Overheating.

[6Stang7]

My stang is still over heating (steam shoots out of the radiator over flow when I turn the engine off after driving it) and I can figure out what it is. It always got a little high, but I figured it was cause I had no fan shroud. After pulling the intake off, getting it cleaned, then putting it back on I now have it getting even hotter. I tired retarding the timing, riching the air/fuel, and pulling the thermostat, but none of it has done anything!!!! What else could be going on here? I never did this before I took her off the road 5 months ago?

-Shaun

 

[2nd Mustang]

Something is obviously failing if it ran good before. How are the hoses? Soft radiator hoses will collapse under pressure, a tiny leak in the cooling system can cause the coolant to steam out of the overflow tank, or maybe the coolant isn't flowing correctly.

 

[ddonaca351]

My stang is still over heating (steam shoots out of the radiator over flow when I turn the engine off after driving it) and I can figure out what it is. It always got a little high, but I figured it was cause I had no fan shroud. After pulling the intake off, getting it cleaned, then putting it back on I now have it getting even hotter. I tired retarding the timing, riching the air/fuel, and pulling the thermostat, but none of it has done anything!!!! What else could be going on here? I never did this before I took her off the road 5 months ago?

-Shaun

Well retarding the timing and pulling the thermostat out can both CAUSE overheating, so chances are those didn't help matters. Did you read my last reply to your other overheating post? (i posted it last night) Did you check all of the things listed?
Also, if you overtighten the intake, it can sometimes act like a wedge and try to drive the heads off the block, which can make a leaking headgasket worse. Are you sure the headgaskets arent on backwards?
Read the other post from last night, it might help....

Dave-

EDIT: I just noticed it was gbarbur's thread, not yours... but I remember seeing your name in it, so you should remember which one I mean. Check it out....

 

[6Stang7]

Something is obviously failing if it ran good before. How are the hoses? Soft radiator hoses will collapse under pressure, a tiny leak in the cooling system can cause the coolant to steam out of the overflow tank, or maybe the coolant isn't flowing correctly.

THe top hose is brand new, and the bottom one has a spring in it prevent it from collapsing (I put this in about 8 months ago however). I did have a coolent leak from the thermostat housing, but I tightend the bolts and got it to stop. The only thing left is correct coolent flow, but I am not sure how to check that. Isn't there a tool the messure gallons per min that you can hook up to the top rad hose?

-Shaun

 

[6Stang7]

Well retarding the timing and pulling the thermostat out can both CAUSE overheating, so chances are those didn't help matters. Did you read my last reply to your other overheating post? (i posted it last night) Did you check all of the things listed?
Also, if you overtighten the intake, it can sometimes act like a wedge and try to drive the heads off the block, which can make a leaking headgasket worse. Are you sure the headgaskets arent on backwards?
Read the other post from last night, it might help....

Dave-

EDIT: I just noticed it was gbarbur's thread, not yours... but I remember seeing your name in it, so you should remember which one I mean. Check it out....

I pulled the termostat out because I was able to squeez the hose all the way down when it was running (hot all the way too), so I figured that it wasn't opening and preventing coolent flow. The engine ran best at like 15 or so degrees of advancement, and it didn't ping, but I also assumed that the increase in heat was causing my heating problem, so I retarded it back to what it was at before. The intake is an alum intake, torqued to 25 ft/lbs (I checked all the bolts in the bolt order 7 times, so they are all 25). The headgaskets can't be on backwards, cause I never had it get this bad before. Can not having a hood on effect air flow? I have been driving the car with no hood (took it off to fab up my cable clutch system) and was thinking that maybe the fan could be pulling air from up top, and not though the rad (although, I do have a fan shroud on now, were as I didn't before). I also blocked off these exhaust gas ports that ran exhaust through the intake because I was having problems with the carb getting too hot, and I was told that the point of these ports were to heat the carba nd intake up. Could this be a cause? Also, if the rad cap was bad, would steam shoot out under normal running temp? The engine wasn't having any problems running (as far as I could see), it's just that the gauge was reading max (however, none of my other gauges read correctly, so i dought this one is) and when I would be driving I could see a little coolent spin out of the overflow hose (would hit the fan and spatter around). Finally, when i would stop and kill the engine, I will get steam and coolent shooting out of the overflow hose. Any other ideas?

