ohhh the humanity

93-2.3 · May 17, 2004

just felt like sharing a story i find it funny it involves a 2.3 mustang (mine) and my buddys 85 camaro with a 305 and 5 speed to make a long story short his car is realy slow only beat me by like a fender length lol. i know my car aint that fast to be running with v8 cars but anyway i just found it funny that the camaro is that slow

QangMartoq · May 17, 2004

lol....

And now you see why even when the Camaro and Firebird were being made, the Mustang still outsold them.. By 2 to 1, combined!

The Mustang is just a better quality car, even though it's cheaper than comparable domestic cars.

And go figure, the 2.3L Fox-body Mustang is based on the Ranger engine/drivetrain (nearly identical, in fact) and by coincidence, Ford has has the best selling truck in America for over 25 years.

Food for thought

I'm proud to have a Ford tag on my keychain

Bearded Forever · May 17, 2004

QangMartoq said:
And go figure, the 2.3L Fox-body Mustang is based on the Pinto engine/drivetrain (nearly identical, in fact)

nomuffler · May 17, 2004

305s are ****ty, so are ill maitained cars.

Oh, and mustangs outsold camaros because they're more civilized. Camaro interiors suck, they ride harsh (and handle good), they're hard to see out of, and they scrape steep driveways. IMIO

mr_woodster · May 17, 2004

not to mention minimal mullet length qualification that chevy inacted in the 80's.

kiddiccarus · May 17, 2004

Hmm my friend had a 1986 camaro and the only thing that did not fall apart on the interior was the floor board and that was rusting out. Michigan Car, but the interior plain fell off, the doors, the dash the guages, It was a P.O.S. car.

93-2.3 · May 17, 2004

ha ha its all true camaros are crappy and i hate how the floor is like even with the seat feels like your sitting in a beach chair altho my mustang II is the same way but the II has "style"

kiddiccarus · May 17, 2004

I did like the seats in the car though pretty compfortable.

Pro-Hawk · May 17, 2004

The 2.3L stangs was made to get people from point a to point b and to made over all emessions on the GTs look good. They was to do this and yet be bullitt proof which people like me loved. With that in mind they had the loyalty of the American people behind them who loved Ford and wanted a sports car but not really needing all that power of a V8. That is basicaly how they out sold carmaros. I think Chevy was just saving money by using the old 305/307 motors instead of making smaller ones for fuel economy and over all savings by useing crap in there cars. They did make some V6s which really sux butt also and they used them up tell 1992 I think. Now even though mustangs ruled the 80's stock vs stock...its still way easier and cheaper to Hotrod a Chevy than a Ford. It was so simple to get a hold of some camel hump heads and a four barrel mainifolds it wasn't funny. Ford had almost zero in heads that was even worth talking about and to find a SBF four barrel stock mainifold was like finding water in the desert. The really cool thing is how you could interchange parts to get even more power while Ford could not. 400sbc crank + 350sbc block= 383...350sbc crank + 400sbc = 377.

kiddiccarus · May 18, 2004

All in all Chevy droped Camaro and Ford made a New Mustang. Funny how things work out.

Cougar · May 18, 2004

305's are slow. I OWNED my dad's 67 nova with a 305

rbohm · May 18, 2004

Pro-Hawk said:
The really cool thing is how you could interchange parts to get even more power while Ford could not. 400sbc crank + 350sbc block= 383...350sbc crank + 400sbc = 377.

yea, i guess that 400 ford crank in a 351w block just doesnt work and the few mods needed to put 351c 2v heads on windsor blocks were just unavailable and the fact that even with the lousy heads fords could still run circles arounds chevy's of the day

Pro-Hawk · May 18, 2004

rbohm said:
yea, i guess that 400 ford crank in a 351w block just doesnt work and the few mods needed to put 351c 2v heads on windsor blocks were just unavailable and the fact that even with the lousy heads fords could still run circles arounds chevy's of the day

Jesus Christ a few mods to put a 351 2c heads on a 351W !!! Man have you even seen a Ford intake mainifold to allow Clevland heads on a Windsor block? A factory mainifold like that has to be work more than what I payed for my SVO alone !! Someone would have to be a dumb ass for even wanting to use that mainifold in a car other than what it came factory came in. Now that car wasn't even made in the 80's nor would someone want to part it out to put in a pice of crap Fox mustang so lets get back to the right decade. Also this 400 crank in a 351w now is this a aftermarket crank? I'm no expert but last I heard a 400 is nothing more than a nick name for a 351M. I'm talking J/Y parts not parts out of a JEGS book.

