The Official kiddiccarus 2007 NFL Thread
- Thread starter kiddiccarus
- Start date
CHEATERS
The are a few rumored reasons Belichick does not like Mangini but none of that can be confirmed and only those two guys know...
Back to the argument
I will not end the argument.. it's not they cheated the end as you say.. That is nice and convenient to ignore the truth and just drive the bus over a team and a person you do not like.
Sorry but the facts just get in the way of your exaggeration bus. I know some people and most likely you are one of them got a chubby over this and got all excited that you can take down a team you do not like but sorry it's not really cheating since it's legal to use deciphered signals to your advantage.
WOW some people will NEVER get it no matter how many times you explain it. I had a easier time house training my dog than with this
IT IS NOT ILLEGAL OR AGAINST THE RULES TO TRY AND "STEAL" THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNALS OR PLAYS........... WHAT IS ILLEGAL OR AGAINST THE NFL RULES IS HOW THEY WENT ABOUT DOING THAT..
THEY RULE THEY ARE BEING ACCUSED OF BREAKING BY THE NFL IS ILLEGALLY VIDEOTAPING THE SIGNALS.. THEY ARE NOT BEING CHARGED WITH A RULE OF "CHEATING"
FOR THE LAST TIME. IT'S IS 100 PERCENT TOTALLY LEGAL AND PART OF THE GAME TO TRY AND INTERCEPT AND DECIPHER THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNALS..
ALL TEAMS DO THIS!!!!!
WHAT THE PATS DID WRONG IS THEY VIDEOTAPED THE SIGNALS FROM THE FEILD... THAT IS ILLEGAL AND THEY SHOULD BE PUNISHED FOR DOING SO...
AGAIN FOR THE LAST TIME..
IT IS NOT CHEATING OR ILLEGAL IN THE NFL TO TRY TO STEAL THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNS... IT IS PART OF THE GAME.
I fail to see how videotaping from the sideline instead of lets say the upper deck with a high zoom lens is "cheating"
Pushing the edge of the rules yes... but a significant unfair advantage NO.
Now I really would like to hear from the NFL what the difference is when you record the signals from the sidelines rather then lets say the first row of the stands midfield ( signals can be clearly seen from there with a zoom lens) or from the roof along the sidelines with a high zoom lens.
Now my guess as to why a team would want to record this from the sideline is because when you are on the road you might not have as much access to the roof and other places to get a good recording. The other team is aware of this trick and is probably doing it them selfs. Maybe this is why they would have the guy on the sideline recording on a road game.
BTW I think "cheating" is a real stretch... illegally spying yes.. unethical and underhanded yes... but since it's legal to try and intercept the signals and it requires a ton of skill to correctly decipher and match the signals to the plays while the other teams is changing the signals and activators in the course of the game I would stop short of calling it cheating.
Personally I think the physiological effect on the other team when they saw the camera pointed at them was probably worth more then the actual info gained from the video. This is just a guess based on what I have read and heard former pro coaches and players say on this subject. Come on if you saw a video camera pointed at you the entire first half wouldn't you change your signs ASAP
Think about it if you see a camera pointed right at your signal calling this might make you change the signals earlier in the game or more often then you wanted to.. This can lead to communication errors and open men down field or other missed assignments. I can see how this could help gain a underhanded edge immediately...
BTW if you guys that don't agree with me and can't seem to make a solid argument just let it drop and not respond with remarks like "cheaters
" or saying that they cheated / argument.. then I will stop and let it go. but I am not going to let you get in one last cheap shot.. So far the people on the "cheated" side fail to even acknowledge that "stealing" signals is a legal act in the NFL.
Also you fail to address the issue that this practice is common place and even more underhanded stuff like talking with recently released players to gain a edge and more have been done by many and possibly all teams and coaches.
I wonder why I keep asking this and so far I have gotten nothing other then the other teams have not been caught or been in the news..
