Xenon light bulbs and Plasma light bulbs for headlights?

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

I saw some Plasma bulbs that cost $85.00 each at automotive parts store.
I looked in the CJ Pony catalog and see that they sell Xenon bulbs at 24.95 each. Are these those blue bulbs and do they really help your night vision?
They also have them in 100 watts vs. 65/45.
What makes the Plasma lightbulbs for headlights so expensive?
These are both just light bulbs for your headlights that you can put into your Fox 5.0 Mustang but I wonder for the headlights that are 100 watts require some type of wiring upgrade for these old fox stangs?

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

Forgot to mention that there is also the HID headlight system and I know you can see better with these at night but they were not available for the 87-93 Stangs.
Projector headlight lenses do these help your night vision?
So many different kinds of lightbulbs and headlight systems

Darkwriter77 · Sep 1, 2009

They do make true HID systems for '87-'93 Mustangs. However, their performance can either be so-so or a complete waste of money, depending on which kit you get. Some have a fancy adapter to plug into the stock wiring harness and fit into the stock lens housing; these tend to suck because not only are the stock lenses usually garbage to start with, especially since they're not designed for HID bulbs (light distribution pattern is different), but using the stock wiring is a bad idea because they were never designed to handle the kinds of electrical loads you'll see when using a true HID setup. Also, a lot of those plug-in HID kits have crappy ballasts that tend to poop out early and/or the bulbs don't last that long.

The fancy-schmancy non-HID bulbs are, IMO, a ripoff gimmick. People always scream and yell and get all pissy when I say this, but those Silverstar brand bulbs - the ones that say right on the package "gives the LOOK of HID" - are a ripoff, especially since they cost 2 or 3 times as much as a normal replacement bulb. While they are slightly brighter than stock bulbs, they're honestly the EXACT SAME THING as the Sylvania XtraVision bulbs (made by the same company) except they have that stupid blue tint sprayed on the bulbs to make it LOOK like you're getting "whiter" light. Remember, coloring the bulb does nothing to improve light output; any time you color a transparent surface, you are FILTERING the light spectrum that's being allowed to pass through it, so you are not allowing the full amount of light to be transmitted. (Same as when you put tint on your car windows ... which, coincidentally, usually tends to have a blue-ish color to it.)

Because the stock lenses always tend to go yellow and they're a pain to polish all the time to keep halfway clear, your best bet is to buy a set of "crystal clear" type headlight lenses and just some good OEM replacement bulbs (I'd recommend Sylvania XtraVision). Those "focused beam" or "Euro style" lenses they sell not only tend to make the light pattern worse for your car, directing the light in all sorts of crazy ways, but they're also friggin' hideous (makes your car look like some kind of fat ugly square spider on wheels).

Another upgrade you might consider is the headlight relay mod. It's very cheap and (if you're handy with wiring) is pretty easy to do, but it is pretty technical and you have to have at least some moderate ability with electrical work (and reading wiring diagrams). I don't have a link to the how-to right off hand. Basically, the way your lights are wired up from stock carries a lot of the current over long distances through fairly skinny wires all the way from the battery to the switch and then to the lights; the relay mod has the current only going a short distance from the battery to the relays (usually mounted on or near the radiator support) and then straight to the lights with larger-diameter wiring. The result is MUCH brighter headlights, even with stock bulbs and lenses, and I have read that some have found this to be nearly as bright a setup as those fancy HID kits ... but without the hassle of ballasts and fancy n' expensive true HID bulbs.

Couple the relay mod with some nice clear lenses and some quality bulbs, and you'll have headlights that'll be visible from the moon. ...AND also blind everyone going the other direction, so expect to have people flashing their high-beams at you on a regular basis.

90mustangGT · Sep 1, 2009

I say if you have good headlamps and lenses you shouldn't have a problem seeing at night. These HID and super bright lights will only cause you more problems, blind the person comming the other way can be bad for your health.

