New short throw shifter eliminate shifter rattling?

boostfrk · Apr 28, 2012

I've been looking around half heartedly at a new shifter for my '90 5.0. The MGW seems to have zero negative reviews, although it's less well known than a Pro 5.0 or Steeda Tr-Ax. They claim their shifter is the quietest on the market. Everyone talks about how easy it is to "hit third" with a short shifter, but this is a fun weekend car for me, not a track car at all. At most it sees some spirited driving around town, so I hate to drop $200 on a shifter...

I've been trying to track down a vibration/rattling/knocking from my shifter (stock) for several months now (see this thread -->http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...-shifter-lots-of-details.855074/#post-8610960). Is it possible that by replacing my shifter dampener bushing (who knows how old) and switching my stock shifter with 117,000 miles for a brand new MGW one would eliminate this problem?

The problem is most noticeable in second gear, low speeds (30mph or lower), when decelerating. It's speed dependant, not RPM dependant.

I thought about trying to drive it with the shifter handle removed (and just the stub sticking up) just around the neighborhood so I could elminate most of the shifter as the problem, but that wouldn't eliminate the shifter dampener bushing.

Thoughts?

2000xp8 · Apr 29, 2012

Why i'm not so sure it will elimate anything, i consider an aftermarket shifter on a fox more of a requirement than an option.

And if you are willing to take the time to pull out the console to change the bushing, sure as hell make sure you dump the stock shifter.

txstang84 · Apr 29, 2012

If the new shifter and bushing installation doesn't cure the vibration, you probably just have some weird harmonic in the output shaft or possibly worn bearings. And, at 117k miles, that wouldn't be much of a stretch to believe. The shifter would transmit vibrations from just about anywhere inside the tranny since the forks ride on the shift collars. If the mainshaft has any play, it'll make it's way back to the shifter.

All that being said, I've heard good things about the MGW...I had a B&M Ripper before I pulled my old powerplant...it was decent, but certainly not the best. I think I'd have bought the Steeda TriAx if I had it to do over.

boostfrk · Apr 29, 2012

txstang84 said:
If the new shifter and bushing installation doesn't cure the vibration, you probably just have some weird harmonic in the output shaft or possibly worn bearings. And, at 117k miles, that wouldn't be much of a stretch to believe. The shifter would transmit vibrations from just about anywhere inside the tranny since the forks ride on the shift collars. If the mainshaft has any play, it'll make it's way back to the shifter.

All that being said, I've heard good things about the MGW...I had a B&M Ripper before I pulled my old powerplant...it was decent, but certainly not the best. I think I'd have bought the Steeda TriAx if I had it to do over.

The T5 currently installed only has about 1,500 miles on it...

Jpizzle52 · Apr 29, 2012

I just installed my new MGW shifter last week so i could have have a solid short throw shifter. I think i have a little play in my output shaft and have always had some buzzing and vibration from my stock shifter that is gone after i installed the MGW. I know it didnt cure the issue but it stopped the noise because its not sloppy like the stocker. Do yourself a huge favor and buy the MGW. You will NOT be dissapointed!

Gearbanger 101 · Apr 30, 2012

The shifter itself isn't the "cause" of any vibration. It's vibration is a byproduct of another issue. Replacing the rubber damper isn't going to fix the issue, just mask it. No aftermarket shifter is going to have the vibration control the stocker does. That's not what they're designed for.

I saw your list of attempted fixes and you seem to have covered a lot of possible cause. One thing many people overlook are mounts and bushings. If your car has any sort of mileage on it at all, it's quite possible that your engine and/or trans mounts could be sacked. They'll separate and settle over the years, throwing your drive train geometry out of whack.

Another area to look at is cross member bushings. These can wear over time as well and become quite noticeable under acceleration and deceleration and they cause the trans to move around under and off load. Another issue many have (although mostly under hard acceleration) is control arms. The stock bushings even new do more for vibration control for normal driving than they do for maintaining suspension geometry. And the arms themselves are designed to be inexpensive...not accurate. A 20-yearl-old car, with some miles on it is going to have severely weakened control arm bushings and the springiness of the already weak stock control arms is going to be amplified.

The arms flex and bushings collapse and causes the pinion angle to distort. When this happens, it temporarily throws drive train alignment out of whack and can cause all sorts of issues. Drive train vibration being one of them.

Those are some other area's I would first look into before throwing money at a shifter. Not that a good shifter shouldn't be mandatory for these cars....but it won't fix your problem.

You also stated that the T5 was rebuilt. Was it completely rebuilt, or just partially. The tail shaft bushings will wear over time...especially with excess vibration, which will amplify any vibration source you've got. That's one of the first area's that should be looked at when trying to track down drive train vibration.

boostfrk · Apr 30, 2012

Thanks for the feedback Gearbanger, that's exactly what I am looking for. Someone to bounce ideas off of and try to source this problem.

I understand a new shifter won't cure the problem, as the shifter isn't the problem. My thought was perhaps a worn shifter with 117k miles may allow the transmission of more vibrations, and therefore a perception that something else is wrong when maybe it's not (or maybe it is). This is a 22 year old car; maybe it just has some vibrations and rattles with it I'll have to get used to.

The PO told me that the engine mounts were replaced about 10k miles ago, but I'll take another look at them just to verify they appear to be OK. I didn't mention the bushings/suspension stuff I've replaced, but I'm glad you brought that up.

