Possibly the greatest American car ever??

white 89 GT · Nov 13, 2005

Rootus said:
Mostly true. And yet it will out handle any factory Corvette except the Z06 .

Dave

Yeah key word FACTORY.
Which is what you need to buy if you can`t make it go fast with your own ingenuity.

Darkness · Nov 13, 2005

Rootus said:
Mostly true. And yet it will out handle any factory Corvette except the Z06 .

Dave

Fact or fiction? What year vettes? I've driven both and its a different type of car so its hard to compare. And never seen a comparo between the two.

The Factor · Nov 13, 2005

For a sticker price of around 69000 dollars and a mark up to 100000 dollars it better handle and drive good, because your entering into the Porsche and ferrari territory and its still just a vette

Darkness · Nov 13, 2005

03yellowvenom said:
For a sticker price of around 69000 dollars and a mark up to 100000 dollars it better handle and drive good, because your entering into the Porsche and ferrari territory and its still just a vette

The only porsche you can buy for that price is a boxster and thats a POS, and if you can find a recent ferrari for that price I'll buy it for you.

Rootus · Nov 13, 2005

Darkness said:
Fact or fiction? What year vettes? I've driven both and its a different type of car so its hard to compare. And never seen a comparo between the two.

A little of both. In a real world test with typical drivers, the limiting factor would certainly not be the car. And so we have to do some magazine racing. To keep it as fair as is possible (which isn't saying much ), no cross-magazine numbers. Both of these are recent tests by Motortrend, with a fairly experienced driver. The Vette gets good acceleration numbers above 60 mph, and it has a bit more stick on steady-state lateral G (probably has as much to do with the huge tires as anything else).

	2006 STI	2005 Vette Z51
0-30	1.3	1.7
0-40	2.2	2.4
0-60	4.5	4.3
0-100	12.1	10.2
1/4	13.0 @ 103.5	12.7 @ 112.3
60-0	108 ft	110 ft
Lateral G	0.91 g	0.95 g
Slalom	68.8 mph	66.2 mph
Tires	225/45/17	245/40/18 (f), 285/35/19 (r)

The Factor · Nov 13, 2005

Darkness said:
The only porsche you can buy for that price is a boxster and thats a POS, and if you can find a recent ferrari for that price I'll buy it for you.

Thanks Paul , i'll start looking now and thanks for the offer

Rootus · Nov 13, 2005

Darkness said:
The only porsche you can buy for that price is a boxster and thats a POS, and if you can find a recent ferrari for that price I'll buy it for you.

To be fair, the base MSRP for a 2006 Porsche 911 is $69,300.

Dave

duner · Nov 13, 2005

Darkness said:
The Impreza STi does not share a any of the suspenssion, drive train, brakes and engine components with the $800k WRC version.

The C6 Z06 has as much in common with the C6R as the Imprezza STi has with the WRC STi.

Rootus · Nov 13, 2005

white 89 GT said:
Yeah key word FACTORY.
Which is what you need to buy if you can`t make it go fast with your own ingenuity.

Spoken like someone who has not the financial resources to buy the nicer car . Don't feel bad, I'm with ya on that one. However, it is undeniable fact that the factory always does a better job with the final package. It won't just be fast, it will be comfy too. And while you can brute force duplicate external performance characteristics, you cannot easily duplicate the feel.

Dave

The Factor · Nov 13, 2005

Rootus said:
To be fair, the base MSRP for a 2006 Porsche 911 is $69,300.

