The ultimate bench race Cobra$$$ vs. 5.0$$$

1slow95 · Oct 23, 2005

94gts said:
when there is a debate going why is everyone so fast to bitch and whine for a lock?

Because it's a never ending debate when the debatee's have no intention of changing their minds. It just seems like pointless bickering at the moment because mr. kimsey doesn't seem to think stopping and turning are important reasons to buy a Cobra. He's living his life 10 seconds at a time.

mattkimsey · Oct 24, 2005

Low-5.0 said:
1. $4000 for 5 years of full coverage! Im paying $1400 a year for a 4-cyl Mazda!

NO, I was saying it would cost me 4k more than what I pay now---over the next 5 yrs.

BUT, I just checked with progressive and the Cobra with the economy full coverage plan would cost me $4691.70 per yr. !!!!!!!!! crapola

With the same company, liabilty on my '90 5.0 with the economy plan would cost $558.64 per yr.

I didn't realize it was this much! I can see why not many people under 30 don't drive Cobras!!! Over 5 yrs. that would cost me $20,665 EXTRA over 5yrs. JUST ON INSURANCE!!!! 4691.70 - 558.64 = $4133.06 X 5 = $20,665 OMG!!!! Someone tell me I'm wrong.

Low-5.0 said:
2. TTT on a $27K car should not be more than $1500 at the most. If you put no money down, then I could see it being close to $34K by the time it's paid off, but how many people(besides me ) would buy a $20K+ car with no money down?

You'd be surprised, many if not most, pay the minimum down payment.

Low-5.0 said:
3. Your average person is not going to do those mods and shoot for a 10.0. Maybe 12.0-11.0, but not 10.0.

In that case we would compare a 11.0-12.0 sec 5.0 to a 11.0-12.0 Cobra.

That insurance stuff has me scared.

mattkimsey · Oct 24, 2005

yellow1995Cobra said:
Basically what it comes down to is mattnub cant afford a cobra.. Obviously has horrible credit as well. Not our faults you cant pay your bills on time. Someone please lock these threads.

Please, I'm in college like a lot of Mustang owners. My figures for interest and TTT were very close to the # you stated. When you calculated, it was with a 5.x interest rate. The banks around here want atleast 8%. So, grow up and stop trying to make this thread personal.

1slow95 · Oct 24, 2005

I hate to agree with ya matt, but I think the insurance is why people don't buy 03 Cobra's. It's not the purchase price, or the fact that you might be able to go faster with a 5.0, it's the insane insurance rates that cost more than the car payment. If I remember correctly, I think that's why I completely gave up the idea of buying one.

That being said, why don't you change this comparison to a 5.0 vs. 03 Cobra based on initial prices alone, none of that interest, TTT, insurance bs. After all, if you seriously intend to run a 10.0 then it shouldn't be a problem to buy everything outright.

mattkimsey · Oct 24, 2005

So if we add up all the charges + little things and the new insurance findings.....it would cost me $51,795.45 + $23,458.20 = $75,253.65 to go 10.0 and own a Cobra for 5 yrs. Lets not bring in gas++maintnance+things that break....

mattkimsey · Oct 24, 2005

Low-5.0 said:
That being said, why don't you change this comparison to a 5.0 vs. 03 Cobra based on initial prices alone, none of that interest, TTT, insurance bs. After all, if you seriously intend to run a 10.0 then it shouldn't be a problem to buy everything outright.

Well, I would do that, but it wouldn't really make sense, for me. I wouldn't want to buy a Cobra and get blind sided by all the extra cost. The TTT, interest, insurance and stuff are real charges that have to be paid. Sure we could just compare a stock 5.0 for $5,000 and a stock Cobra for $27,000 and we could not include all the extra charges, but then it would just be a "pretend" comparison. I was actually thinking about saving up to buy a Cobra in next 1-1.5yrs, so I want to know ALL the cost.

1slow95 · Oct 24, 2005

Well isn't this comparison just "pretend" anyways? My point is that if your only goal is a 10.0 ET, the Cobra either will not be a good financial decision or the extra cost of the Cobra will not matter. Obviously you can't afford to make a Cobra run 10's, so the 5.0 makes much more sense in your case.

Now, lets compare the cost to run 11.5 or 11.0. Jesse run's 11.5's with his Cobra with less than $30K total in it(right?), not counting insurance. Now we need to put together a 5.0 that can run mid 11's with cold A/C, good handling and braking, 6-speed transmission, and excellent street manners for under $30K. That's the comparison I want to see.

BlackVert · Oct 24, 2005

Being someone who could do either, I'd rather take the $40K for the cobra and build up the one of the baddest SN95 5.0L street stangs around. For $40K, you can make it scary fast and also have perfect street manners.

If you put JR's stang next to a relatively stock Terminator, and we all know which one more people will flock to.

