I have a 65 vert that is in excellent condition. I posted here back in the summer about converting to a V8 and got my head chewed off about the convertion. And you're right. I'm better off keeping it stock. What I want to know is what's the most I'm ever going to get out of a six? Intake, exhaust, cams, will they make a ton of difference? Can I just put the original motor aside and get a 200 that's already built up? Are there any companies that do this?
What's the most you're ever going to get out of a 200cid?
- Thread starter glennv
- Start date
eric n
Founding Member
glennv said:
Hi glen,
Sorry you got your head chewed off over your conversion idea. I've never done a conversion, but understand it tends to make a lot more sense (financially as well as time wise) just to find a vert already set up with an 8. But, I (not an expert) don't think you are ever going to get a lot of power out of a 200. I'm going to assume you have decided not to even look for a v8 rag top, so you might just want to enjoy the great gas milage and be a lover not a fighter.
OK. I have to come clean. I have not completely ditched the conversion idea. Here the deal with the car. My family purchased it new. I never plan on selling it and could care less about the car's value. I had it appraised and the guy who did it said I shouldn't do anything to it. He said it is worth more as is. Original paint, wheels, windows, you name it, it's original and in excellent shape. (Over use of the comma.) But I don't care about value. I also don't care if I spend 20K getting this car that isn't ever going to be worth half that. I just want to get it to where I am happy. A V8 would make me very happy. It just seems that there is an endless supply of v8 parts and mods. Not much out there of the six bangers.
I know most of the guys here say don't do it because of the cost but would that change if you knew you were never going to part with the car and you didn't care about the fact that you can buy a restored one for half of what you are going to spend on the work.
Truth be told, I plan to replace the entire suspension and convert to disc brakes anyway. That being said, what would you do? That puts me how far from a conversion? FLAME AWAY GUYS!
I know most of the guys here say don't do it because of the cost but would that change if you knew you were never going to part with the car and you didn't care about the fact that you can buy a restored one for half of what you are going to spend on the work.
Truth be told, I plan to replace the entire suspension and convert to disc brakes anyway. That being said, what would you do? That puts me how far from a conversion? FLAME AWAY GUYS!
Glenn-
It is possible to get more power out of the I-6...a good site to check out for ideas is here:
http://www.cliffordperformance.com/home.htm
Good luck with your project!
I too have toyed with the conversion idea, but have decided to keep my 6. I do however intend to upgrade my suspension to a V-8 suspension for a number of reasons.............
It is possible to get more power out of the I-6...a good site to check out for ideas is here:
http://www.cliffordperformance.com/home.htm
Good luck with your project!
I too have toyed with the conversion idea, but have decided to keep my 6. I do however intend to upgrade my suspension to a V-8 suspension for a number of reasons.............
depend son how you build the engine and what you are looking for from it. for a daily driver you can get about 150-175hp from the 200 without losing driveability, with a turbo figure about 220-230hp. that may not sound like much compared to a V8, but remember you are going to be carrying about 150lbs less weight. you can buy rebuilt 200's and swap whatever cam you like in the motor. you can also buy an aussie head from www.fordsixparts.com and bolt it on whatever 144-250 six you choose.
eric n
Founding Member
glennv said:
With this frame of reference, make the change. Are you planning on twisting your own wrenches or hiring it out?
www.fordsixparts.com is a great place . Clifford tends to be very expensive, but is designing a aluminum head with removable intake. You might want to look into a 4cyl T5 to go behind it. I had planned on putting a 390 in mine but decided against it. Since. its a 65, you can convert to disc brakes without switching to the v8 suspension. Wish they made the kit for later models.
V8 swaps are not the hardest thing ever as many people say. My second motor swap in my life was to put the v8 in my car. It was time consuming (i did most of the work myself), but worth it and not very expensive(<$5000). I did not have to replace the front suspension except brakes and springs on my 68. The i6 suspension on 65s has weaker parts; as long as you understand that you will be replacing nearly everything on the car, you should not have any surprises.
*cough* I ran the i6 rear end for 6 months til it popped, still have the i6 c4. I have an AOD, but waiting for $$....
So...... Go for it.
*cough* I ran the i6 rear end for 6 months til it popped, still have the i6 c4. I have an AOD, but waiting for $$....
So...... Go for it.
Now that turbo idea sounds hot, but wouldn't that push me up into the same dollar range as a complete v8 conversion? Again, I'm not worried about the cost as much as the availablity of parts and my ability to install them. I really want to do as much of the work as possible because I enjoy the work and I love to learn. I have been wrenching on my Jeeps for years and am a quick learner. What would be more realistic? Going nuts with the six or going to an eight?
eric n
Founding Member
glennv said:
How much performance are you looking for 175, 200, 350??? It depends on what you mean by performance. If you are looking for 200+ at the rears, which is where respectable, but hardly fast begins. going with an 8 makes the most sense for drivability, performance, ease of maintanence, parts availability..... It's a big gig, but from what you've said, I don't think anything else makes sense. Then again there are many on the board more Me knowlegable than I MANY MANY MANY....
Just keep all the i-6 stuff.If you want power, go for the V8 conversion. IIRC, in your previous posting you let on that your skills were a bit limited, and you got the appropriate advice.
If you're not happy with what you have now, just change it to what you do want. If happiness is the issue, then money probably isn't as big an issue.
The only thing you should think about is whether or not you want to do a FULL conversion, meaning not just the engine, but all the other things that go with it, such as suspension, 5 lug conversion, etc. Its your car though, you can do as little or as much as you like.
