Why Wouldn't I Just Install A 10lb Spring And Be Done With It?

CarMichael Angelo · Jun 26, 2015

Since the wastegates are technically off, I got to thinking about that. Since I'm hobbled w/ a stock HG,and therefore limited to 10lbs or so max boost, why wouldn't I just remove the 5lb springs, and replace them with the 10 pounders? Rather than go through a (what looks like a complex process) of setting up the MS to regulate the boost via the boost control solenoid, doesn't it make sense to just "set it and forget it" by installing the appropriate spring?

rdharper02 · Jun 27, 2015

Mike, the MS controlling the boost is an awesome set-up, but how much do you plan on playing with the boost? Do you think you may need to reduce boost below 10 lbs for any reason? You can mask vacuum to increase boost via manual or solenoid controller, but can't go the other direction. I'm personally getting to the point that I do not plan to screw around with much after I get things set. Still deciding on electronic boost control for the new build, but even considering simplifying everything in the car. The suspension may get this treatment with some MM components here shortly. Do I really need adjustable uppers/lowers (or the added noise)? My toy is not a true Drag car, how much adjustment do I really need for the weekend cruise? Just my two cents.

CarMichael Angelo · Jun 27, 2015

rdharper02 said:
Mike, the MS controlling the boost is an awesome set-up, but how much do you plan on playing with the boost? Do you think you may need to reduce boost below 10 lbs for any reason? You can mask vacuum to increase boost via manual or solenoid controller, but can't go the other direction. I'm personally getting to the point that I do not plan to screw around with much after I get things set. Still deciding on electronic boost control for the new build, but even considering simplifying everything in the car. The suspension may get this treatment with some MM components here shortly. Do I really need adjustable uppers/lowers (or the added noise)? My toy is not a true Drag car, how much adjustment do I really need for the weekend cruise? Just my two cents.

That's the point of my question. I don't intend to try to alter the boost (why would I?) After the car is tuned for ten, then I'm done.

rdharper02 · Jun 27, 2015

I think you answered your own question, but following your posts over the years, I know you will find a reason to change it out. (Apply thumbs up icon here).

CarMichael Angelo · Jun 27, 2015

rdharper02 said:
I think you answered your own question, but following your posts over the years, I know you will find a reason to change it out. (Apply thumbs up icon here).

Uhh nope. The reason for the question was to determine if I could rely on the spring for an "actual" 10 lbs, or whether I was gonna have to use the boost controller to get it to the exact number. The boost controller is installed, the electronic mod is made to the ECU, I just don't trust that
A. I wired/soldered it correctly into the MSII board.
B. I don't have a clue how to go about setting the boost limits in Tunerstudio?

Since it's all done, all I really gotta do is wait until the day comes that I gotta worry about boost. But, again if all I had to do was pop those wastegates open, change a spring, and NOT have to worry about boost.............

Just sayin.

If the springs are accurate, and by changing them out I get a BOOM! automatic 10 lbs, then I never activate the boost controller in TS. If, on the other hand trying to rely on a spring that gives me 8,9, or 11 lbs instead, and the only way to get a 100% dead on boost number is by using the controller, THEN I've answered my own question.

rdharper02 · Jun 27, 2015

Got it. I can't recall what name you went with, but know my Tial waste gate and Mitsu BOV held a solid 9#s (as springed). I expected slight spikes, but never registered them on the gauge. Honest answer, the springs could be slightly off. Your gauge is ultimately going to be the only thing to tell you they are rock solid.

Boosted92LX · Jun 27, 2015

Mike, My on3 waste gate that crapped out had a 7lb spring I believe and would only put up 5 or 6 at best without a boost controller to dial it in. After it died I bought a precision turbo brand WG and it would only do 7 psi with the 15lb spring(s) in it.. My point is, don't count on the spring getting you where you want to be, because chances are, it won't. At least that's been my experience. I just bought a Turbosmart manual boost controller for 70 or 80 bucks and dialed it in.

Boosted92LX · Jun 27, 2015

Oh, btw.. I had my car tuned on 10 psi, and I turned it down to 7 to work out a spark issue.. I got it straightened back out and noticed that my AFR was still good on 7psi vs 10 psi... same tune, no fuss, just less boost.

FastDriver · Jun 27, 2015

In my 2 turbo combos, I has 10psi springs that kept the boost at 9.5 on the gauge. I had 16 psi spring that kept it right where it was supposed to. A 3.6 psi spring did the same. If I were you, I'd probably just put on in and be done with it. If it's off by 2psi, then move to a slightly bigger spring. Tial does say that there is always a little room for error, even though I had pretty good luck with them.

Boosted92LX · Jun 27, 2015

FastDriver said:
In my 2 turbo combos, I has 10psi springs that kept the boost at 9.5 on the gauge. I had 16 psi spring that kept it right where it was supposed to. A 3.6 psi spring did the same. If I were you, I'd probably just put on in and be done with it. If it's off by 2psi, then move to a slightly bigger spring. Tial does say that there is always a little room for error, even though I had pretty good luck with them.

Are those both Tial wastegates?

FastDriver · Jun 27, 2015

No, my first incon twin-turbo combo has internal wastegates.

The 16 and 3.6 were both in the same 46mm WG on my current combo.

CarMichael Angelo · Jun 27, 2015

Ok,..it seems that the simple solution, to avoid having to remove the rear wastegate is to rely on the boost controller. The rear wastegate was off this morning, but now it's back on. It is a GIANT pain in the ass to remove, so....

Boost controller.

Why Wouldn't I Just Install A 10lb Spring And Be Done With It?

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

rdharper02

like kicking myself in the junk

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

rdharper02

like kicking myself in the junk

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

rdharper02

like kicking myself in the junk

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

FastDriver

I was uncomfortably high & wearing a helmet

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

FastDriver

I was uncomfortably high & wearing a helmet

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

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Why Wouldn't I Just Install A 10lb Spring And Be Done With It?

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It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

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