination), as well as how you tune it. For a really efficient system you can count on a chip/tweecer/pms to tune the system -- or convert to MegaSquirt as many do (user friendly speed density system).

i will be taking it to larocca's or wicked motorsports (both in nj) for a dyno tune....not looking to run more than 8 psi or so?? maybe around 350-375 hp?? this is my DD so i need it to be reliable....i wanna be able to drive it every day, and go to the track and crack off mid-low 12's

J90GT · Dec 10, 2005

hmmmm ok

where you have the blue line going up it would connect to the intercooler using a "J" pipe

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

J90GT said:
hmmmm ok

where you have the blue line going up it would connect to the intercooler using a "J" pipe

like this??
View attachment 494978

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

J90 - not all systems are intercooled...

stpro - most intercoolers are mounted low in the front of the car behind a bumper cover opening or air dam. So you can see that the piping involved is quite complex. It's usually relatively large piping (to reduce pressure drop) that runs from the outlet of the compressor, down low to the front of the car, and often over to the driver's side; and then with a cross flow cooler core it will exit the core low on the passenger side and come back up and to the throttle body -- often through the opening in the fenderwell where the stock airbox used to pull it's cold air.

J90GT · Dec 10, 2005

Correct, in a nice set up you would rotate the turbo so it would come off more to the left and go down to the intercooler, and you would have a long pipe coming from your TB with Blow off valve in the middle going down to your Intercooler

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

Daily driver, reliable, efficient, quick (low 12's) and cheap don't often go together. Good luck and have fun!

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

Michael Yount said:
Daily driver, reliable, efficient, quick (low 12's) and cheap don't often go together. Good luck and have fun!

haha yea i hear ya...maybe not even that much hp...if i could crack 12's i'd be happy which shouldnt be too difficult.....if i can cut maybe a 1.7-1.8 60' on dr's i'd need about 300-320 rwhp....im figuring with mostly used parts....the intake mani, maf, inj's, turbo, IC, piping, wastegate, clamps, and all the other parts it will prob cost me about 2k and about another 400-500 for the dyno tune.....

Michael Yount · Dec 10, 2005

Keep in mind, your 95 computer doesn't except changes nearly as well as a fox body unit would. In any event, there are plenty of cars out there that are solidly in the 12's with very mild head/intake/exhaust changes - stock cam. Lots of gear and plenty of traction are the key to quick times if that's what you're after. With the turbo, you'll get there with shear HP -- which will have some impact on drivability, efficiency and long term reliability.

Of course, if you just want to do a dyi turbo - have fun! But be prepared to do some design work -- if you're not really careful selecting components up front -- you could end up with a mismatched combo.

stprorolla49 · Dec 10, 2005

Michael Yount said:
Keep in mind, your 95 computer doesn't except changes nearly as well as a fox body unit would. In any event, there are plenty of cars out there that are solidly in the 12's with very mild head/intake/exhaust changes - stock cam. Lots of gear and plenty of traction are the key to quick times if that's what you're after. With the turbo, you'll get there with shear HP -- which will have some impact on drivability, efficiency and long term reliability.

Of course, if you just want to do a dyi turbo - have fun! But be prepared to do some design work -- if you're not really careful selecting components up front -- you could end up with a mismatched combo.

the more and more i think about it, i just want to reach the same amount of hp as with, say an s-trim, or the like at around 6-8 lbs.....they have been proven time and time again to be very consistant and great for a dd is tuned correctly....have i been misled, or would i be correct in saying that ive read that turbos are also decently reliable if a good tune is instituted??

on that note, do you have any suggestions on turbo size, and any things i mite wanna use in this setup....

need some turbo help....

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