suspension time

project.65 · Dec 12, 2007

I have a '65 and want to start working on my suspension. My goal is to eliminate the original soft suspension, under-steer, and the sagging rear and get a firm, level ride. As for the under-steer, I would rather have over-steer. This will be for street/track use. I need some recommendations on good springs, shocks and leaf springs. I also need to replace my upper & lower UCA. Stance is very important aswell. I like how the rear sits, but would like to drop the front ~1". I also need some info on how to get rid of the under-steer. Here's a pic. of the current stance.

enferno · Dec 12, 2007

i'd go with mid-eye 4 1/2 leafs in the rear and 620 lbs in the front.

can't hurt to do the shelby drop and to align it to those specs, as that's free.

new inner/outer tie rods, if needed.

if you can afford it, i'd highly recommend opentracker's spherical bearing lower control arms, they run at $260 for the pair. definitely some roller rockers (i've seen some DIY for $40 or so from dazecars), roller idler arm ($150 i think), and adjustable strut rods (anywhere from $230 and up). this will give you an amazing ride and handling. this is the setup i'm doing on my new '66 coupe. can't decide if i can afford roller UCA's or not though, but that would finish it off to a crazy good ride.

66Runt · Dec 13, 2007

I'll second Opentrackers stuff, and add that you can do much worse, but not much better than his full on setup. Especially when you consider the price.
Not only is his stuff really good, but it's all track tested on his car, mostly at Laguna Seca. There is a bit of information on my web site about a few of his products I'm using.
BTW: You really don't want oversteer. Mustangs are easy to drive with the throttle, over steer will just get you in a heap of trouble.

project.65 · Dec 14, 2007

I was kind of thinking about getting both Global West UCA & LCA. As for shocks and springs Im not sure, what's the best combo would be for track use? I was wondering if CPA coilovers http://www.casuspension.com/pages/PRODUCTSPAGE.html would be a better choice
or maybe even Ron Morris coilovers http://www.mustangsplus.com/xcart/product.php?productid=6628&cat=2463&page=1
...as for oversteer and understeer problem I would rather have niether of them, but I think I'd much rather have oversteer than understeer.

CarFreakGT · Dec 14, 2007

project.65 said:
I was kind of thinking about getting both Global West UCA & LCA. As for shocks and springs Im not sure, what's the best combo would be for track use?

Even if you go w/ GW parts, you could still contact John Dinkel (opentracker). He can order other companies' products as well. If you call him, he'll steer you in the right direction based on your wants for the car, and give you honest opinions about his own and other products. I haven't talked to him in a while, because some family needs had to be prioritized the last several months. But, on the two or three times that I spoke w/ him, he was VERY helpful. He won't try to oversell you like some will, and you can tell that he loves what he does.

Regarding shocks, from what I researched (it's been a while, though), it seems that Konis or Bilsteins are great if you can afford the $$$ output. Seems that KYB's significantly sacrifice ride quality, but I have no personal experience. I went middle of the road w/ the Edelbrock IAS shocks, but haven't installed them yet. Feedback that I received was that they are a little more difficult to install (but not hard), but they are a nice choice that offer good handling and ride quality. I'm going w/ 620's on the front as they were part of the deal when I bought the car. That's probably the route I would have gone anyway. When I install them, I'll let them settle for a while and then decide if I want to cut them down a little.

I'm just now getting to a point where I can think about working on the car again, so I'm going to re-familiarize myself w/ opentracker's products and probably end up going w/ them or GW parts myself.

Helmantel · Dec 14, 2007

project.65 said:
...as for oversteer and understeer problem I would rather have niether of them, but I think I'd much rather have oversteer than understeer.

The reason 66Runt advised against oversteer is that understeer is dull/boring/iritating but oversteer is dangerous. Well, that's a bit simplistic of course.

A good driver can make good use of a car that's easy to bring into oversteer to make the car more fun to drive and possibly faster, but if it's the sudden, hard to control type of oversteer that these cars can have with poorly matched suspension compenents, then you can get yourself into trouble quickly.

If you could make the car handle so that it's neutral up to, say 80% of maximum, then starts to understeer a little bit but nothing a little more throttle opening can't correct, and if you can bring into into a nice, controllable slide when pushing the throttle even more, then that could be considered a nice balance (easier to type down than to realize.....)

DKN · Dec 14, 2007

I recommend the CPP Mini-Subframe Kit. It is currently available for the 64-66 Mustang, and they have done a couple of prototypes for the 67-68 cars. This will give the front of the car a very solid feel. I wish the guys who already have them would give us some kind of a review/driving report on this kit.