Mustang5L5 · Sep 1, 2009

Also, blue light is very tough to see. The human eye cannot see much into the blue spectrum. We see better in the yellow spectrum of light...that's why a lot of bulbs tend to be yellow. Fog lights are especially yellow because they are used in rain and other situations where you need every bit of advantage you can get.

Stock OEM HID bulbs are 4300K. I beleive in Europe, they use 5000K for their bulbs. The higher in K value you go, the bluer the light and the less you see. SO these 8K, 10K and 12K HID kits are DIMMER than stock.

I changed my G35's OEM HID's to 6000K just to get a little more color. I changed the foglights to 3000K though. WHen i flip the fogs on at night, the difference is HUGE. I can see!!

LarsD · Sep 1, 2009

the other good thing about the relay mod is it is likely going to draw less amperage through your headlight switch. This cuts down on the possibility that the plug on the back of the switch will melt.

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
They do make true HID systems for '87-'93 Mustangs. However, their performance can either be so-so or a complete waste of money, depending on which kit you get. Some have a fancy adapter to plug into the stock wiring harness and fit into the stock lens housing; these tend to suck because not only are the stock lenses usually garbage to start with, especially since they're not designed for HID bulbs (light distribution pattern is different), but using the stock wiring is a bad idea because they were never designed to handle the kinds of electrical loads you'll see when using a true HID setup. Also, a lot of those plug-in HID kits have crappy ballasts that tend to poop out early and/or the bulbs don't last that long.

The fancy-schmancy non-HID bulbs are, IMO, a ripoff gimmick. People always scream and yell and get all pissy when I say this, but those Silverstar brand bulbs - the ones that say right on the package "gives the LOOK of HID" - are a ripoff, especially since they cost 2 or 3 times as much as a normal replacement bulb. While they are slightly brighter than stock bulbs, they're honestly the EXACT SAME THING as the Sylvania XtraVision bulbs (made by the same company) except they have that stupid blue tint sprayed on the bulbs to make it LOOK like you're getting "whiter" light. Remember, coloring the bulb does nothing to improve light output; any time you color a transparent surface, you are FILTERING the light spectrum that's being allowed to pass through it, so you are not allowing the full amount of light to be transmitted. (Same as when you put tint on your car windows ... which, coincidentally, usually tends to have a blue-ish color to it.)

Because the stock lenses always tend to go yellow and they're a pain to polish all the time to keep halfway clear, your best bet is to buy a set of "crystal clear" type headlight lenses and just some good OEM replacement bulbs (I'd recommend Sylvania XtraVision). Those "focused beam" or "Euro style" lenses they sell not only tend to make the light pattern worse for your car, directing the light in all sorts of crazy ways, but they're also friggin' hideous (makes your car look like some kind of fat ugly square spider on wheels).

Another upgrade you might consider is the headlight relay mod. It's very cheap and (if you're handy with wiring) is pretty easy to do, but it is pretty technical and you have to have at least some moderate ability with electrical work (and reading wiring diagrams). I don't have a link to the how-to right off hand. Basically, the way your lights are wired up from stock carries a lot of the current over long distances through fairly skinny wires all the way from the battery to the switch and then to the lights; the relay mod has the current only going a short distance from the battery to the relays (usually mounted on or near the radiator support) and then straight to the lights with larger-diameter wiring. The result is MUCH brighter headlights, even with stock bulbs and lenses, and I have read that some have found this to be nearly as bright a setup as those fancy HID kits ... but without the hassle of ballasts and fancy n' expensive true HID bulbs.

Couple the relay mod with some nice clear lenses and some quality bulbs, and you'll have headlights that'll be visible from the moon. ...AND also blind everyone going the other direction, so expect to have people flashing their high-beams at you on a regular basis.

great info
When you speak of the Sylvania Xtra vision bulbs do you mean those are the newest/latest of brighter bulbs from Sylvania Silverstars? Like There is the 9004 ST2 Silverstars for 39.95. Now I also saw another pair that cost $10.00 more the 9004 Xtra for $49.95 a pair.
These Silverstars are suppose to be just plug in replacements no re-wiring required as far as I know.
Some of the 1988 Mustangs came from factory with defective fog light circuit where it would cut on and off because of overload circuit breaker kicks in.
We had a mechanic fix that wiring so that we can now have H-1 100 watt fogs that will scald your hands.
Then we had a ugraded 130 amp alternator installed. Nothing on the headlight circuitry as it is just plain stock. This being the case then it would not be a good idea to buy those Delta bulbs that are 100/80 watts bulbs for headlights at $24.95 per bulb? Just stick with the 65/45 Silverstars? Unless you do have the headlight wiring upgraded for higher wattage brighter headlights?

