Oh Boy, Another H/C/I Thread!

[SeventyMach1]

Doing a little research, I haven't seen anyone really speak of AFM's top end kit. The question here is .... what would you do? I know there are people here alot smarter than me on this stuff, so I figured I'd see what choice the majority of YOU would make. Please, explain why you'd choose 1 over the other.

The package .....

What they include: TFS heads, Typhoon intake, AFM N-41 cam, ARP head bolts, polished VC's, all gaskets, PRW rocker arms, TFS pushrods, and FRPP timing chain set. This = $2,299.00

A more important question is: does anyone know how my computer will react to th N-41? Are there any 94-95 computered cars running this cam? Maybe this post is worthless & this cam will not work well with my car, lol.





Now for the other choice. The tried & true TFS top end package. We all know what that includes. Track Heat package = $2,249.95 @ Summit.

 

[bimmertech]

i think slow5.0---ernan---has the n41.

i would do the trick flow kit, for $50 less you get a better intake mani. i would opt for the track heat kit and a good harmonic balancer.

 

[Blackened302]

won't a twEECer take care of the tuning issues?

 

[final5-0]

Justin

If I told you that combo is gonna drive your pcm nuts

What would be your reply

If I told you that combo is gonna drive your pcm 50% nuts

What would be your reply

Will that tried & true TFS combo drive your pcm nuts

My reason for this post is to ask about your pcm concerns
simply because
Most h/c/i combos that make decent power hose the pcm

If after you build the combo, drivability gremlins rear their ugly head, are you prepared to deal with them

Grady

 

[Guero]

TFS Kit with B-31 cam. Cuz i love it!!!! ANd gives you higher rpm power and shift at 6000 rpm and make power to. I belive slow5.o has the B-31

 

[SeventyMach1]

Good point Grady. So I wonder .....


Is there ENOUGH difference in performance to justify a puter swap?

If only I knew what the potential of that combo was, I could answer that myself.

 

[Pokageek]

No. NO NEED FOR PUTER SWAPS. oopS CAPS SORRY. Tweecer or good tune will do fine. Yes on the track heat!! and TFS.

 

[SeventyMach1]

No. NO NEED FOR PUTER SWAPS. oopS CAPS SORRY. Tweecer or good tune will do fine. Yes on the track heat!! and TFS.

Initially, there will be a dyno tune .... no Tweecer.

But if I did have one .... then I could use the AFM stuff & not have a problem, right? So what is your reasoning for taking the TFS stuff?

 

[BlackVert]

PRW rockers? never heard of them

 

[SeventyMach1]

PRW rockers? never heard of them

Not really sure if it's Performance Racing Warehouse or not .... but if so .... I have purchased their stuff before & was happy.

 

[Pokageek]

Well three reasons and one is bias because I already have it and think it rocks. #2 Because I like the looks of it better personally under the hood and #3 Because after doing a search it was the highest HP rated combo I could find and very popular. I found one guy rated at 317rwhp on a 302 or 306, I forget. I wasn't thinking of cost though. As to the track or street heat.. I have had them both. I went with street heat initially and it did well but with the rest of my combo I felt like I was running out of top end (3.90 gears and all). So after switching to track heat, it made a well noticeable difference in top end punch past 5000 rpm. I gained 20 HP. I am now at 290+rwhp WITH cats and not aggressive cam. I made the right choice in my o.

 

[final5-0]

I don't know anything about that kit from AFM

On the other hand

Does anybody think there could really be all that much difference between them

Justin, you said ..........

Is there ENOUGH difference in performance to justify a puter swap?

It is my belief if you wanna reach 300 to 325rwhp with a stock oem block na combo you'll need a tune which can be done by you or a Pro.

To go out and gather up a bunch of aftermarket parts and hope to reach that level of performance without optimizing the pcm would be next to impossible.

I should say when I use the word ... tune ... I mean not only the rwhp level we speak about here but a combo that does not stall, buck, surge, or produce any other drivability issues.

As for the justification of a tune

I still believe with very good parts selection and a very sharp tune you could reach 350rwhp with an oem stock block na combo. The drivability might suffer by a very small amount with the most likely noticable part being a bit higher idle rpm.

Could you do that without a tune ... I don't think so!

Another thing I noticed ...........

You are not gonna get by with the stock inj's, fuel pump, and maf with those kits

Grady

 

[Guero]

hmmm 20 hp again with a track heat.... im intreged to change mine now!