I've replaced:

-Rear upper and lower control arms with UPR chrome-moly kit
- Bushings in rear differential that UCA's mount to
- Transmission mount

I haven't replaced the cross member or the cross member bushings. I had thought about this the other day so I looked at them and there is some slight cracking, although they don't appear completely shot or falling apart. Can just the bushings be replaced, or does the entire cross member have to be replaced with new bushings?

To my knowledge the T5 was a complete overhaul and completely re-built, but I've wondered about the tailshaft bushing myself. I'll verify tomorrow with the guy that re-built it and edit this post to update.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Gearbanger 101 · Apr 30, 2012

Also make note....not all engine mounts are created equal. Certain year and style vehicles had different height engine mounts. Convertibles got the lower profile mounts than hard tops. Aftermarket mounts like Prothane tend to sit higher than stock. Energy Suspension mounts on the other hand seem to sit the same height. Eurathane mounts like the two I just mentioned above will transfer more engine and drivetrain vibration through the transmission than the stock rubber ones. So check to see if that's what he replaced the original ones with. In which case...there's not a lot you can do about it.

boostfrk · May 1, 2012

Gearbanger 101 said:
Also make note....not all engine mounts are created equal. Certain year and style vehicles had different height engine mounts. Convertibles got the lower profile mounts than hard tops. Aftermarket mounts like Prothane tend to sit higher than stock. Energy Suspension mounts on the other hand seem to sit the same height. Eurathane mounts like the two I just mentioned above will transfer more engine and drivetrain vibration through the transmission than the stock rubber ones. So check to see if that's what he replaced the original ones with. In which case...there's not a lot you can do about it.

Checked out the motor mounts last night while I was under the car. They appear to be in really good shape. I remember the PO mentioning they were the convertible mounts; he said they were stiffer than the regular hardtop mounts. That being said, he said a lot of things that aren't true so who knows.

I also talked to the guy that rebuilt the T5. All bearings and bushings were brand new; it was a complete rebuild. So, seems like I can rule out the transmission.

Oddly enough he asked me if I had replaced the shifter. He said he had a Pro 5.0 that rattled a lot and as soon as he installed a Tri-Ax it went away.

Gearbanger 101 · May 2, 2012

I've got a Tri-Ax in mine and I’ve still got a measurable amount in mine. If someone is getting vibration with one aftermarket shifter over another, it's most likely because they haven't got the shift stops adjusted properly. If the stops are adjusted too close to the fulcrum lever, it'll rattle against it....and it'll really make a lot of noise under hard acceleration.

boostfrk · May 15, 2012

SOOOO, I just finished replacing various parts on the car. Namely the rear drums and shoes along with a new hardware kit. I also replaced the rear axle bearings while I had everything apart back there.

I've only driven it about 5 miles, but the problem appears to be gone. There is still some slight noise from the T5, but then again these weren't known for being the quietest transmissions. I don't know if the rear shoes were dragging and therefore transmitting a vibration all the way back to the shifter (I did have one self adjusting cable broken) or if the axle bearings were on their way out. They didn't look in bad shape, and didn't really make any noise when spun, but things act differently when under load.

Gearbanger, thanks for bouncing ideas around with me.

Gearbanger 101 · May 15, 2012

Glad you got it figured out. Sometimes, its a combination of a lot of little things with these cars, rather than just one big thing to pinpoint. Driveline vibration can be nasty to diagnose.

Taino · May 27, 2012

Strangest thing happened to me, Solenoid went bad, fried my starter. Replaced both, Solenoid is right one of the anchors for the strut tower brace., Noticed bolts for brace looked loose and while at it I tightened the nuts n bolts on brace. Installed it some 6 yrs ago and never bothered to check and make sure it was all tightened down after. To my surprise the vibration on gear shifter is way, way less than before ????? I'll won't question the added benefit, Under load specially in 3rd gear it used to rattle but now it just a slight vibration.

Sharad · May 29, 2012

boostfrk said:
I've been looking around half heartedly at a new shifter for my '90 5.0. The MGW seems to have zero negative reviews, although it's less well known than a Pro 5.0 or Steeda Tr-Ax. They claim their shifter is the quietest on the market. Everyone talks about how easy it is to "hit third" with a short shifter, but this is a fun weekend car for me, not a track car at all. At most it sees some spirited driving around town, so I hate to drop $200 on a shifter...

I've been trying to track down a vibration/rattling/knocking from my shifter (stock) for several months now (see this thread -->http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...-shifter-lots-of-details.855074/#post-8610960). Is it possible that by replacing my shifter dampener bushing (who knows how old) and switching my stock shifter with 117,000 miles for a brand new MGW one would eliminate this problem?

The problem is most noticeable in second gear, low speeds (30mph or lower), when decelerating. It's speed dependant, not RPM dependant.

I thought about trying to drive it with the shifter handle removed (and just the stub sticking up) just around the neighborhood so I could elminate most of the shifter as the problem, but that wouldn't eliminate the shifter dampener bushing.

Thoughts?

Happy to hear that you found the problem.

Fwiw, you can buy a top notch Made in America & Lifetime Guaranteed shifter for $135. If money's tight, you don't have to drop $200 on a good shifter.

That said, whichever shifter you choose will transmit a little more sound & vibration from the drivetrain (compared to the crappy stock shifter) but it's totally worth it!!

New short throw shifter eliminate shifter rattling?

boostfrk

2000xp8

txstang84

boostfrk

Jpizzle52

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Gearbanger 101

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boostfrk

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boostfrk

Gearbanger 101

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boostfrk

Gearbanger 101

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Taino

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Sharad

ALWAYS choose the V over the P!!! Wait... what?

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New short throw shifter eliminate shifter rattling?

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