Thanks AFP! Now I Need Advice...

BeerElf

Founding Member
Oct 16, 2002
85
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6
Hillsboro, OR
Big thanks to All Ford Performance for helping me straighten out my air fuel ratio issue.

Now that the car's running better I'm looking forward to my first time to the track and also maybe meeting some of NW folks at Starbucks.

So anyway on to the advice I'm looking for. I've had a goal of getting my car to 300-350 RWHP without a SC or Nitrous and I'm falling a little shy. It will probably be a little while till I have some extra cash, but I'm trying to figure out what to do next.

Here's what I'm thinking, let me know if you agree or have any other suggestions:

1 - Replace the E cam with an FTI cam, upgrades springs and a custom chip or PMS.
2 - Underdrive Pullies
3 - replace the stock H pipe

Here's a copy of my dyno chart from last Friday & mods are in my signature.
2nd_dyno_sm.JPG


-Craig
 
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not shure on what will help you out? but i bet alot ofus will be at PIR this saturday night? What's kinda weird is it looks lke you have a H/C/I and all i have is a cam for now, but my H.P was 226 and my T.Q was 283, why is my T.Q higher? peace



john :p
 
John - I think your TQ is higher because I'm running the big TrickFlow R intake. I could probably gain some TQ by switching to something with narrower runners like a GT-40.

If there's power left on the table I'd like to find it but I'm not sure where else to look. I didn't think the E-cam was all "that" bad either, but the only reason I used it was that I lived in NorCal until last fall and I was more concerned with passing emissions.
 
hmm imo the combo you have now should yeild a bit more power. cuz if i can put down 250 290 with out heads or a cam i think you can adjust things to get you closer to your 300 goal with i too have that 300 goal w/o an s/c or nitous. go with an x pipe i love mine but i did get the one with cats so im still leagal he he
 
BeerElf said:
John - I think your TQ is higher because I'm running the big TrickFlow R intake. I could probably gain some TQ by switching to something with narrower runners like a GT-40.
Intake aside, those AFR 165's are high velocity heads, you should be getting a good amount of torque.

If there's power left on the table I'd like to find it but I'm not sure where else to look. I didn't think the E-cam was all "that" bad either, but the only reason I used it was that I lived in NorCal until last fall and I was more concerned with passing emissions.
The E-cam is suboptimal, but even so I would expect more than you're seeing. Definitely get something better than the stock H-pipe. Personally I'd skip the underdrives, even with the upgraded alt. Especially if you have any plans for longtubes.

Properly tuned, AFR's are good for something more along these lines:

dyno2.jpg


Have you taken it to the track? That's the real yardstick to measure by...
 
Rootus said:
Intake aside, those AFR 165's are high velocity heads, you should be getting a good amount of torque.

The E-cam is suboptimal, but even so I would expect more than you're seeing...

Have you taken it to the track? That's the real yardstick to measure by...
That's what I was thinking. While 265/270 is not bad compared to stock, I was definately expecting/hoping for more.

I have never been to the track, but I want to get out there soon. I just need to convince the wife that I won't break my daily driver! Also I don't have a helmet and I'm not sure if I'll need one.
 
is you think you will get under 13.99 reliably then you dont need it
my best was is 13.7 and they still dint have me where a helmet but the last time i was there i run nothing but 13.8s and they kept writting on there i need to have a helmet. i was told last year cuz i have a moon roof i need one to go faster then 14.5 but oh well i where it to get used to it for later
 
Scooby5.0Doo said:
is you think you will get under 13.99 reliably then you dont need it
my best was is 13.7 and they still dint have me where a helmet but the last time i was there i run nothing but 13.8s and they kept writting on there i need to have a helmet. i was told last year cuz i have a moon roof i need one to go faster then 14.5 but oh well i where it to get used to it for later


Eric you a cool mofo, but dame man, I gots to read your shimmy words at least twice to understand what you mean :D
 
Dude.... get a little straw like ya use for stirring coffee, and try to breathe through it.
Thats your stock h-pipe.
Now get one of those big fat McDonalds milkshake straws.... thats an aftermarket h/x-pipe.

See how the car lays down at 4700? Thats probably where it cant push the air through the stock pipe any more.

I'll bet if you go to a Bassani X or equivelant, I'd think you'd pick up AT LEAST 10 whp.

Air flow dynamics are like fluid flow dynamics are like electricity...etc. Once you reach a restriction, you can never regain the losses downstream, no matter what you do. You have to remove the restriction. The whole rest of the system is good parts, except for the stock H-pipe. NOTHING ELSE in the system can live up to it's potential, as long as that restriction is in place.

Just my .02
DD
:flag: :nice:
 
ddonaca351 said:
Dude.... get a little straw like ya use for stirring coffee, and try to breathe through it.
Thats your stock h-pipe.
Now get one of those big fat McDonalds milkshake straws.... thats an aftermarket h/x-pipe.

See how the car lays down at 4700? Thats probably where it cant push the air through the stock pipe any more.

I'll bet if you go to a Bassani X or equivelant, I'd think you'd pick up AT LEAST 10 whp.

Air flow dynamics are like fluid flow dynamics are like electricity...etc. Once you reach a restriction, you can never regain the losses downstream, no matter what you do. You have to remove the restriction. The whole rest of the system is good parts, except for the stock H-pipe. NOTHING ELSE in the system can live up to it's potential, as long as that restriction is in place.

Just my .02
DD
:flag: :nice:


EXACTLY!!! I have seen as much as 20 to the wheels out of a bassani X pipe. The more hp you make the more the stock cat pipe hurts you. I am suprised nobody has commented on the lean appearing air fuel ratio. This is another thing to be aware of with stock cats durring dyno tuning. The af gauge before the cats read 13.2 and the sniffer is as much as 1 point higher. Also the E cam is a less than steller. I like the stage 2 trick flow cam. Hairy Dave is right about the track. I ran 12.8 in Mishas car that made 282 hp on the chassis dyno.
 
AllFordPerf said:
EXACTLY!!! I have seen as much as 20 to the wheels out of a bassani X pipe. The more hp you make the more the stock cat pipe hurts you. I am suprised nobody has commented on the lean appearing air fuel ratio. This is another thing to be aware of with stock cats durring dyno tuning. The af gauge before the cats read 13.2 and the sniffer is as much as 1 point higher. Also the E cam is a less than steller. I like the stage 2 trick flow cam. Hairy Dave is right about the track. I ran 12.8 in Mishas car that made 282 hp on the chassis dyno.


What did Mish' run in the same car.....? :D :shrug: :rlaugh:

DD
 
Your plan sounds good. You may try the pullies and mid-pipe prior to another camshaft change, and see what that will net you. Also, depending on your preference, you may elect to delete EGR and/or run a short belt. My car made 275rwhp and 310rwtq with incorrect plugs and valve float. After changing plugs, valve springs, adding a phenolic spacer and deleting my EGR, my car is closing on the 300rwhp mark with the following:
box stock GT-40P heads
stage 1 TFS cam
TFS valve springs
1.6 roller rockers
typhoon upper/lower
65mm t-body
24lb injectors
76mm C&L
march pullies
short belt
EGR delete
mac long tubes
prochamber
flowmaster cat-back
This build-up is as budget as you can go, as I spent just over $1000 on the engine mods from K&N to cam. Before I dyno next, I will probably convert to a manual rack as well. If you are willing to go bare-bones, you can make power easily. Good luck!
 
Thanks for all the input guys! I didn't makt it out to PIR last night cause i got home late, but I'll pick up a helmet when I have some extra cash and start saving for an X pipe and see how it goes from there.

-Craig