Just me ...

nmcgrawj · Oct 24, 2005

BlackVert said:
Being someone who could do either, I'd rather take the $40K for the cobra and build up the one of the baddest SN95 5.0L street stangs around. For $40K, you can make it scary fast and also have perfect street manners.

If you put JR's stang next to a relatively stock Terminator, and we all know which one more people will flock to.

Just me ...

$40k into a 5.0 will BLOW a cobra out of the water IMO. It should. Jay Allen is running 11's on a "basically stock cobra motor" with no big investsments. His plan is to run 10's n/a before switching out the heads. Im not sure if he has a/c, still a t-5 tranny i believe, but who cares. He still has plenty room to upgrade if he wanted. He's already running the times.

Now ofcourse his times come from knowledge and experience. But those guys are here for a reason, if u went to him or Ed C. or anyone else who knows their stuff and sat down with them, told them your wants, im sure they could get u to do the same thing.

I used to compare buying my GT or a 98+ transam. The trans would have given GREAT performance out of the box but lets face it...it would have looked like every other trans am out there. That same argument is used here, my 95 with $20k invested will be a ONE OF A KIND. Now if i bought the 03 cobra, it would look just like every other one out there...probably have the same mods or very similar.

What fun is that?

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

It's funny how when I mention insurance prices of 24k over 5 years all the "debators" suddenly crawl under a rock.

nmcgrawj, I agree with you. But, listening to some of these "racers" ----you need a twin turbo 514ci big block to run 10's

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

I wonder what Jay Allen would run with a 100 shot.

Black95GTS · Oct 25, 2005

mattkimsey said:
It's funny how when I mention insurance prices of 24k over 5 years all the "debators" suddenly crawl under a rock.

nmcgrawj, I agree with you. But, listening to some of these "racers" ----you need a twin turbo 514ci big block to run 10's

Well Jesse is paying off his Cobra in ONE year, and I GUARANTEE that the cobra is on the road here in New England for 5 months of the year tops. So figure that into your calculator.

How much is your time worth to you? I bet the total time it takes to do the mods on his Cobra adds up to 2-4 days, while the time to build your Fox into a 10 second reliable street/strip car will take years. Factor that into consideration. You're underneath your car on your back spraying Mr. Wrench into 12 year old exhaust bolts on a 95 degree day while he's by the pool drinking a beer and his car will still be faster.

adam

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

Black95GTS said:
Well Jesse is paying off his Cobra in ONE year, and I GUARANTEE that the cobra is on the road here in New England for 5 months of the year tops. So figure that into your calculator.

That is one individual, most people under 27-28 will be paying on a 27k car more than one year and diving it more than 5 months. This whole thread was about the average stanger and what it would cost me, also.

Black95GTS said:
How much is your time worth to you? I bet the total time it takes to do the mods on his Cobra adds up to 2-4 days, while the time to build your Fox into a 10 second reliable street/strip car will take years. Factor that into consideration.

That's a given when building a hotrod......should guys building old muscle cars stop and buy newer cars? I doubt they would....it's fun to build a car and sit back looking at what you created. That's what it's all about really.

Black95GTS said:
You're underneath your car on your back spraying Mr. Wrench into 12 year old exhaust bolts on a 95 degree day while he's by the pool drinking a beer and his car will still be faster.

I guess I should buy a Cobra for 75k and drive by all the gear heads reving my car yelling "hey biznatches, I'm going to play in my swimin' pool!!!"

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

I guess you could also flip the scenario you gave around. When a 03/04 Cobra is 15 yrs. old, are you gonna say they aren't worth modding to run with the big boys in 2020?

Black95GTS · Oct 25, 2005

No I dont think you could flip that situation around. That has nothing to do with an '03 Cobra vs. a Fox buildup.

Time is NOT a given. It's the biggest advantage in the Cobra. You could take all that extra time and put it into seat time at the track. Or whatever you choose. I used the pool as an example, because I have a pool and I do pull exhaust bolts out in 95 degree heat on my back getting Mr. Wrench in my eye. And it sucks.

I think the title of this thread should be: Can Matt Kimsey afford an '03 Cobra? The answer is: No, he can't. So buy a Fox, build it up, and enjoy it.

adam

Rootus · Oct 25, 2005

mattkimsey said:
~$34k w/ interest over 5 yrs. (remember, I, like most, can’t pay cash)

-Car $3000 (paid cash, just liability insurance)

See, right there all your credibility goes to hell. For one, you're comparing used price on a 5.0 to the brand new MSRP on a Cobra? I paid $23.9K for my Cobra. And almost three times what you quote for my 5.0.

-Insurance at least $4000 more (full coverage—car not payed for)

My Cobra costs less to insure than my '95 GT does. And I have full coverage on either one because I'd like to get something back if it's wrecked.

-Taxes at least $1500 more over 5 yrs.

Taxes? What taxes?

-Kenne Bell S/C $4000
-Level 5’s $2500

Finally something you're closer on. Shop around, though, you can get DSS level 5's for less than that.