Sylvania sells two different types of fog light bulbs the H-3 which is like $4.95 per bulb and Silverstar fog light bulbs for $20.00 each. They used to sell the H-1 100 plain bulb like its counterpart H3 55 watt bulb.
Big difference in price.
Now if you install those amber fog lights I see you wouldn't want any of those blue bulb types right? As I do notice that the Sylvania Silver star fog light bulbs are NOT blue. The headlight bulbs are.

I did see those crystal clear lights which is a 3 set system on each side and there might be some modifcations needed to fit. They cost $249.95 a pair
The Genuine Ford Headlight costs 100 per headlight with adjuster plate and seal. The reproduction headlight is yet the lowest in cost (made in Taiwan) maybe 69.95 per headlight complete assembly kit the brand is called "Depot" from LateModelRestoration.

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

Mustang5L5 said:
Also, blue light is very tough to see. The human eye cannot see much into the blue spectrum. We see better in the yellow spectrum of light...that's why a lot of bulbs tend to be yellow. Fog lights are especially yellow because they are used in rain and other situations where you need every bit of advantage you can get.

Stock OEM HID bulbs are 4300K. I beleive in Europe, they use 5000K for their bulbs. The higher in K value you go, the bluer the light and the less you see. SO these 8K, 10K and 12K HID kits are DIMMER than stock.

I changed my G35's OEM HID's to 6000K just to get a little more color. I changed the foglights to 3000K though. WHen i flip the fogs on at night, the difference is HUGE. I can see!!

A long time ago fog lights used to be amber or yellow nowadays thery are clear white and are also called driving lights from the factory. I know that there is a difference between driving lights which are usually white and real foglights that used to be yellow.
The brands were Hella, Marchal, CIBIE sold them way back then I heard in the 70's.

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

90mustangGT said:
I say if you have good headlamps and lenses you shouldn't have a problem seeing at night. These HID and super bright lights will only cause you more problems, blind the person comming the other way can be bad for your health.

Well I saw some "Plasma" bulbswhatever those are and they cost $85.00 per bulb.

Darkwriter77 · Sep 1, 2009

Mercedez said:
great info
When you speak of the Sylvania Xtra vision bulbs do you mean those are the newest/latest of brighter bulbs from Sylvania Silverstars? Like There is the 9004 ST2 Silverstars for 39.95. Now I also saw another pair that cost $10.00 more the 9004 Xtra for $49.95 a pair.
These Silverstars are suppose to be just plug in replacements no re-wiring required as far as I know.
Some of the 1988 Mustangs came from factory with defective fog light circuit where it would cut on and off because of overload circuit breaker kicks in.
We had a mechanic fix that wiring so that we can now have H-1 100 watt fogs that will scald your hands.
Then we had a ugraded 130 amp alternator installed. Nothing on the headlight circuitry as it is just plain stock. This being the case then it would not be a good idea to buy those Delta bulbs that are 100/80 watts bulbs for headlights at $24.95 per bulb? Just stick with the 65/45 Silverstars? Unless you do have the headlight wiring upgraded for higher wattage brighter headlights?

Sylvania sells two different types of fog light bulbs the H-3 which is like $4.95 per bulb and Silverstar fog light bulbs for $20.00 each. They used to sell the H-1 100 plain bulb like its counterpart H3 55 watt bulb.
Big difference in price.
Now if you install those amber fog lights I see you wouldn't want any of those blue bulb types right? As I do notice that the Sylvania Silver star fog light bulbs are NOT blue. The headlight bulbs are.