WELL lets see.. If it's not illegal to steal the signs then what would the other teams be caught doing???? You can not be busted for something that is not against the rules. such as stealing signs and talking to released players to get the playbook.. or mic up a defensive lineman to record the qb play calls. none of these are against current NFL rules..
So we are back to why the pats got busted.. and that is illegally videotaping.. not cheating my bus running friends.
We are taking about video taping in the wrong location.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/don_banks/07/06/cheating.nfl/index.html
this is a interesting read.
1990Coupe
Founding Member
i agree im sure it is common.. when you get caught though someone should own up to it, like you said
WOW some people will NEVER get it no matter how many times you explain it. I had a easier time house training my dog than with this
IT IS NOT ILLEGAL OR AGAINST THE RULES TO TRY AND "STEAL" THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNALS OR PLAYS........... WHAT IS ILLEGAL OR AGAINST THE NFL RULES IS HOW THEY WENT ABOUT DOING THAT..
THEY RULE THEY ARE BEING ACCUSED OF BREAKING BY THE NFL IS ILLEGALLY VIDEOTAPING THE SIGNALS.. THEY ARE NOT BEING CHARGED WITH A RULE OF "CHEATING"
FOR THE LAST TIME. IT'S IS 100 PERCENT TOTALLY LEGAL AND PART OF THE GAME TO TRY AND INTERCEPT AND DECIPHER THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNALS..
ALL TEAMS DO THIS!!!!!
WHAT THE PATS DID WRONG IS THEY VIDEOTAPED THE SIGNALS FROM THE FEILD... THAT IS ILLEGAL AND THEY SHOULD BE PUNISHED FOR DOING SO...
AGAIN FOR THE LAST TIME..
IT IS NOT CHEATING OR ILLEGAL IN THE NFL TO TRY TO STEAL THE OTHER TEAMS SIGNS... IT IS PART OF THE GAME.
actually you dont have to train me, I know that its legal to try and steal other teams signals and how the pats went about it was the wrong way. Honestly thats not want I nor most of us have been saying, this is common knowledge. Still lables them as cheaters since they are "one upping" everyone else and getting that extra edge other teams do not have, thus making them.. Cheaters
I get your reasoning, i got it like the 4 times you posted it 
I think you are misunderstanding where the majority of us are coming from and only reading what you want to maybe
1990Coupe
Founding Member
Still stikes me as odd... I mean they know the NFL policy, why try and do something like that so obviously????? I don't get it. Maybe they didn't realize videotaping from the sidelines was against the rules i don't know
it was stated by belichick himself that it was "his interpretation of the rules" - so he thought what he was doing was okay
but apparently, according to the rules, it wasn't.
but apparently, according to the rules, it wasn't.
gt40_2003wes
I did sound a wee bit gay there.
wow this guy is all butt hurt over this lol he keeps tryin to talk hisself into believeing what he is sayin but the fact is they CHEATED. u say they broke the rules or bent the rules thats CHEATING.
i agree im sure it is common.. when you get caught though someone should own up to it, like you said
actually you dont have to train me, I know that its legal to try and steal other teams signals and how the pats went about it was the wrong way. Honestly thats not want I nor most of us have been saying, this is common knowledge. Still lables them as cheaters since they are "one upping" everyone else and getting that extra edge other teams do not have, thus making them.. Cheaters
1990coupe... So far you the only person worth discussing this with.... the one word "cheaters" reply crowd.. ( gt40wes and a few others) are not worth wasting my time with.
No I see what some have posted and it's next to nothing. other than saying "cheaters" your the only one on that side of the fence that has tried to make a point.
My problem with the patriots cheated point of view is that signal stealing is not illegal and every team does it.. So how do you make the leap that this is a huge deal and that they cheated???
I just don't think there was a advantage that they have in this that the rest of the nfl does not have. Think about it if they are all stealing signs and trying to figure them out then how can you signal one team out for cheating when the only thing they did different was record from a banned location..
Basically you can not have your cake and eat it too. either nobody is cheating and it's ok or the entire NFL are cheaters. Make your choice. Because it's documented that all teams and coaches do this.