I don’t see were CPP has the mustang kit on the web. But here is their web info for the Mini-Subframe kit.

http://www.classicperform.com/NewProducts/2006/NewFiles/NovaSubFrame.htm

CarFreakGT · Dec 14, 2007

Hmm. Interesting, DNK. Any idea if/when a 67-8 kit may be available? That would really interest me, especially if it's in the same price range.

freddyfender · Dec 14, 2007

cpp

Hey there guys.

The CPP kits for mustangs 64-65 are available. I just received mine via UPS yesterday. It is to cold and too much snow right now for me to install it but I do have it. It is a miracle since UPS trashed the boxes!!!

As for feed back go to this link.

http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36016&page=6

It is a nova forum site. Read what people have to say about the CPP kit after installing them. The Nova and Mustang suspension are very similar.

Hope this helps.

project.65 · Dec 15, 2007

The car will be for track (road-racing) use. So I need some recommendations on stiff (the best) shocks and spring combo. Ride comfort is not a problem, I just want the car to handle VERY, VERY GOOD! BTW, I aready have disc brakes & 1" sway bar.
My plan was to get :
(FRONT)
- GlobalWest UCA & LCA
- ST strut rods
- 1 1/8" sway bar
- Roller perches
- ?shocks?
- ?springs?
- shelby drop
(REAR)
- 4.5 mid-eye springs

any thoughts?...

65fastbackresto · Dec 15, 2007

If I could do it over again...

I`d get a softer spring then the 620, I have pretty much NO suspension travel up front, its way too hard. I can sit on the fender and bounce up and down and not compress the spring at all. Something to think about, when you run larger wheels like you have, you have less tire sidewall between you and the road, and you need to compensate somewhere for that, and a hard spring makes it worse. It`ll sound like your bottoming out every tiome you hit a bump in the road, cause the suspension nor the sidewall can absorb the impact.

I do think with 14 or 15 inch tires I could get away with it, due to thier shock absorbing ability from a taller tire.

This is just my personal exp with them.

Rusty67 · Dec 15, 2007

My 67 Mustang is actually one of the two cars CCP is doing the prototype on. I know for a fact they are finished with the lower kit. Last time I talked to them they were working on the upper A arm. I actually called them today and left a message. I should get a call back some time this week with an update on it.

If you don't go to a coil over, I would definately recomend going with some Opentracker perches. They are a huge improvement. What kind of track racing do you want to do ? I'm guessing since you are talking about coil overs you don't plan to stay vintage legal ?

66Runt · Dec 15, 2007

I think first money well spent would be on a driving school. A great driver can make even a poor car look good.
While taking the school, I'd talk to companies who actually race Mustangs.
Grigg's, Maier, OPR, Street or Track, etc.
Good luck,

Tim65GT · Jan 26, 2008

So what springs did you get? How does it sit?

I got 4 leaf reverse eye springs for the rear, and now sits at least an inch higher than the stock 40 year old sagging leafs. But it's OK, 'cause it might settle a little and I now have room for a little more tire/wheel.

For the front, I got stock replacement GT springs, but didn't want it to sit too high, since the new motor has aluminum heads, the battery is in the trunk and I have an aluminum radiator. So I cut one coil out before installing them, but now it sits way too low. Anyone ever use the spring spacers? rubber or aluminum?

I need new front spring advise. I don't want a harsh ride, but want it to handle good. I have all new steering, and suspension parts with roller perches, adjustable struts, Shelby drop, 1" front bar and 3/4" rear bar.
I was thinking about 400-450 lbs with a 1" drop

DrYeRLiNt · Jan 26, 2008

Is the ride very crisp and precise with the Open Tracker parts? I really want something that handles on par with my daily driver (06 Civic)

mikethebike · Jan 30, 2008

For a street car I would not spend the money for a spherical-rod suspension plus the headache of maintaining the thing. If you drop the front 1.75" with the wedge on the upper arm to prevent binding, use a 620 spring with whatever spacer you need to get your desired height, export, Monti-Carlo, Koni, 1-1/8" front bar. Get a set of adjustable strut rods so you can set enough positive caster (8 degrees if you have p/s) to make the car track like it was on rails

Out back use a Flex-a-Form single fiberglass leaf spring, Traction-Master bars, Koni, 3/4" bar and spend the money you save on those $3k suspensions to have a race shop weld in a cage, frame connectors and buy a fuel cell so if you get hit in the ass you don't burn to death.

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