Dave

Thanks Dave ok Paul i'll take a base model 911 please,and trailer the car covered please when you deliver it to me

j/k....................... you dont have to cover it.I know its not a Ferrari but it will work : )

Darkness · Nov 14, 2005

03yellowvenom said:
Thanks Dave ok Paul i'll take a base model 911 please,and trailer the car covered please when you deliver it to me j/k....................... you dont have to cover it.I know its not a Ferrari but it will work : )

I said a Ferrari, of course porsches are cheaper!!!! Plus the base model 911 is in no ones territory, and certainly not the Z06.

stock50LX · Nov 14, 2005

Rootus said:
Spoken like someone who has not the financial resources to buy the nicer car . Don't feel bad, I'm with ya on that one. However, it is undeniable fact that the factory always does a better job with the final package. It won't just be fast, it will be comfy too. And while you can brute force duplicate external performance characteristics, you cannot easily duplicate the feel.

Dave

White '89 is referring to a philosophy more than necessity. When I go to an auto show, the new cars hold no allure. I want to see what people have done to their cars not what a fat pocketbook will deliver. A hot rod is far more interesting than a factory car -of any type. Of course, I care nothing for badging, and status -as you younger guys probably do. That's probably an issue of age. No, it's not all about attention-getting and shiny wheels. I feel satisfaction beating someone's super expensive factory pseudo-racecar with my Mustang.

Rootus · Nov 14, 2005

stock50LX said:
White '89 is referring to a philosophy more than necessity. When I go to an auto show, the new cars hold no allure. I want to see what people have done to their cars not what a fat pocketbook will deliver.

Good for you. I just want the highest performance car I can get. However I get it.

A hot rod is far more interesting than a factory car -of any type.

To you.

Of course, I care nothing for badging, and status -as you younger guys probably do. That's probably an issue of age. No, it's not all about attention-getting and shiny wheels.

Oddly, most Vette owners seem to be old, not young. Same with Porsche & Ferarri owners. Old or young, it's the poor folks who go for 20 year old Mustangs with big engines.

I feel satisfaction beating someone's super expensive factory pseudo-racecar with my Mustang.

And they feel ... nothing.

If you think that a 2006 Z06 is a pseudo-racecar compared to your Mustang, then you need to get out more.

Dave

stock50LX · Nov 14, 2005

Rootus said:
Good for you. I just want the highest performance car I can get. However I get it.

To you.

Oddly, most Vette owners seem to be old, not young. Same with Porsche & Ferarri owners. Old or young, it's the poor folks who go for 20 year old Mustangs with big engines.

And they feel ... nothing.

If you think that a 2006 Z06 is a pseudo-racecar compared to your Mustang, then you need to get out more.

Dave

Zo6 is a good performance car. "Racecar" is an ambiguous term. My point is that I can build a car that would beat it at my kind of racing (drag racing) for a fraction of the cost. And many other people could probably do a better job than me.

If you think all owners of 20 year old Mustangs (or other similar cars) are poor, how would you explain the people that plunk down $300,000. for a hand built Coddington streetrod patterned after an old Mustang? Or people that spend $50,000 for an old muscle car, or drag race car, instead of spending money on a Ferrari or Zo6 or Porsche? It is not about money. It is about philosophy (or point of view) and what you want.

Sure, most Vette, and Prosche owners never use their cars to do what they are designed for. The older guys just own what the younger status-seekers aspire to, but that's not my point. My point is that hotrodding is an enthusiast's orientation, it does not carry with it a particular socio-economic status. Hot rodders come from all professions and have all sized bank accounts. For my part, I'd rather build it my way, and use it.

And as far as what "they feel", I am not racing to make them feel bad. They must deal with their own goals and results. Those issues are not in my realm or under my control.

As for 20 year old Mustangs being the car of the poor... hmmm, I have three and I have owned at least a dozen from the classic years. That's what I am into. They are a great platform to do what you want with. I know a fair number of enthusiasts that are my age, have resources, and still choose old Mustangs, I don't think I am so different -at least, not in this category. I still like beating the guy who spent 50K on his Vette! Twenty year old Mustangs as the poor-man's-Porsche? Okay, that's fine with me. I enjoy doing it better for less.

white 89 GT · Nov 17, 2005

Rootus said:
Spoken like someone who has not the financial resources to buy the nicer car . Don't feel bad, I'm with ya on that one. However, it is undeniable fact that the factory always does a better job with the final package. It won't just be fast, it will be comfy too. And while you can brute force duplicate external performance characteristics, you cannot easily duplicate the feel.