I did see those crystal clear lights which is a 3 set system on each side and there might be some modifcations needed to fit. They cost $249.95 a pair
The Genuine Ford Headlight costs 100 per headlight with adjuster plate and seal. The reproduction headlight is yet the lowest in cost (made in Taiwan) maybe 69.95 per headlight complete assembly kit the brand is called "Depot" from LateModelRestoration.

No, Sylvania XtraVision bulbs are just regular OEM-type bulbs of a slightly higher output. Not sure how they achieve this, either with slightly higher wattage or a different gas fill other than halogen, or whatever, but it definitely does work. GE sells bulbs like this that are equivalent, they're just labeled "High Output" or have "HO" in the part number (9004HO). Last I looked, you can score a pair of them for less than $30, and they're worth every penny.

Again, Silverstars are just XtraVision bulbs with a blue tint. Sylvania also sells (or used to sell) a "Cool Blue" bulb which was just the standard OEM bulb painted blue, making it even more lame than the standard OEM replacement bulbs - same bulb, less light output due to passing through a color-filtered barrier. Any higher-end Silverstars are just a ripoff on top of a ripoff, IMO. Kind of like some joke Pops always loves to use: "What's the white stuff on chicken poop? More chicken poop."

Absolutely DO NOT try to poke higher-wattage bulbs into the stock sockets using the stock wiring. The stock wiring arrangement is a bad idea to start with - again, it's already pulling way too much current through way too far a distance, creating way too much resistance - and trying to draw even MORE current through there is a good way to melt wires and start an electrical fire. Think of a wire as being like a hose; the smaller the hose, the less you can pull through there, and the harder you have to push to get the same amount through there. And the longer the hose, the more effort it takes to push whatever through there, too. Except when you try to push too much current through too small a gauge of wire, instead of it simply popping like a hose would, it builds up lots of heat until it ignites the wire insulation and/or whatever else is around it. Not good.

If you do the relay mod, using heavier-gauge wire, THEN you can run higher-wattage bulbs. Otherwise, you're ... ahem ... playing with fire.

As a side note, I hope that when your 3G swap (130-amp alt) was done that you used AT LEAST 4-gauge cables and that you upgraded the engine grounds. And the same applies to your using 100-watt H-1 fog light bulbs which are WAY higher than the stock rating for bulbs; if the fog light switch was modified in such a way that they added a relay up closer to the lights, that's good, but if you've got all that high-current wire running to the stock switch still, you're looking at a potential fire hazard in your interior instead of just in your engine bay.

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
No, Sylvania XtraVision bulbs are just regular OEM-type bulbs of a slightly higher output. Not sure how they achieve this, either with slightly higher wattage or a different gas fill other than halogen, or whatever, but it definitely does work. GE sells bulbs like this that are equivalent, they're just labeled "High Output" or have "HO" in the part number (9004HO). Last I looked, you can score a pair of them for less than $30, and they're worth every penny.

Again, Silverstars are just XtraVision bulbs with a blue tint. Sylvania also sells (or used to sell) a "Cool Blue" bulb which was just the standard OEM bulb painted blue, making it even more lame than the standard OEM replacement bulbs - same bulb, less light output due to passing through a color-filtered barrier. Any higher-end Silverstars are just a ripoff on top of a ripoff, IMO. Kind of like some joke Pops always loves to use: "What's the white stuff on chicken poop? More chicken poop."

Absolutely DO NOT try to poke higher-wattage bulbs into the stock sockets using the stock wiring. The stock wiring arrangement is a bad idea to start with - again, it's already pulling way too much current through way too far a distance, creating way too much resistance - and trying to draw even MORE current through there is a good way to melt wires and start an electrical fire. Think of a wire as being like a hose; the smaller the hose, the less you can pull through there, and the harder you have to push to get the same amount through there. And the longer the hose, the more effort it takes to push whatever through there, too. Except when you try to push too much current through too small a gauge of wire, instead of it simply popping like a hose would, it builds up lots of heat until it ignites the wire insulation and/or whatever else is around it. Not good.

