Sub Frame Connectors

Soaring1 · Oct 5, 2005

I have no need to race my old 289 65. Why would I want to put on sub-frame connectors if I don't care to race it?

dodgestang · Oct 5, 2005

1. Eliminate sub frame squeeks cause by all the flex.
2. Improved handling in street applications.
3. Good bracing drastically improves your odds of surviving running under a tractor trailer at 70 MPH.

allcarfan · Oct 5, 2005

dodgestang said:
1. Eliminate sub frame squeeks cause by all the flex.
2. Improved handling in street applications.
3. Good bracing drastically improves your odds of surviving running under a tractor trailer at 70 MPH.

Very good points. It will drastically eliminate chassis flex too. Good bang for your buck mod.

HistoricMustang · Oct 5, 2005

Soaring1 said:
I have no need to race my old 289 65. Why would I want to put on sub-frame connectors if I don't care to race it?

I believe you answered your own question!

Happy Motoring!

HistoricMustang
www.historicmustang.com

bnickel · Oct 5, 2005

believe it or not sub frame connectors will actually give a slightly better ride as well, since you won't have the front and rear suspension working against each other because of the unibody flexing. are they necessary? no, but you might like the effect they have.

66Runt · Oct 5, 2005

If you get a set for Old Yeller don't buy the bolt in kind

That would be a waste of money, and could end up being detrimental to your frame structure.

Scott

bnickel · Oct 5, 2005

nothing wrong with the bolt in kit, but i would recommend welding those in anyway. some of the weld in kits like the kind that competition engineering sells require that you relocate the springs, which is ok if you plan on tubbing a car, if it is not going to tubbed then the those weld in kits would not work well. as a matter of fact competition engineering recommends welding their bolt in kit but they offer it as a bolt in for people that don't want to permanently modify their car

LMan · Oct 6, 2005

66Runt said:
That would be a waste of money, and could end up being detrimental to your frame structure.

Scott

care to explain?

RGS0907 · Oct 6, 2005

Returning to stock

If you weld the connectors on & later want to return the car to stock, what would need to be done? Do the subframes need to be replaced or can you break the weld & still be able to grind it down to look stock?

66Runt · Oct 6, 2005

Sure

LMan said:
care to explain?

IMO,
Drilling holes through the frame rails and then attaching the subframes attempting to "squeeze" the rail to keep everything tight will eventually lead to elongted holes (or rips) in the frame rail. Now to overcome that you can always drill the holes slightly larger. Weld in tubes to the frame rail and then pass the bolts through those tubes, but the reality is you are still relying on "squeezing" at two points.

Again IMO,
Welding all the way around the mounting structures is a much stronger and lasting solution as it distributes pressure over the entire footprint, and does not allow movement under pressure.

Do you disagree? Or are you just asking for me to elaborate? Or did you just miss the subject line?

Thanks,

Scott

xj220 · Oct 6, 2005

I went with the TCPs and they're great. They're the weld in kind and are a bit expensive, but the car is significantly stiffer and handles better.

LMan · Oct 6, 2005

66Runt said:
IMO,
Drilling holes through the frame rails and then attaching the subframes attempting to "squeeze" the rail to keep everything tight will eventually lead to elongted holes (or rips) in the frame rail. Now to overcome that you can always drill the holes slightly larger. Weld in tubes to the frame rail and then pass the bolts through those tubes, but the reality is you are still relying on "squeezing" at two points.

Again IMO,
Welding all the way around the mounting structures is a much stronger and lasting solution as it distributes pressure over the entire footprint, and does not allow movement under pressure.

Do you disagree? Or are you just asking for me to elaborate? Or did you just miss the subject line?

Thanks,

Scott

"care to explain" just means what it says, no hidden code. If someone just throws out, 'bolt ins are a poor concept' without any elaboration, then its no use to the poster, IMO.

I would agree that weld-in is superior to bolt-in for the reasons you mention, but I doubt that ordinary street-driving will rip the frame rails from the car...and thus boltins are better than no subs at all.

You can always weld the bolt-in subs as well.

66Runt · Oct 6, 2005

Nothing at all negative taken about your post.

I was hoping you had a different point of view that I could learn from.

Welding in the bolt ins could definitely be advantagous over a non bolt in as you actually get to weld the center of the rails, where on a standard weld in you only get to weld around the outside. Course it could be over kill too. Food for thought though!

I liked your response, although my preference would be no subframe connector over a bolt in for any application, based on experiences I've had doing repairs for others. However, seeing as I didn't do the initial install, nor did I do the maintenance (nor would anyone cop to the fact that *maybe* they didn't follow instructions when they put the bolt in subframes on), I could be barking up the wrong tree. I'm sure thousands have been sold.
I've only seen a handful, and those were only the ones that had issues.

It would be good to hear from someone who did a clean and correct install, has run it a few years, and has pulled them off for periodic inspections. How'd it go, and what kind of maintenance was involved.

Thanks,

Scott

5.0StangRacer · Oct 6, 2005

best bang-for-the-buck SFC's?

nevin15 · Oct 6, 2005

Global west from npd never had such a sweet set of sub frame connectors you hardly can even see them. Plus what everyone else is saying

LMan · Oct 7, 2005

I have Comp Eng subs, cost ~85.00 a pair, welded. I like them.

I have never tried GW, TCP, or whatever, so I cannot comment on them. I am sure they are fine also.

CornerCarvin67 · Oct 7, 2005

I was originally just ignoring this thread after reading the initial post... but got sucked in to going thru it because I noticed Lman chimed in. And I know he likes to use his car... not just look at it. Historic hit it on the head with his response. And if it didn't come from the factory... you technically don't "need" it. Brakes and seat belts are a different story obviously because of safety issues.

But really... if you're not gonna abuse the car...don't bother with subs.

The dude said he's not into racing... so it don't sound like he cares how the car handles... just if it will make it from his garage to the show and back. Don't need subs for that!!

Spend the money on some fancy wax kit...

Jester67 · Oct 7, 2005

Well my .02 cents are a wise man builds his house upon the stone. In my opinion they can only help the car. If it is not a very very rare car that is show concourse and will be driven then I think sub-fame are one of the best investments in the cars future. Anything you can do to keep the metal from flexing and it will flex in daily driving is a good thing. Historic car is raced and weight is time so I can see him not using them but I would be willing to bet that he spends a lot of time under that car looking it over and will catch problems that might go unnoticed in other cars.

Route666 · Oct 7, 2005

CornerCarvin67 said:
And if it didn't come from the factory... you technically don't "need" it. Brakes and seat belts are a different story obviously because of safety issues.

The cars didn't come from the factory with engines as hot as a lot of people put in them, nor as good brakes as you mentioned, nor the heavy springs as some use in the suspension, all of which would put more strain on the body than the original systems did. And as Jester said - it can't hurt anything, so if you're not worried about absolute originality, use them.

S-Car-Go · Oct 7, 2005

Just had GW sfc's (and under-rider traction bars) welded in today. Didn't race it on the way home, but it was VERY noticable. The car feels much more stable and the suspension is working harder. Wouldn't have a unibody car w/o them. Especialy convertibles.
Had a 66 coupe with TCP SFC's. GF asked what was different before we made it to the end of the street.

Sub Frame Connectors

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