Overheating Very Quickly

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

Yeah that all works. You can soak the rockers in oil for safe keeping our solvent for cleaning first. Those ARP studs should be hand tight in the block so after you remove nuts, if you have clearance issues getting heads off with studs then you might be able to unscrew the studs before hand.

There are lots of threads on what you need to do. I highly suggest reading the sticky threads here on it BEFORE you go any further. You will be better off knowing what to expect as you go through it. There really isn't that much to it but having the knowledge before you start will make the job much easier and more successful.

m3x1c0 · Jun 11, 2015

stang89bidges said:
Yeah that all works. You can soak the rockers in oil for safe keeping our solvent for cleaning first. Those ARP studs should be hand tight in the block so after you remove nuts, if you have clearance issues getting heads off with studs then you might be able to unscrew the studs before hand.

There are lots of threads on what you need to do. I highly suggest reading the sticky threads here on it BEFORE you go any further. You will be better off knowing what to expect as you go through it. There really isn't that much to it but having the knowledge before you start will make the job much easier and more successful.

Im looking at this thread
'87-'95 Heads, Cam, Intake Install | Mustang Forums at StangNet

It says to leave the rockers on and let the pushrods just fall. It also says to remove the heads with the headers! That sounds like a great way to ruin a pushrod am I right?

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

Not if you don't drop them ;-)

Here are some tips to research on that bit. You have aftermarket roller rockers. Research them to find out how they work. Great info on comp Cams website. You can leave them on but putting the heads back on without a friend will be near impossible. Plus if you have your heads checked out at a machine shop for straightness (highly recommend) they gotta come off anyways. Only reason to leave them on is if your just doing a quick job and putting them right back on again. This keeps your valve lash from having to be redone. Maybe.

I would take the rockers off first. Remove pushrods. Then remove heads.

If you read through all this material and don't feel comfortable getting into all this you may want to grab someone who can help or take it somewhere. It ain't for the faint of heart. Most of us(not the mechanics on here) learned the hard way, spent twice as much money cuz we didn't know what we were doing, and took twice as long as it should have... But this is all part of DIY right.

If you do decide to tackle this project however, we are all here for you to help where we can. And don't expect it to be a quick job on your first time. Like I said before, research, research, research, then research that research. Measure twice, cut once.

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

And I highly doubt you can get the heads off with headers installed. Especially with ARP studs. You got shorties or long tubes? Definitely won't work with long tubes.

m3x1c0 · Jun 11, 2015

I'm not in a particular rush other than not wanting to take advantage of the hospitality my buddy has shown in letting me use his garage. Ideally I don't want this to take more then another week. Still, no reason to just slap it together. I definitely will be sending the heads off to be checked if I'm going to go this far.

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

Do you know if those heads have already been milled or not? Blueprinting heads is very important so you don't have P2V(Piston to Valve) clearance issues when you bolt them back on. If not, any way to contact the PO and find out would be very helpful.

m3x1c0 · Jun 11, 2015

Im not sure and the PO didnt know much either. It was built before he got it. I'd imagine if they were smacking I'll see it right away and I'll have a lot more to deal with! Assuming they check out, dont need to be milled and I can just put new gaskets and everything back together: My biggest concern will be setting the valve lash. Never done that before. Here Is a thread I found from a 5.0 forum about that topic:
How to adjust lifters per Morel: - Hardcore 5.0 - The Hardcore Ford Drag Racers Forum

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

There are a lot of methods to setting valve lash out there. They are all pretty close to doing it the same out there. I just finished doing mine. We have similar roller rockers if not the same.

This step in your article didn't work for me.
3. Adjust the rocker until the push rod just starts to get tight while taking the pushrod and rolling it between your thumb and finger. Once you feel drag, this is what we call "zero-lash".

What I found was that I lubed the rocker, the lifter, the pushrod, and found that everything was TOO lubed I guess because I didn't feel much resistance of the push rods until it was too far. So. I ended up using a different method.

I tightened the rocker down slowly until the roller tip of the rocker(top the valve) had no more 'up and down' play in it. You have to be careful with hydraulic lifters because they have a spring in them that you can easily compress by hand(lifting up on the end of the rocker to check for play). I also found out, that it worked out when I was tightening down the rocker nut, when I got down to no more play on the roller tip to valve, that rocker nut you could feel the resistance perfectly when it got to that perfect point. So instead of spinning the pushrod, I felt for resistance in the nut as it tightened down. When you get to this point in the process we can help you. Those instructions are correct, you just have to find what works best for your engine.

squeak93 · Jun 11, 2015

ARP Thread sealer is mandatory for the lower bolts. Just as you stated they do go into the water jackets.

9333's or 1011-1's are great gaskets for the price. Both can be sourced locally or any major supplier.

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

This was my original post before squeak93. My computer keeps double posting everything today for some reason...

If your heads turn out to be flat and you don't find any problems your looking at a relatively easy and cheap assembly. Felpro 9333's are great especially at $30 something dollars at local auto parts store.