If you do the relay mod, using heavier-gauge wire, THEN you can run higher-wattage bulbs. Otherwise, you're ... ahem ... playing with fire.

As a side note, I hope that when your 3G swap (130-amp alt) was done that you used AT LEAST 4-gauge cables and that you upgraded the engine grounds. And the same applies to your using 100-watt H-1 fog light bulbs which are WAY higher than the stock rating for bulbs; if the fog light switch was modified in such a way that they added a relay up closer to the lights, that's good, but if you've got all that high-current wire running to the stock switch still, you're looking at a potential fire hazard in your interior instead of just in your engine bay.

Sounds to me it is better just to stick with the factory bulbs or the 65/45 wattage bulb types. But we have run this car on H-1 100 watt bulbs a long time. We are going to get those Amber fog lights and put in those Sylvania silver star H-3 bulbs-don't know if it will make a difference but it is the standard wattage 55 but probably a waste of $$$ at $20.00 per Silverstar foglight bulb.

Darkwriter77 · Sep 1, 2009

Yeah, $20 for a fog lamp is insanity.

I've always wondered ... does anyone ACTUALLY use fog lamps FOR DRIVING IN FOG? Always cracks me up to see people with them on around in Arizona in the middle of friggin' summer, for some reason.

Mercedez · Sep 1, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
Yeah, $20 for a fog lamp is insanity.

I've always wondered ... does anyone ACTUALLY use fog lamps FOR DRIVING IN FOG? Always cracks me up to see people with them on around in Arizona in the middle of friggin' summer, for some reason.

Yeah but that's just the bulb only.
I see alot of one eye fog lit cars driving around which means they use them for nothing.

Darkwriter77 · Sep 2, 2009

Actually, I see more GT Foxes with NO foglamps AT ALL than I do ones with installed AND functional foglamps. Either they've got them in and they work, or they yank them suckers out and remove the foglamp mounting bracket to save weight. Being that so many people have problems keeping foglamps intact and functional on GT's - either due to the fact they pick up a lot of moisture and debris and fail, or simply because of the stock switch problems - most folks just decide they aren't worth the trouble ... again, especially since we RARELY ever get fog of any kind at all out here.

Mustang5L5 · Sep 2, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
does anyone ACTUALLY use fog lamps FOR DRIVING IN FOG?

I do.

I'll admit, when i had my'03gt they were always on, but in my g35 they only come on when it's raining or foggy or i need more light. Reason being they look stupid on since the fog lights are in the headlight housing.

Mercedez · Sep 2, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
Actually, I see more GT Foxes with NO foglamps AT ALL than I do ones with installed AND functional foglamps. Either they've got them in and they work, or they yank them suckers out and remove the foglamp mounting bracket to save weight. Being that so many people have problems keeping foglamps intact and functional on GT's - either due to the fact they pick up a lot of moisture and debris and fail, or simply because of the stock switch problems - most folks just decide they aren't worth the trouble ... again, especially since we RARELY ever get fog of any kind at all out here.

I see alot of fog lights get busted probably from road debris, pebbles or gravel. Some have removed the fog light and installed a ram air hose in there. How much weight do you save by removing the fogs and fog light bracket? Not much
Alot of people just put them on just so they can be on. I would guess that they help you to be more visable to others that are next to you since the beam is wide.

Darkwriter77 · Sep 2, 2009

Mercedez said:
I see alot of fog lights get busted probably from road debris, pebbles or gravel. Some have removed the fog light and installed a ram air hose in there. How much weight do you save by removing the fogs and fog light bracket? Not much
Alot of people just put them on just so they can be on. I would guess that they help you to be more visable to others that are next to you since the beam is wide.

The bracket weighs something like 20 lbs., actually. It's a big honkin' chunk of metal.

Shaolin Crane · Sep 2, 2009

Mustang5L5 said:
Also, blue light is very tough to see. The human eye cannot see much into the blue spectrum. We see better in the yellow spectrum of light...that's why a lot of bulbs tend to be yellow. Fog lights are especially yellow because they are used in rain and other situations where you need every bit of advantage you can get.