Dave

I don`t feel bad that I have not a "nicer car" for im not some poor soul struggling to make a living. I cannot see spending a bundle o bucks for auto`s that in 20 yrs. will be worth 1/4 of the purchase price. the vette or viper may hold some value. but not no rice pile.

I have been into mustangs since 1973 (17yo).
Have had other brands only 1 ricer rig, but allways come back to lightweight mustangs. I just like doing my own motor building & performance mods.
I could go out and buy something fast but what the hell, that is going to show gm, ford, mopar or ? can make a fast car. Sorry I can take no pride in that, besides it take the likes of shelby, penski, roush, yates or jenkins type of "rodder" to make them faster.

stock50LX · Nov 17, 2005

I think there is a real connection to our youth on this issue. If you owned a Mustang as a young man, the tendency is to buy that band again in middle age. The same applies to whatever brand was favored in your youth. Al and I just never let go of Mustangs. I've almost always had one, or two, or three...
I agree with Al, I am not going to put a lot of resources into a car, at least no more than required to get what I want from the car. I drive 1 mile to work everyday. All my cars are toys. I am not poor, Rootus; but I am not one to waste money either.

Rootus · Nov 17, 2005

white 89 GT said:
but not no rice pile.

Most of your post was nonsensical crap, but that right there made reading it all worth it.

Dave

Rootus · Nov 17, 2005

stock50LX said:
I think there is a real connection to our youth on this issue. If you owned a Mustang as a young man, the tendency is to buy that band again in middle age. The same applies to whatever brand was favored in your youth. Al and I just never let go of Mustangs. I've almost always had one, or two, or three...

Perhaps that is it. I've owned Mustangs since not long after I got my license (which was a mere 15 years ago... ). And I still own one. And probably will own many more, based on my history (seven so far...).

I agree with Al, I am not going to put a lot of resources into a car, at least no more than required to get what I want from the car. I drive 1 mile to work everyday. All my cars are toys. I am not poor, Rootus; but I am not one to waste money either.

And this is entirely a matter of opinion.

I find that I don't enjoy working on my daily driver, I'd rather spend time working on something that doesn't have the pressure of having to be running again by morning. And yet, I would like to drive a nice, well performing, comfortable car. Every day. Because I don't drive 1 mile to work, I drive 25 miles to work, and I spend over an hour of every day of my life in my car.

I have no problem with your opinion on this, really. Where you lost me was when you insisted on acting pouty and taunting the Vette for no particular reason, claiming you can equal the performance by adding a few cheap toys to your Mustang (a point which I would be happy to debate... ). The point of this thread was to appreciate what a fine piece of craftsmanship the Z06 is. And unless you are seriously deluded, you have to recognize that making a Mustang perform like the '06 Z06 is impossible, unless you confine yourself to one-dimensional measurements like straight-line speed. The Vette is a great example of pulling together amazing performance in every category. Even cost.

Dave

ASD · Nov 17, 2005

Rootus said:
And unless you are seriously deluded, you have to recognize that making a Mustang perform like the '06 Z06 is impossible, unless you confine yourself to one-dimensional measurements like straight-line speed. The Vette is a great example of pulling together amazing performance in every category. Even cost.
Dave

Sometimes I question you being delusional and no I am not looking for a debate. So are you saying it's impossible to take a Mustang and mod the piss out of it in everyway and it would still lose to the new ZO6? (Straight line, road course, braking, etc.)

Rootus · Nov 17, 2005

ASD said:
So are you saying it's impossible to take a Mustang and mod the piss out of it in everyway and it would still lose to the new ZO6? (Straight line, road course, braking, etc.)

Yes.

Dave

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