Something else I read about ARP studs is the lower row of bolts penetrate the water jackets so you have to use sealer on them. Well I read that water can escape with the studs or something. That doesn't sound right but if they weren't sealed properly this could be an issue. Might research more on the proper way to use install these studs on the 5.0

squeak93 · Jun 11, 2015

That's odd that your post came after mine as I saw it before I even posted. ODD. I was merely agreeing with your statement and adding another cheap gasket that holds nicely into the mix.

stang89bidges · Jun 11, 2015

It was my fault squeak, I deleted the first post instead of the second(double post) and I guess yours posted directly between my two... I rebooted computer so hopefully the double posts will stop...

m3x1c0 · Jun 12, 2015

Pulling the heads in one hour but I found a dyno slip from the PO. Shows the car making about 450HP and 500ft-lb of torque... Dear God. This seems like too much for a 302. Could that power output be block splitting territory? This thing is setup with an on3 turbo kit

stang89bidges · Jun 12, 2015

No it can make that power, but this could contribute to issues your having if not well maintained/monitored. You will have a better answer when you pull the heads.

Take pictures of everything! Scope out those gaskets.

stang89bidges · Jun 12, 2015

PS: Don't quote me but ford racing catalogue states stock 302 block can handle 450hp, but most enthusiasts say keep her under 500hp.

m3x1c0 · Jun 14, 2015

Alright got them off Friday night. Gaskets look fine. It took forever due to the stupid turbo kit being in the way of absolutely everything. Finally got them off at about 4am. So that being said: I didnt see anything wrong, but I was super exhausted and could be missing something. Doesn't look like coolant is touching the cylinders tho. Here's some pics. Gonna take the heads to a machine shop tomorrow. Should I ask for them to check more than straightness?

As you can see a lot of coolant spilled. I soaked it all up and applied motor oil to the cylinders while the heads are off. Any tips for checking the cylinders while I'm in there? Also how do you all clean up the deck surface without air tools and without screwing up the surface.

stang89bidges · Jun 14, 2015

Have them check for cracks and straightness. It's dangerous having heads milled without knowing how many times they have been milled previously. I would imagine they have been milled at least once before as they were taken from another vehicle and put on yours at some point. Normally a shop will take a standard 10-20 thou off at a time. Depends on the machinist. You run into trouble when you mill over .040, some get away with .060. I'm talking about e7te stock heads though. I don't know if this is the same for GT40's. Research. Point is, without blueprinted heads you never know.

So if you do get heads milled, make sure you check P2V clearance when you put them back on. Keep your old gaskets in order to do this.

Do your head gaskets have any brown/black burned marks on them? Usually the material is burnt through and you can see the inner honeycomb of gasket. Usually around the fire rings maybe water jackets. This is sign of a problem, hot areas.

Clean deck surface with scotch brite pads. Going to need a couple packs. It takes a while but you can get them pretty clean. Hard part ain't over yet.

m3x1c0 · Jun 15, 2015

stang89bidges said:
Have them check for cracks and straightness. It's dangerous having heads milled without knowing how many times they have been milled previously. I would imagine they have been milled at least once before as they were taken from another vehicle and put on yours at some point. Normally a shop will take a standard 10-20 thou off at a time. Depends on the machinist. You run into trouble when you mill over .040, some get away with .060. I'm talking about e7te stock heads though. I don't know if this is the same for GT40's. Research. Point is, without blueprinted heads you never know.

So if you do get heads milled, make sure you check P2V clearance when you put them back on. Keep your old gaskets in order to do this.

Do your head gaskets have any brown/black burned marks on them? Usually the material is burnt through and you can see the inner honeycomb of gasket. Usually around the fire rings maybe water jackets. This is sign of a problem, hot areas.

Clean deck surface with scotch brite pads. Going to need a couple packs. It takes a while but you can get them pretty clean. Hard part ain't over yet.

The green pads or red? I figure Ill stuff rags down in the cylinders to keep stuff out. Also was planning on stabbing the distributer back in so I dont lose timing marks.

stang89bidges · Jun 15, 2015

I've always used the green. What are the red? Tougher? If they scratch too deep into the surface then they are a no. Someone else can chime in on what they use. You can also research this. There is plenty of talk about what others use to clean the deck surface. Your going to want to make sure you research re-installing the heads too. Checking for P2V first with old gaskets then recleaning and installing the heads proper. Make sure you download the instructions for the ARP studs(not bolts) torque, or look that up somewhere.

Actually, I would definitely lookup the proper use of the studs and breaking the water jackets. Check to make sure they are no different than the bolts. Bolts are easy. Clean the threads(thread chaser, not thread tap), lube the threads, apply sealant to the lower row that break the water jackets. I would redo these since you have the heads off. Others may disagree but if you do this right, the goal is to not have to take everything back apart again for YEARS so a fresh coat of sealer will last longer than the old stuff that has gone through countless heat cycles so far. Call this my OCD. Up to you.

Definitely cover everything up. And use lint free rags, stay away from most other stuff. The less FM(foregn material) you put in the engine the better. But low lint rags will do alright. Those red ones from parts stores are low lint I think.

Re-stabbing the distributor is a good idea. Did you mark that thing before you pulled it? Meaning the mark inside the top where the rotor was pointing when you pulled it and also a mark(usually with a punch and hammer) down at the engine block? If you didn't mark it, make sure you go ahead and find TDC before you get everything back together cuz its a lot easier with heads off...

stang89bidges · Jun 23, 2015

Any progress?

Overheating Very Quickly

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