Really Rich mixture : MAF questions

DouglasOhio

New Member
Jul 25, 2004
116
0
0
Canton Ohio
Really Rich mixture : MAF questions PLEASE HELP NOW

Well i have an 89 LX, and it runs super rich. the car has a 190 lph fp, 19# injectors, and is mass air. However the guy i bought it from kind of was shady about rebuilding the engine and it seems he just threw a bunch of **** sensors in. Ive replaced the water temp switch, and some other sensors that have gone bad. I was wondering what sensors would make the car run so rich , other than the 02 sensors which are probably bad as well. How can i tell what injectors the mass air meter is calibrated for? it certainly has different numbers than the meters in my brothers car and his buddys car (both factory mass air cars for sure) Could maybe the computer be fried? my car also has the surging idle problem really bad. Also, what is the sensor directly behind (towards the back of the block) behind the water temp sending unit. It screws into the lower manifold and connects to the injector wiring harness. Thanks for any input, im really lost on this problem.
SEE MY LAST POST BELOW PLEASE:
 
You might want to check you MAS air electronics. Mine where bad but i didnt know it till i put on a aftermarket c&l and the car all of sudden didnt have ANY Power. As far as I know they dont make the electronics any more I had to get my replacement from a buddy that went DFI.
 
Dump the codes and see what the computer says is wrong…

Here's the link to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great.

See http://www.troublecodes.net/Ford/
OR
See http://www.dalidesign.com/hbook/eectest.html for more descriptive help
OR
See http://www.mustangworks.com/articles/electronics/eec-iv_codes.html

IF your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

Codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see http://www.actron.com/product_detail.php?pid=16153 for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Walmart.

Or for a nicer scanner see http://www.midwayautosupply.com/detailedproductdescription.asp?3829 – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $33.
 
codes

OK i ran the KOEO test no problem and it spit these codes out:
Hard codes:
56: VAF or MAF sensor high
Stored codes:
31: EVP sensor was out of range
It through out some kind of 40 series code, but i couldnt catch the 2nd digit and see below why i couldnt get it again...
40 is : 40 SERIES FUEL/AIR INJECTION CODES ON VEHICLES WITH DUAL OXYGEN SENSORS REFER TO THE RIGHT OR REAR SENSOR.
53: throttle position sensor too high
93 (O) Throttle linkage binding or bad ISC motor ISC (R) HO2S not reading
could this be the reason my gas pedal stuck on the floor a few weeks ago?
24 Intake Air Temperature (IAT) or Vane Air Temperature (VAT) sensor out of range
54 Intake Air Temperature (IAT) or Vane Air Temperature (VAT) signal high
and then it spit 9 flashes on the CEL and then nothing.

I tried to run the KOEO test again and it wouldnt run. i had it setup right and everything and nothing. I drove the car like 8 miles, came home, and tried to run the KOER test and nothing, wouldnt do anything.

ANyone know why this would be?
im thinking my computer is done.
thanks jrichker for the site, that helped a ton.
Anymore help would be sweet, thanks guys

EDIT: i have hoooker super comp headers and a off road h pipe, could this be the reason the 2 o2 sensor readings came up?....
 
OK so i ran the KOER test and it kept dieing SOOO
i revved it a little bit when it would die trying to just keep it running and it stayed a live but started idling at 1800rpm, where it got to
so im thinking ok this is the test
but the idle never slowed down
and the car stayed that way
soooo now even with the test disconnected it idles at 1800 rpms
WTF
PLEASE HELP
 
Code 24 - Intake Air Temperature (ACT) sensor out of range. Bad sensor, bad wiring. The ACT for Mustangs built before 95 is in the #5 intake runner. It measures the air temperature in the intake to help computer the proper air/fuel ratio.

Note that that if the outside air temp is below 50 degrees F that the test for the ACT can be in error.

ACT & ECT test data:

The ACT & ECT have the same thermistor, so the table values are the same

Pin 7 on the computer - ECT signal in. at 176 degrees F it should be .80 volts

Pin 25 on the computer - ACT signal in. at 50 degrees F it should be 3.5 volts. It is a good number if the ACT is mounted in the inlet airbox. If it is mounted in the lower intake manifold, the voltage readings will be lower because of the heat transfer. Here's the table :

68 degrees F = 3.02 v
86 degrees F = 2.62 v
104 degrees F = 2.16 v
122 degrees F = 1.72 v
140 degrees F = 1.35 v
158 degrees F = 1.04 v
176 degrees F = .80 v
194 degrees F = .61

Ohms measures at the computer with the computer disconnected, or at the sensor with the sensor disconnected.
50 degrees F = 58.75 K ohms
68 degrees F = 37.30 K ohms
86 degrees F = 27.27 K ohms
104 degrees F = 16.15 K ohms
122 degrees F = 10.97 K ohms
140 degrees F = 7.60 K ohms
158 degrees F = 5.37 K ohms
176 degrees F = 3.84 K ohms
194 degrees F = 2.80 K ohms


CODE: 31 (KOEO) - EVP circuit below minimum voltage. Vref (5 volt reference voltage supplied by the computer) missing or broken wire or bad connection in circuit. Use a DVM to check for 5 volts on the orange/white wire. If it is missing, look for +5 volts at the orange/white wire on the TPS or MAP sensor located on the firewall near the center of the car. Use the black/white wire for the ground for the DVM.
With the sensor removed from the EGR and still connected, press the plunger and watch the voltage change on the brown/lt green wire. Pull the passenger side kick panel and measure the voltage at the computer. You will need to remove the plastic cover over the wires and probe them from the backside. A safety pin may prove very useful for this task. Use pin 27, EVR input (brown/lt green wire) and pin 46, signal ground (black/white wire) to measure the voltage. The orange/white wire is Vref and should always be 5 volts -/+ .25 volt. Be sure to measure Vref at the EGR sensor to rule out any broken wires or bad connections.

