Over the Top Question

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

from me, i just want to do it. I have to see this through. Im expecting decent reliability as well.

Hack · Jan 20, 2006

shlby123 said:
from me, i just want to do it. I have to see this through. Im expecting decent reliability as well.

At a given power level, the fewer cubes your engine has the less reliable it will be. Well, I guess that's not exactly right, what I should say is this:

At a given power level, the fewer cubes your engine has, the shorter its lifespan will be.

For instance, many drag racers have to tear their engine apart after one quarter mile. You get the idea.

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

right right. So given a setup With a 2.3 pushing 250-270HP..How long before some sort of major maintenance would probably be required?

krash kendall · Jan 20, 2006

We had a 2.3 normally aspirated go over 300,000 KM. It was burning 1 litre of oil for every tank of gas at that point. I haven't seen a stock turbo 2.3 go near that far without the motor getting really rattly and tired. I really don't think that platform's bottom end was meant to withstand the kind of power you're envisioning for a long duration.

chepsk8 · Jan 20, 2006

Other 2.3 sources:

Pinto, Ranger PU

I remember seing that some decent power can be had from a 2.3 built right. I say do it, why not?

krash kendall · Jan 20, 2006

Just to put a bit of perspective on this, the link below shows what Carrol Shelby did with four cylinders. This goes why back and I don't know if many will remember when this originally came out (21 years ago now). I learned to drive in an '82(?) Omni not long after this. If I recall it was a 1.8 or 2.2 litre.

http://www.xmission.com/~dempsey/shelby/sheldod3.htm

The picture was from a magazine (can't remember which one) that ran a GT 350 against the hatchback. The latter had better times in some events.

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

lol, the plot thickens! I certainly would be doing a lot of research and work into making a much more durable and reliable engine...And i do appreciate the support immensel

Does Anybody know how much work ( money wise) would have to go into building a Turbo'd 2.3 to run about 150K before a major maintenance?

krash kendall · Jan 20, 2006

I have to ask, do you know how long it takes to get to 150,000 miles? The figure I gave of 300,000 was in kilometres (KM) which is just over 185,000 miles. That's a hard number for any motor to go without some sort of major maintenance. It could take up to six years to go that far. With mods to get 250-270 HP (that Shelby only had 175 HP), I think a year without repair would be a stretch.

triostang · Jan 20, 2006

as much of a project as this seems, i still find it a bit offensive, ease my pain please by saying you will put in a v8 in it 7 years from now

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

how is it offensive, that Im taking an I6 out of a relatively worthless (save sentimental) value, and taking another Ford engine and putting it in there?

If even I built up the bottom end of the car, and it only lasted a year or a little more regardless of mileage, I'd have to scrap the project. That's too soon for me.

triostang · Jan 20, 2006

4 banger classic mustang, nuff said

mustangdave · Jan 20, 2006

I don't like this idea but you are entitled to do whatever you want. As far as costs go, you are contradicting yourself. First you said you want to use mostly used parts and then you want it to last 150,000 miles. Its got to be one or the other...no used turbod engine is gonna run for 150,000 miles considering its probably already got that many miles on it. Turbos are not expected to last that long, let alone a turboed engine. All used parts, your own labor and fabbing, you might do it for a couple of grand. New parts that will go 150,000 miles...maybe $10,000.

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

Well, i can understand your hardline stance. I used to be like this, but overall it could be a lot worse.

mustangdave · Jan 20, 2006

I didn't mean to be negative; I'll help you anyway I can and look forward to seeing pics of your progress. I just want to make sure you know that used parts are not going to last long before requiring maintenance after all of your hard work.

shlby123 · Jan 20, 2006

How do you feel about the Modded I6 route as far as reliability and overall cost to complete the project then? Any better off?

mustangdave · Jan 20, 2006

There are more parts for them now. I had one when there was nothing but headers. It would be unusual to see one modded and they are very reliable(200 six). Costwise, I think you would be best with this route. To save even more, you can start out with the head/cam/etc... carbed, and then later go to fuel injection for mileage . Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever seen an I-6 f.i.

mustangdave · Jan 20, 2006

Just another thought. If you start out with a carb. so you can still drive it and switch to f.i. later, you could probably have the old intake modded for injectors to use a modern f.i. setup.

65ShelbyClone · Jan 20, 2006

200,000mi isnt a problem for most modern engines, even the turbo kind. The Fox3 and SN95 crowd will tell you that 5.0s easily go that far with little trouble. A few of them even boost those high mileage engines.

I havent done any actual calculations, but I would expect a project like this to be in the $1500-3000 range. A decent running TurboCoupe, SVO, or XR4Ti engine/trans pullout should be 1000 or less. Its a big bonus if you can get the harnesses and computer included. You'll need the T5 crossmember and either a cable clutch conversion, hydraulic conversion, or the right bell/fork to use the stock linkage(you want a manual, right?). Then modify the fuel system for EFI. If you could get the whole donor car it would be alot easier. The rear end is popular with Fox3s because its a disc brake 8.8 with either 3.55s or 3.73s. Drivable TurboCoupes I've seen are $1500+. Even with a stock 2.3T, a '65-66 should be faster than a premium fuel 289.

I plan on doing something similar with Pinto in the next year or so.

gonzothegreat · Jan 20, 2006

shlby123 said:
What is the difficulty range of Placing Say a small 4 cylinder motor & transmission from a newer escort and transplanting it into say a 64-66 mustang?

Would you like to be the laughing stock of all shows.

rbohm · Jan 20, 2006

shlby123 said:
How do you feel about the Modded I6 route as far as reliability and overall cost to complete the project then? Any better off?

you could follow my build up that i have planned for my falcon;

1: 250 block from a 69 mustang.

2: ultimately a new aluminum head from fordsixparts.com

3: a T03/T04 hybrid turbo pushing 10-15 psi boost

4: cam from fordsixparts.com with 112 degree lobe centers

5: C4 trans from a 69 mustang(V8)

this combo should be good for around 300hp, and since the motor pretty much needs a nuclear warhead to kill it, it should last quite sometime(diesel like longevity, you want 150k miles, wont hurt the motor, in fact it will just be getting broken in). as far as fuel economy goes, if i keep my foot off the loud pedal, it should do very well, around 22-23 in town, and around 30 on the road with a 3.25 rear gear.

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My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

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My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

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My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

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My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

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My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

My rearend needs a stud and two nuts.

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