Futher more I just got through saying Fords during the 80's did dominate Chevy if you would stop and read for a miniute Its almost a fact that Ford aftermarket parts for motors like the 302 didn't start showing up until the late 80's early 90's and that includes Ford strocker kits. The best thing we could do with our 5.0 stangs back in the day was to replace the 5.0L with a 351w or bolt on a bottle. The biggest reason Ford out sold Chevy was the Good will they had then and today with the American people. Now why Chevy is canning the Camaros is in my opinion because the Big three was ran by dumb butts. The sports car seen has slowly lost ground to the ricers over the last 15 years and now it maybe to late for them to recover. They all tryed it and failed but when they had the chance to get it going again they screwed up and stuck with the normal models. I really don't think the mustang will last much longer even with the good will Ford has. Heck I worked for Ford for 3 years and mustang sells was at a all time low. Now they only carry a few at a time so they don't get stuck with them.

P.s Try getting about 10 Camaros from 1993-2004 and running them againist 1993-2004 GTs and see who runs what around who?
**stock NONE S.S. or Cobras**

nomuffler · May 18, 2004

Pro-Hawk said:
I think Chevy was just saving money by using the old 305/307 motors instead of making smaller ones for fuel economy and over all savings by useing crap in there cars.

How were they saving money this way? The 305 was the smaller V8 used for fuel economy. They did have 4-cyl camaros to, they were just as slow and efficent as the 4-cyl stang.

nomuffler · May 18, 2004

rbohm said:
and the fact that even with the lousy heads fords could still run circles arounds chevy's of the day

Maybe a straight line, but not circles. The camaro would out handle the mustang with it's torque arm/pahnard bar rear suspenion. I'm not saying this just because I have a camaro, mine is after all completely diferent than the one we're talking about. As far as I'm concerned a cool car is a cool car, it can even be a puegot if it's cool enough.

Pro-Hawk · May 18, 2004

nomuffler said:
How were they saving money this way? The 305 was the smaller V8 used for fuel economy. They did have 4-cyl camaros to, they were just as slow and efficent as the 4-cyl stang.

Noticed how I said, "I think"

I just know about the 2.8L V6 and don't know anything about a 4cl. We are talking about 80's Camaros right? I'm guessing what I'm talking about is production/testing cost not fuel economy. I know there was a fuel deal going on back then that is why most of the sports cars and full size trucks came with 5.0L engines compared to now days. I'm thinking since all SBC Chevys use basicaly the same alt brackets etc that it would save money making new ones to fit a different motor into the car. The same goes for the motor mounts etc.They both had the ecnonomy option Ford with its 2.3L(T) and Chevy with its 2.8L. Then they both had a 5.0L motor so to me it is a hair cheaper to continue doing this instead of changing up half a dozen plants or some crap like that. Again its just what I think and my opinion only.

GASCOOB · May 19, 2004

there is a company that makes cast alum. itakes for a clevor motor. they have single and dual plane intakes for 8.2 & 9.5 deck height blocks even make a 2-barrel version for sportsman circletrack think they have an iron version kinda pricey starts at about 350.00 for alum.and up for iron

Pro-Hawk · May 19, 2004

GASCOOB said:
there is a company that makes cast alum. itakes for a clevor motor. they have single and dual plane intakes for 8.2 & 9.5 deck height blocks even make a 2-barrel version for sportsman circletrack think they have an iron version kinda pricey starts at about 350.00 for alum.and up for iron

I'm a bit lost I'm guessing your talking about a aftermarket intake? Also are you talking about a intake to mount a set of clevland heads on a 351W block? If so I'm sure they would want more than 350.00 for it. That is probly just for your typical clevland set up. I heard once that someone was going to start making a aftermarket version of the BOSS 302 intake but I forget how much and it was in the 90's I think. See you just can't bolt a set of Clev heads on a 351w and use a stock clevland intake, they pass water differently than one another. What I'm getting at is the fact that you could build some cool SBC motors using J/Y parts and pretty cheap compared to SMFs. Heck Chevy made cast aluminum four barrel intakes stock starting in the 80's. Also there wasn't much offered in the way of aftermarket parts for SBFs during the 80's compared to the SBCs. In my opinion they are trully good companies and I would buy from either one. If I was going to buy a car today to HotRod out I would probly buy a GT since they are pretty easy to work on compared to a Camaro

GASCOOB · May 19, 2004

the company isBush Performance in Michigin can't find a site for them had a price sheet for them at one time. the most expesive alum. one was 9.5 deck 4V intake about 500.00 seems like. got there phone #. 501 646 9108

Pro-Hawk · May 19, 2004

GASCOOB said:
the company isBush Performance in Michigin can't find a site for them had a price sheet for them at one time. the most expesive alum. one was 9.5 deck 4V intake about 500.00 seems like. got there phone #. 501 646 9108

See why I said its a little cheaper for a Chevy

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