-Shaun

 

[pabear89]

1. You might not want to hear it, But Leaky headgasket.


Or you have air trapped inside.

Purging coolant after run is air pressure locked in form compression leakage.

Fill rad 3/4 full of coolant,leave cap off, run motor to operating temp.
you should see coolant flow at steady speed while at idle.
SLOWLY fill while running till about 7/8 full, place good rad cap on and drive.

If it purges after that, Go to back to 1.

PB

 

[6Stang7]

You're right, I didn't want to hear it; but if it is the case here, then I need to so I can deal with it. I guess I'll also run a compression test tomorrow and hope to high hell that all cylinders are the same. I don't get any white smoke out the exhaust or get the smell that comes with burning coolent, so is it still possiable to have a blown headgasket? I'm running open long tubes btw.

-Shaun

 

[pabear89]

Yes.
It's the beginning of a section leak near the coolant jackets.
the compression stroke of the leaking cyl will pump air into the
cooling system like a Tire pump.

make sure to remove ALL the plugs for your test.

PB

 

[6Stang7]

Are there any other tests besides a compression test that I can do to make sure that this is my problem? Also, I noticed that when I went to pour coolent into the rad just now, it drained in very slowly. I could hear it trickling down at a slow rate. Is this normal too?

-Shaun

 

[ddonaca351]

Hmmmmmm.... well a bad cap could lead it to o-heat more easily. The pressure provided by the cap also raises the boiling point, so the cap could drop it *some* but I wouldnt think more than 10-15 degrees.
Hot air being pulled back around the radiator could also make things worse, but I would think that the heat dissipation without the hood would MORE than make up for this...
Blocking off the exhaust crossover below the carb, will hurt cold start-up, but should help the o-heating problem.
Do you still have the stock steel 4 or 5 blade fan on it? A flex-i-lite or an electric might be a good upgrade.
In addition to a compression test, most shops can use a "block tester" where they test the coolant / radiator for the pressence of combustion gasses. A sign of a blown HG. Takes about 10 min, probably charge ya $20 if at all.
Is the fan belt the right tension? If its loose than the water pump won't turn like it should.
If you have any big gaps in the core-support next to / above / below the radiator, you might want to block them off (cardboard for a temp test ) to make sure that ALL the air is going through the radiator and not around it... this will not be such a problem on the highway, but will be more noticeable in town, where the volume of air is lower (slower) so it is more crutial.
Also try to feel the radiator just as the thermostat opens, (and it starts to get warm) and feel for cold spots. This will indicate that there is a lack of flow in that area of the radiator. If this is the case, rebuild it or get a new one.
Also check to see that your shroud fits well, no big gaps, the fan isnt way up inside it, or hanging out an inch behind it, etc...
The hole in the thermostat that you drilled is always a good idea. The *slow* trickeling in is the time it takes the air to escape out that hole. If you hadn't drilled the hole, that air would be trapped completely. (until the stat opens)
It sounds like your on the right track....
Check your coolant mix is 50/50 to 60/40 h20/coolant. Too much coolant can HURT the cooling ability of the system. (too little and you have a cracked block in January)
You could run some "Redline: Water Wetter", Summit carries it, and it helps about 5-10 degrees.
If all else fails you could try a good 160 stat, may-be the other one you had was wasted.... you could check it in a pan with a thermometer and watch for temp and smoothe opperation.
Hope some of this helps.
Dave

 

[gbarber]

Maybe you've already heard this, but you might try pressure testing the cooling system. My machine shop guy let me borrow his pressure tester to rule out a leaking head gasket or any other source of leaks. I pressurized the system to 20 PSI and it held for several hours. I was told that if the pressure bled off fairly quickly and I could not find the leak outside the engine (hoses, waterpump, etc.), I would probably find coolant in the cylinders or in the oil pan. (head gasket leak)
Fortunately, I think my problem was air trapped in the system after my recent engine rebuild. I replaced my thermostat, and drilled an 1/8 inch hole in the outer rim of the stat to help purge air trapped in the system. I positioned the hole at the top of thermostat housing. (12 O'clock) After running the engine with the radiator cap off for 20 minutes, I had no further problems with too much pressure building up at relatively low water temps.
If you had your intake off recently, you may have some air still trapped inside the engine. Before I got rid of the air in my engine, I would have coolant coming out the overflow at around 190*.
Hopefully your problem is something similar.