If you're not happy with what you have now, just change it to what you do want. If happiness is the issue, then money probably isn't as big an issue.
The only thing you should think about is whether or not you want to do a FULL conversion, meaning not just the engine, but all the other things that go with it, such as suspension, 5 lug conversion, etc. Its your car though, you can do as little or as much as you like.
My father and I did the 6 to 8 conversion on my fastback. It took some time, patience, and money, but it turned out real well. Would we do it again? No, but we dont regret doing it on the fastback. It just takes alot of time, and patience.
If you try and buy as much as you can USED, you'll save alot of money. I had a donor car for the spindles, tranny, driveshaft, rearend, and hubs, and had a 289 from the car that i wrecked, so pretty much all I needed were small conversion stuff. Actually it only took a few months just working on the weekends to get the conversion done. Its taken alot longer though to get my engine running right, and to do cosmetics.
So if i were you, I'd do the conversion. You may get some good power out of the 200ci eventually, but the V8 just has that great sound to it.
If you try and buy as much as you can USED, you'll save alot of money. I had a donor car for the spindles, tranny, driveshaft, rearend, and hubs, and had a 289 from the car that i wrecked, so pretty much all I needed were small conversion stuff. Actually it only took a few months just working on the weekends to get the conversion done. Its taken alot longer though to get my engine running right, and to do cosmetics.
So if i were you, I'd do the conversion. You may get some good power out of the 200ci eventually, but the V8 just has that great sound to it.
If the v8 you're thinking about is a stock/mild 302 or something, I say just build up the six. A hot six is more of an eye catcher. I disagree with ease of maintanence of v8 over the six. Everything is within easy reach on the six, heck I change the oil from under the hood.
SadbutTrue
Founding Member
as far a six goes, either keep your six or go for a 250... then go with a hot cam and aussie head and you could approach 200 hp N/A, prolly slightly past it with a 250. Nitrous is supposed to work really well with these engines, if you want to go any further than 200, which is good for 14s I do believe..
to all you naysayers about ford six performance, mandarinracing on the fordsix forums went 14.50 in the 1/4 with a mildly hopped up six and a 50hp shot of nitrous. if you are looking for 10's with a six, it can be done but you wont have a daily driver, 14's and you can have a daily driver that wont beat everybody, but then who here has a car that is underfeated?
dodgestang
Active Member
While it is true in general that an excellent condition un-modifyied mustang will be worth more on the market than a modifyied one, you sometimes need to examine exactly what the difference in price is.
Case in point: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2467184732&category=6236
Started life as a 6 cylinder and its over 20k....(in case you are wondering this car caught my eye because of the amazing similarities between it and the Death Trap in my garage)
With that said....
It is your car, you have expressed a strong feeling of keeping it forever, do what you want, collect all the advise you want, but ultimately YOU make the choices, do what you want.
If you heavily modify your 6 to get a lot of power out of.....with some moderately priced parts you should be able to get at least 1.2 HP/Cube out of it and with some pricier custom work with turbos you can get a lot more but all this stuff "modifies the car" and it is no longer original.
So I say, if you want an 8 make an 8, MCA concourse and therobred (Spell?) trailer division all have other sporty anc fun cars to drive because they can't/won't drive their mustangs. I look at it in much simplier terms, as long as your not cutting out the shock towers, or tubbing the rear end, etc...anything you do to the car is revesible....if you put the v8 spindles, rear, tranny, brakes, suspension on the car you have made the car safer and more reliable even if you still have a I6 in it
.....then you can add the v8 too and have alot more power on hand. Just put all the parts you remove in a box and stick it in the attic....if heaven forbid you need to sell the car one day..you can sell it as a modified 6banger with all the parts still available to do a full concourse restoration 
(might even make more than market price then)
Case in point: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2467184732&category=6236
Started life as a 6 cylinder and its over 20k....(in case you are wondering this car caught my eye because of the amazing similarities between it and the Death Trap in my garage)
With that said....
It is your car, you have expressed a strong feeling of keeping it forever, do what you want, collect all the advise you want, but ultimately YOU make the choices, do what you want.
If you heavily modify your 6 to get a lot of power out of.....with some moderately priced parts you should be able to get at least 1.2 HP/Cube out of it and with some pricier custom work with turbos you can get a lot more but all this stuff "modifies the car" and it is no longer original.
So I say, if you want an 8 make an 8, MCA concourse and therobred (Spell?) trailer division all have other sporty anc fun cars to drive because they can't/won't drive their mustangs. I look at it in much simplier terms, as long as your not cutting out the shock towers, or tubbing the rear end, etc...anything you do to the car is revesible....if you put the v8 spindles, rear, tranny, brakes, suspension on the car you have made the car safer and more reliable even if you still have a I6 in it
.....then you can add the v8 too and have alot more power on hand. Just put all the parts you remove in a box and stick it in the attic....if heaven forbid you need to sell the car one day..you can sell it as a modified 6banger with all the parts still available to do a full concourse restoration (might even make more than market price then)Try lightly modding the six, but go ahead with the suspension and brake upgrades. Also, the upgrade to an overdrive tranny with some lower gears out back may make enough of a difference.
Check out http://fordsix.com/forum/
It is a very informative site and the folks their can give you a good idea about the performance to be expected out of a streetable 200 combo.
Check out http://fordsix.com/forum/
It is a very informative site and the folks their can give you a good idea about the performance to be expected out of a streetable 200 combo.