Stock OEM HID bulbs are 4300K. I beleive in Europe, they use 5000K for their bulbs. The higher in K value you go, the bluer the light and the less you see. SO these 8K, 10K and 12K HID kits are DIMMER than stock.

I changed my G35's OEM HID's to 6000K just to get a little more color. I changed the foglights to 3000K though. WHen i flip the fogs on at night, the difference is HUGE. I can see!!

i can attest to this im colorblind to shades of blue and purple, i have 5k's in my truck and 4300's on the fox, those ****ers are bright

Shaolin Crane · Sep 2, 2009

Darkwriter77 said:
They do make true HID systems for '87-'93 Mustangs. However, their performance can either be so-so or a complete waste of money, depending on which kit you get. Some have a fancy adapter to plug into the stock wiring harness and fit into the stock lens housing; these tend to suck because not only are the stock lenses usually garbage to start with, especially since they're not designed for HID bulbs (light distribution pattern is different), but using the stock wiring is a bad idea because they were never designed to handle the kinds of electrical loads you'll see when using a true HID setup. Also, a lot of those plug-in HID kits have crappy ballasts that tend to poop out early and/or the bulbs don't last that long.

The fancy-schmancy non-HID bulbs are, IMO, a ripoff gimmick. People always scream and yell and get all pissy when I say this, but those Silverstar brand bulbs - the ones that say right on the package "gives the LOOK of HID" - are a ripoff, especially since they cost 2 or 3 times as much as a normal replacement bulb. While they are slightly brighter than stock bulbs, they're honestly the EXACT SAME THING as the Sylvania XtraVision bulbs (made by the same company) except they have that stupid blue tint sprayed on the bulbs to make it LOOK like you're getting "whiter" light. Remember, coloring the bulb does nothing to improve light output; any time you color a transparent surface, you are FILTERING the light spectrum that's being allowed to pass through it, so you are not allowing the full amount of light to be transmitted. (Same as when you put tint on your car windows ... which, coincidentally, usually tends to have a blue-ish color to it.)

Because the stock lenses always tend to go yellow and they're a pain to polish all the time to keep halfway clear, your best bet is to buy a set of "crystal clear" type headlight lenses and just some good OEM replacement bulbs (I'd recommend Sylvania XtraVision). Those "focused beam" or "Euro style" lenses they sell not only tend to make the light pattern worse for your car, directing the light in all sorts of crazy ways, but they're also friggin' hideous (makes your car look like some kind of fat ugly square spider on wheels).

Another upgrade you might consider is the headlight relay mod. It's very cheap and (if you're handy with wiring) is pretty easy to do, but it is pretty technical and you have to have at least some moderate ability with electrical work (and reading wiring diagrams). I don't have a link to the how-to right off hand. Basically, the way your lights are wired up from stock carries a lot of the current over long distances through fairly skinny wires all the way from the battery to the switch and then to the lights; the relay mod has the current only going a short distance from the battery to the relays (usually mounted on or near the radiator support) and then straight to the lights with larger-diameter wiring. The result is MUCH brighter headlights, even with stock bulbs and lenses, and I have read that some have found this to be nearly as bright a setup as those fancy HID kits ... but without the hassle of ballasts and fancy n' expensive true HID bulbs.

Couple the relay mod with some nice clear lenses and some quality bulbs, and you'll have headlights that'll be visible from the moon. ...AND also blind everyone going the other direction, so expect to have people flashing their high-beams at you on a regular basis.

actually Dave most of these new HID kits draw less power than stock, and they even have regulators now to fix the problem of the large load when first ignited, and i sell HID kits complete for $100 bucks, other kits can be had for even less

mob · Sep 2, 2009

Too much talking about a bulb. A bulb is a bulb, if you arent going to do it right and go HID just stick with the normal silverstars ultras.

IMO this is the right way, and only way i'd ever do an HID.
http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...uip-87-93-stang-hids-right-way-lots-pics.html

Xenon light bulbs and Plasma light bulbs for headlights?

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