 

[2nd Mustang]

I did have a coolent leak from the thermostat housing, but I tightend the bolts and got it to stop.
-Shaun

My Camaro had a similar situation with the steaming out of the recovery tank. We'd fill it up with water and it would drive okay for a few miles then steam again. It caused the top hose to collapse. After opening the radiator cap (with a thick towel) the hose would pop back to it's original shape. A new hose didn't help either. It turned out to be a really small leak in the bottom tank that wasn't evident initially but showed itself a few days later with a small drip at the seams. Short of buying anything more, I guess a pressure test of your cooling system might be a good idea as others have mentioned, the pressure in the system is very important to keep coolant from boiling. I would use just water to test and refill with 50/50 after you fix it. Water is actually the best coolant for just plain cooling. The anti-freeze is just what it implies, anti-freeze. I use bottled distilled water, less contaminents and not very expensive. Good luck.

 

[6Stang7]

I took my stang to work today, and let her sit and idle until she warmed up, then I took her for a little drive until the gauge was pegged again and coolent was pissing out. I took a heat gun and messured the temp off the intake, water pump, and rad. The intake was at 160-180 degree, water pump was around 150-170, and the rad was 212-220. The mech. at work said that it sounds like I have a clogged rad. I also tested the cap, which held pressure until 14 psi. My dad thinks that something was wrong with the gun or something because the rad was hotter then the engine (an that is impossiable in his mind). I can't imagen an IR heat gun reading wrong, but I guess it's possiable. What do you all think?

-Shaun

 

[88 Fox GT]

Well retarding the timing and pulling the thermostat out can both CAUSE overheating, so chances are those didn't help matters. Did you read my last reply to your other overheating post? (i posted it last night) Did you check all of the things listed?
Also, if you overtighten the intake, it can sometimes act like a wedge and try to drive the heads off the block, which can make a leaking headgasket worse. Are you sure the headgaskets arent on backwards?
Read the other post from last night, it might help....

Dave-

EDIT: I just noticed it was gbarbur's thread, not yours... but I remember seeing your name in it, so you should remember which one I mean. Check it out....

Retarding the timing should make the engine run slightly cooler. (there is less combustion time / less heat)

I guess I don't understand how pulling the thermostat CAUSES overheating...

 

[pabear89]

Retarding the timing should make the engine run slightly cooler. (there is less combustion time / less heat)

I guess I don't understand how pulling the thermostat CAUSES overheating...

Without a thermostat in place to control the flow of coolant,
It is possable for the temp to rise above the recommended level.

Too much coolant flowing will not allow it to disapate the heat from the rad.
before it goes back in to the engine.

PB

 

[Fostang]

Did you ever change the head gaskets Shaun?

If so did you make sure that the gaskets pointed forward blocking off the front cooling passage?

If not well this could be a problem other than your water pump/radiator.

Why don't you open it up using a portable torch and use a dip stick to run it through the cooling veins. Weld back together with soder.

If you'd prefer not to open it use muriac acid found in pool supplies pour some in let sit then rinse out this of course off the car.

 

[67GTA-FB429]

have you checked your theromstat functionality?? drop it in a pan of boiling water with a thermometer....does it open at the correct setting??

 

[6Stang7]

I pulled the thermostat out all together and am not running one right now. The headgaskets are the original ones from when I rebuilt the engine over 2K miles ago. Is the temp readings I got in my previous post normal? If so, then it would seem that the real problem here (besides the rad possiablly being clogged) is my cap pressure(14 psi) and the gauge not reading correctly (maxed out when the engine is 180). BTW Fostang and 67GTA-FB429. I'm gonna be stuck at home all night doing a term paper for college; however, if you guys want to feel free to stop by so I can atleast me you Buzz and show you and Sal the bondo bullitt. Hopefully when you come to Livermore next time (which you said will be quite often) I'll be free and able to do something. Any ?'s just call my cell.

-Shaun

 

[67GTA-FB429]

go to a lower cap pressure.....