There is no code 40 for Mustangs Try code 41.

Code 41 or 91 - O2 indicates system lean. Look for a vacuum leak or failing O2 sensor.
The computer sees a lean mixture signal coming from the O2 sensors and tries to compensate by adding more fuel.

The following is a Quote from Charles O. Probst, Ford fuel Injection & Electronic Engine control:
"When the mixture is lean, the exhaust gas has oxygen, about the same amount as the ambient air. So the sensor will generate less than 400 Millivolts. Remember lean = less voltage.

When the mixture is rich, there's less oxygen in the exhaust than in the ambient air , so voltage is generated between the two sides of the tip. The voltage is greater than 600 millivolts. Remember rich = more voltage.

Here's a tip: the newer the sensor, the more the voltage changes, swinging from as low as 0.1 volt to as much as 0.9 volt. As an oxygen sensor ages, the voltage changes get smaller and slower - the voltage change lags behind the change in exhaust gas oxygen.

Because the oxygen sensor generates its own voltage, never apply voltage and never measure resistance of the sensor circuit. To measure voltage signals, use an analog voltmeter with a high input impedance, at least 10 megohms. Remember, a digital voltmeter will average a changing voltage." End Quote

Measuring the O2 sensor voltage at the computer will give you a good idea of how well they are working. You'll have to pull the passenger side kick panel off to gain access to the computer connector. Remove the plastic wiring cover to get to the back side of the wiring. Use a safety pin or paper clip to probe the connections from the rear. The computer pins are 29 (LH O2 with a dark green/pink wire) and 43 (RH O2 with a dark blue/pink wire). Use the ground next to the computer to ground the voltmeter.

The O2 sensor ground is in the wiring harness for the fuel injection wiring. I grounded mine to one of the intake manifold bolts

Code 53 - Throttle Position sensor too high - TPS. Try adjusting the TPS below .98 volts.

Here’s a TPS tip I got from NoGo50…

When you installed the sensor make sure you place it on the peg right and then tighten it down properly. Loosen the back screw a tiny bit so the sensor can pivot and loosen the front screw enough so you can move it just a little in very small increments. I wouldn’t try to adjust it using marks. Set it at .90v-.99v, the closer to .99v the better. Just don’t go over .99, or you upset the fuel calibration and idle quality will suffer.

(copied from MustangMax, Glendale AZ)

1. Always adjust the TPS and Idle with the engine at operating temp. Dive it around for a bit if you can and get it nice and warm.

2. When you probe the leads of the TPS, do not use an engine ground, put the ground probe into the lead of the TPS. You should be connecting both meter probes to the TPS and not one to the TPS and the other to ground.

3. Always reset the computer whenever you adjust the TPS or clean/change any sensors. I just pull the battery lead for 10 minutes.

4. Check the procedure for your year, on my 90 I have to turn the idle screw until it just touches the tab, then insert a .010 feeler gauge and give it about one more turn. Then you adjust the TPS voltage to .98v, reset the computer. Start it up, if the idle is to low then turn the screw in until it is just right, then readjust the TPS voltage to .98v and reset the computer and start it up. The key is to adjust the TPS voltage and reset the computer whenever the idle screw is changed.
If the TPs won't adjust, then you have a bad TPS ground

With the combination of problems you have, I would suspect a bad computer signal ground. With the power off, measure the resistance between the black wire and battery ground. You should see less than 1 ohm. Check the same black wire on the EGR and MAP sensor. More than 1 ohm there and the wire is probably broken in the harness between the engine and the computer. The 10 pin connectors pass the black wire back to the computer, and can cause problems.

See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds (website host)

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/88-91eecPinout.gif

See http://fordfuelinjection.com/index.php?p=6 for more wiring help & 10 pin connector diagrams

While you are checking grounds, check the power grounds as well.

1.) The main power ground is from engine block to battery: it is the power ground for the starter & alternator.

2.) The secondary power ground is between the back of the intake manifold and the driver's side firewall. It is often missing or loose. It supplies ground for the alternator, A/C compressor clutch and other electrical accessories such as the gauges. Any car that has a 3G alternator needs a 4 gauge ground wire running from the block to the chassis ground where the battery pigtail ground connects.

3.) The computer has its own dedicated power ground that comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to it's proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery. It is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire.

4.) All the sensors have a common separate ground. This includes the TPS, ACT, EGE, BAP, & VSS

5.) The O2 sensor heaters have their own ground (HEGO ground) coming from the computer. This is different and separate from the O2 sensor ground. It is in the fuel injector wiring harness and comes out under the throttle body. It gets connected to a manifold or head bolt.

6.) The TFI module has 2 grounds: one for the foil shield around the wires and another for the module itself.

7.) The computer takes the shield ground for the TFI module and runs it from pin 20 to the chassis near the computer.

8.) The computer's main power ground (the one that comes from the battery ground wire) uses pins 40 & 60 for all the things it controls internally.
 
Thanks a lot man, ill try a lot of that tomorrow and sunday as i get the time,
the idle calmed down after i let it sit at work running for like 10 minutes, it went to about 1400 rpm, then after work i started it up and it went from 1500 down to 900 in about 15 seconds. Thanks again.
Any idea why the computer wont run the KOER test without killing the engine?
maybe bad computer power grounds?
i dont know much about electric wiring and computers...
like i said the the KOEO test ran fine... just the KOER test, i can hear it click on and then the engine just dies