-T56 rebuild at least $1200 (stocker wouldn’t be too reliable at 10.0)

All you need is an input shaft & clutch, it'll go 10's for at least as long as that TKO you're budgeting for the 5.0.

Would this be enough to go 10.0 in the Cobra?

Depends on if you can drive. People have gone 9's in Cobras with what you described.

So I'd have about $30K into the Cobra ... including the car ... to go 10's. Yay. And I could sell that right now for ... wait for it ... at least $25K. I'd have about $22K into my '95 to do the same thing (again including the car) ... and I could sell it now for ... hmmm, $7500 perhaps.

You're a troll.

nmcgrawj · Oct 25, 2005

Hey Rootus(is dave your real name? I cant remember....)

Anyway, how the hell does your cobra cost less to insure than a 10 year old gt with half the power?!

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

Rootus said:
See, right there all your credibility goes to hell. For one, you're comparing used price on a 5.0 to the brand new MSRP on a Cobra?

Your reading skills went to hell way before my credibility That 34k was with a 27k purchase price + interest at 7-9% and TTT which would be about $1200. Nice try though!

Rootus said:
I paid $23.9K for my Cobra. And almost three times what you quote for my 5.0.

We aren't talking about YOUR 5.0. Also, who in theor right mind would pay 9k for a 5.0 if they had intentions of 10.0? Another thing, when did you buy your 5.0? 5 yrs ago?

Rootus said:
My Cobra costs less to insure than my '95 GT does. And I have full coverage on either one because I'd like to get something back if it's wrecked.

That's swell, but insurance for anyone in the state of NC in their 20's is going to run about 4-5k per year. Full coverage on a 5.0 is about $600.....but who pay higher insurance on a foxbody with a book value of 2k? Nobody! I imagine these rates are about the same in most if not all states.

Rootus said:
Taxes? What taxes?

Ok, see, you have to pay these things every year, they are called taxes. The rate is based on the value of your car.....cheaper car=less taxes. I feel like I'm talkin' to 5 yr. olds

Rootus said:
Finally something you're closer on. Shop around, though, you can get DSS level 5's for less than that.

and I actually left some things out. After seaching on svtperformance a while, I find that the total is closer to $3000 with everything you need.

Rootus said:
All you need is an input shaft & clutch, it'll go 10's for at least as long as that TKO you're budgeting for the 5.0.

Thats an easy fix, we can upgrade the tko500 to a 600 for $100....now we a 5.0 with a trans. rated @ 600lb ft. and a t56@450lb ft......which is going to last longer? The 3800lb. car with a weaker trans. or the 3100lb car with a stronger trans. You be the judge. Remember, I said reliable, so having a stock t56 hold up at 10.0 for one racing season aint gonna cut it!

Rootus said:
So I'd have about $30K into the Cobra ... including the car ... to go 10's. Yay.

Now that the funniest thing I've heard in a dogs age!!! For 5 yrs. of ownership the insurance alone would cost me $20,000 over a 5.0, the taxes would be over $1,000, the car goes for 25-27k...that's almost $47,000 and I haven't even started modding it or adding safety equipment. Anyway, to run 10.0 and keep the car for 5 yrs. it came out to over $70,000.00

Rootus said:
And I could sell that right now for ... wait for it ... at least $25K.

That would give me close to a 50,000 loss compared to the $10,000 loss I would take on the 5.0 50k loss make me real sad

Rootus said:
I'd have about $22K into my '95 to do the same thing (again including the car) ... and I could sell it now for ... hmmm, $7500 perhaps.

So let me get this straight, you paid ~9,000 for a stock 5.0 and a dart based 347 with a blower, tko-600, built rear, new paint, and rims will sell for $7500? OMG you have just killed any credability you may have been hanging on to. That was almost as worse as you 30k=10.0 argument. Anyone who reads your statements as truth is a fool.

Rootus said:
You're a troll.

Rootus said:
I'd have about $22K into my '95 to do the same thing (again including the car)

to run 10.0

Rootus said:
... and I could sell it now for ... hmmm, $7500 perhaps

mattkimsey · Oct 25, 2005

nmcgrawj said:
Hey Rootus(is dave your real name? I cant remember....)

Anyway, how the hell does your cobra cost less to insure than a 10 year old gt with half the power?!

I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that he is almost 32, a good bit older than most of us. Just for kicks, I got a quote for someone 32 and it was over $2200 a year. Insurance on a 5.0 would be about $150 per year for someone 32.

nmcgrawj · Oct 25, 2005

mattkimsey said:
I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that he is almost 32, a good bit older than most of us. Just for kicks, I got a quote for someone 32 and it was over $2200 a year. Insurance on a 5.0 would be about $150 per year for someone 32.

So isnt that still less than half the cost to insure a 5.0 compared to a cobra?

The ultimate bench race Cobra$$$ vs. 5.0$$$

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