I have my own theory on why they recorded right out in the open instead of hiding like most other do. I posted this in a earlier post.
they cheated.
go seachickens!!!
EDIT
I just heard another nail in the coffin of your argument.
FACE it... it's legal to intercept and steal the signs.
Mike shannahan was quoted in 2002 saying " we have a guy in the box with binoculars watching the defensive play calls.. Many times we can figure out the calls by the half sometimes as early as the first quarter" Aired on 9/13/2007 at around 2:40 PM on the big O show 850AM Boston,ma
I am not going to go over the rule they broke again...
If they taped it from the stands or the roof instead of the sidelines we would not be having this argument right now.
Nothing is is going to change on sunday, all the teams will be doing the same old thing including the pats.
GT40 I want you to be man enough to answer my question from several posts ago..
1. do other nfl teams try to figure out the defensive play calls?
Is it against NFL rules to intercept and decipher signals and or play calls?
Just answer the question.. If you don't answer it then we all know you are a fraud.
BTW If your going to throw around heavy terms like cheating on this forum I think you should atleast be able to answer that and then tell all of us what rule they broke and why it's such a big deal..
Remember you are the one using this forum to discredit a person/organization. So please if your going to throw around accusations then back it up
Still stikes me as odd... I mean they know the NFL policy, why try and do something like that so obviously????? I don't get it. Maybe they didn't realize videotaping from the sidelines was against the rules i don't know
they knew what they were doing, and they should be punished for it..
They knew the rule about recording on the sidelines. the rule states your only allowed to use a still shot camera like a polaroid to capture the defensive calls. the benefits for a future game or in the second half of using a video camera is obvious
BTW
One funny thing about this is LT and hines ward have exposed them selfs as complete frauds. I was a little pissed about LT's comments last year but I understand that after you loose a close game that maybe you should have won that can be frustrating..
But now months latter he is trying to use this as some pathetic excuse for how his team and himself folded under presure.. WEAK!!!!!
and to ward.. that was 7 years ago, you lost because kordell stewart sucked... BTW ward you moron it's impossible for the pats to have your OFFENSIVE play calls since that is piped right into the QB's helmet.. no hand signals there.
One thing I HATE is a fraud.. and both of these guys are NFL vets who know what they are saying is bull**** but instead take the low road and deliberately misinform people that are ill informed like this gt40wes guy.
If anybody wants to continue discussing the patriots spying scandal then please open a new thread for it. No more on this subject in this thread. If anymore posts are made I will open a new thread and move them there and any otehrs will be deleted.
gt40_2003wes
I did sound a wee bit gay there.
talk about someone lettin there personal feelings come over into the moderator abilits thts just wrong man tht is what this thread is for trasj talk and discussion if it deals with the nfl this is where we talk about it. like i was once told in this very thread if u cant handle it either get a tissue or get out cause noone cares for ur feelings. on tht note have a nice day
I have an oppinion on something that you dont agree with and Im in the wrong b/c of it and Im the closed minded one?
No hippie no homo rule should be in-acted.
talk about someone lettin there personal feelings come over into the moderator abilits thts just wrong man tht is what this thread is for trasj talk and discussion if it deals with the nfl this is where we talk about it. like i was once told in this very thread if u cant handle it either get a tissue or get out cause noone cares for ur feelings. on tht note have a nice day
HUH???? I have not used any of my moderator abilities in this thread so far.
I think in the best interest in this thread that all other discussion about this subject should be in it's own separate thread.
that makes it easier should we have to lock it... This thread should be for the rest of the NFl talk. If the admins disagree they can over rule me on this.
BTW I really do not care for the tone of your post. I see you spread thinly supported accusations lightly.
Openly challenging a moderator over a moderating decision is against the TOS but since I have skated the edge of the TOS in this thread I will let it go.
gt40_2003wes
I did sound a wee bit gay there.
DocG
5th graders > me. They're not bant
@ CT.It'll still be funny when the Pats lose to the Bengals.
GO Palmer....you can defeat the homo Quinn!