 

[SeventyMach1]

You are not gonna get by with the stock inj's, fuel pump, and maf with those kits

I already have those on the list ....

Intake spacer - ???
VC oil spout/cap (if using TFS stuff)
Elbow adapter - ???
Fuel Pump - Walbro 255
Injectors - FRPP 30's
Throttle body - (needed?)
Balancer - PP or Romac
Lifters ???
MAF - PMAS 80
Tune - Tru Dyno Sports


I was already leaning toward the TFS. Probably will settle with that. Feel free to gander at the list above & throw anything in that is needed if something comes to mind. And the one's with ???'s are up in the air, too.


BTW, I would take drivability over a few extra HP anyday.

 

[Guero]

Im having my car dynoed an Saturday morning just for you. Wanna split the cost?? Member im doing it just for you

 

[Pokageek]

I don't know anything about that kit from AFM

On the other hand

Does anybody think there could really be all that much difference between them

Justin, you said ..........

Is there ENOUGH difference in performance to justify a puter swap?

It is my belief if you wanna reach 300 to 325rwhp with a stock oem block na combo you'll need a tune which can be done by you or a Pro.

To go out and gather up a bunch of aftermarket parts and hope to reach that level of performance without optimizing the pcm would be next to impossible.

I should say when I use the word ... tune ... I mean not only the rwhp level we speak about here but a combo that does not stall, buck, surge, or produce any other drivability issues.

As for the justification of a tune

I still believe with very good parts selection and a very sharp tune you could reach 350rwhp with an oem stock block na combo. The drivability might suffer by a very small amount with the most likely noticable part being a bit higher idle rpm.

Could you do that without a tune ... I don't think so!

Another thing I noticed ...........

You are not gonna get by with the stock inj's, fuel pump, and maf with those kits

Grady

:Word:

 

[final5-0]

I already have those on the list ....

Intake spacer - ???
VC oil spout/cap (if using TFS stuff)
Elbow adapter - ???
Fuel Pump - Walbro 255
Injectors - FRPP 30's
Throttle body - (needed?)
Balancer - PP or Romac
Lifters ???
MAF - PMAS 80
Tune - Tru Dyno Sports


I was already leaning toward the TFS. Probably will settle with that. Feel free to gander at the list above & throw anything in that is needed if something comes to mind. And the one's with ???'s are up in the air, too.

Elbow ... go with the TFS as it is better than the Edel

HB ... I like my SFI PP because the install is a no hassle kinda deal as opposed to Romac. You also don't need any spacers with the PP.

TB ... if money gets tight, you could definitely do it later

Lifters ... depends how many miles are on them

BTW, I would take drivability over a few extra HP anyday.

Again ... Let the tune take of drivability

If you use parts to deal with it ... Even the best Pro Tuner there is can't extract more power from wimpy parts.

btw ... I'm really curious about the AFM combo ...............
Anybody seen dyno results from those parts?

Grady

 

[OrangeMustangGt]

Whell, i wouldent consider that kit because it has proform rockers and felpro gaskets.

I mean sure you could buy other brands and sell them, but its a pita.

get crane roller rockers and felpro MLS gaskets.....that way you will never have to dissasembe if you add notrous or boost.

 

[BlackVert]

i have heard of 2 peeps who have broken pro-form rockers.

or you can get the heads o-ringed and use fel-pro 1106 (loc wire) gasgets. if you are going to boost it, that is what i would do.

lifters wear with the cam, so if you are getting a new cam, i'd get new lifters. run of the mill lifters from summit are about $100

un-tuned, it will not behave as nicely with either cam. i'd say allocate enough $$$ to get it tuned.

i have some stuff from my aborted 331 buildup you might be interested in:

- bbk 70mm t/b i'm not going to use. $75 shipped
- polished 70mm elbow. $50 shipped
- polished typhoon intake (also 70mm). $325 shipped
- jet-hot coated MAC long tubes. $350 shipped
- o-ringed and ported windsor senior heads. $600 shipped
- thumper ported e7s. $500 shipped
- polished 1.8L kenne-bell. $1850 shipped. it comes with 2 tunes for different setups.

 

[ProKiller]

Elbow ... go with the TFS as it is better than the Edel

grady, what's your justification on this?


I think i would go with the TFS kit. the AFM kit doesn't seem like it will be that efficient. Plus I'm pretty sure it's built for a fox, so you might have increased issues.