Coolant Problem - Coolant Level Rising

[bakos24]

Ok guys, just recently my car started spilling out coolant from the tank/cap. Last two times I drove my car it did this. The coolant tank completely drains. Last night I started my car and watched it. I poured coolant into the tank just a tad below the fill line. After about 3-4 mins at idle, it risen completey to the top of tank.

Anyone know why it would be doing this. The car runs fine, just the coolant spills out of the top and when I park my car, the coolant is gone

 

[wmburns]

pressure test cooling system

I am assuming that the coolant is completely gone after the motor has cooled.

I normally do not jump to the worst case causes. However, in this case there it is likely that the head gasket is leaking or there is a crack in the block.

As the head gasket leaks air (exhaust) into the cooling jacket, this creates pockets of air high in the block displacing the coolant. The displaced coolant overflows the expansion tank.

When the motor cools, this creates a partial vacuum pulling the coolant from the expansion tank back inside the block.

Recommend a cooling system pressure test and engine compression test.

I also have heard it is possible to test the coolant for hydrocarbon contamination (might have been watching too much CSI). This will let you know if combustion byproducts are escaping into the cooling jacket.

Good luck. You may need it. I hope I am wrong.

 

[bakos24]

Ugh....that's not good Yes, the tank is completely empty after I park the car.
Here is a vid I shot yesterday. This was during the 3 mins of idle when the coolant was rising. You can see towards the end of vid a little better. Looks like air is coming up from bottom or something. It did the same thing when I first poured the coolant in(when car was off)

others :: IMG_0106.flv video by bakos024 - Photobucket

 

[bakos24]

I am assuming that the coolant is completely gone after the motor has cooled.

Ok, I checked the level Saturday night and the coolant was back down to where I originally filled it from Fri. So it seems the coolant is gone only after I drive my car

 

[wmburns]

I hate to give bad news but.......

Your motor is hurt. Most likely a head gasket. Did anything "happen" before this problem started?

To determine just how bad the motor is hurt will need an engine compression test and a coolant system pressure test.

A head gasket leak is not likely to go away. If ignored, this could lead to overheating. If overheated, it is possible to crack a block or head.

 

[bakos24]

I hate to give bad news but.......

Your motor is hurt. Most likely a head gasket. Did anything "happen" before this problem started?

To determine just how bad the motor is hurt will need an engine compression test and a coolant system pressure test.

A head gasket leak is not likely to go away. If ignored, this could lead to overheating. If overheated, it is possible to crack a block or head.

Nope, nothing happened before it started. Just took my car out for a drive, Car ran fine as usual,was stopped at a light and started to see smoke pour out from under my hood. Pulled in a parking lot, popped hood and coolant was all over the battery and all around the cap. Got home, and the coolant was completely empty.
the car never over heated, but I didn't really drive it that long though.

 

[bakos24]

So, if it is my head gasket, how much more difficult would it be to replace the heads while it all getting torn apart?
In other words, would it be worth it to replace the heads also since I would have to replace the head gasket?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

These cars do not blow head gaskets.

//ok it happens but it is very rare

 

[wmburns]

These cars do not blow head gaskets.

//ok it happens but it is very rare

Any ideas what else could cause the coolant to spontaneously overflow soooo much and then be so low upon cool down (assuming no overheating/boiling over or over filled).

I can understand it blowing some coolant out when it is being worked on (overfilled). But the OP stated the problem began suddenly.

If these motors do not blow head gaskets, are you saying it is more likely to be a cracked block/head?

 

[SRT Handz]

Are you sure you are not leaking coolant from somewhere else? If air is getting in, then it might be leaking somewhere else.

 

[bakos24]

Are you sure you are not leaking coolant from somewhere else? If air is getting in, then it might be leaking somewhere else.

See, thats the thing, It's not really leaking anywhere(atleast from where I can see), nothing on the garage floor either. Just checked the coolant level before I went to work this morning and it was fine. Right where I filled it up to from the other day

Now if I would go and start it. Then it would rise and if I would then drive it, by time I get back, the coolant tank would be completely empty



Ugh....this sucks

 

[REDSTALION]

See, thats the thing, It's not really leaking anywhere(atleast from where I can see), nothing on the garage floor either. Just checked the coolant level before I went to work this morning and it was fine. Right where I filled it up to from the other day

Now if I would go and start it. Then it would rise and if I would then drive it, by time I get back, the coolant tank would be completely empty



Ugh....this sucks

Bro i had the same problem when i first installed my Tork Tech kit, see the video

02092009018.flv video by REDSTALION - Photobucket

after checking every thing related, i found out it was my radiator, it was blocked, so i cleaned it, and the car return back to normal.

But after that it happened again with me but it wasn't that bad, when i was testing the car on the highway, after i stopped i directly switch it off with out waiting for the car to cool down a bit.

now i have changed my OEM radiator to a Mishimoto aluminum radiator, and the problem is completely gone.

another thing to keep in mind is you need to properly burp your system, as it might have some air pockets in it.

 

[bakos24]

Bro i had the same problem when i first installed my Tork Tech kit, see the video

02092009018.flv video by REDSTALION - Photobucket

after checking every thing related, i found out it was my radiator, it was blocked, so i cleaned it, and the car return back to normal.

But after that it happened again with me but it wasn't that bad, when i was testing the car on the highway, after i stopped i directly switch it off with out waiting for the car to cool down a bit.

now i have changed my OEM radiator to a Mishimoto aluminum radiator, and the problem is completely gone.

another thing to keep in mind is you need to properly burp your system, as it might have some air pockets in it.

This is good news! That is exactly what mine is doing. So you just pretty much replaced the radiator. Have you had any problems since?

*sooooo glad its not a head gasket*

 

[wmburns]

No where in the post does it say the motor is over heating. Can someone help me understand how it is possible for a radiator to be blocked inside and the motor NOT overheat?

Also note, in the vid the coolant is bubbling up with the radiator cap off. The system needs pressure to work correctly. If the motor is very hot when the radiator cap is removed, some flash boiling should be expected.

If the motor is running hot/overheating, then steam bubbles can cause air pockets in the cooling jacket of the block. The effect is the same (coolant overflow from tank). If the motor is running hot/overheating, that is an important detail that needs to be mentioned.

Have you checked the rest of the cooling system? T-stat, fan, condition of coolant, condition of the cap (holding pressure/top radiator hose hard)?

 

[REDSTALION]

This is good news! That is exactly what mine is doing. So you just pretty much replaced the radiator. Have you had any problems since?

*sooooo glad its not a head gasket*

Nope, no problems at all.

No where in the post does it say the motor is over heating. Can someone help me understand how it is possible for a radiator to be blocked inside and the motor NOT overheat?

Also note, in the vid the coolant is bubbling up with the radiator cap off. The system needs pressure to work correctly. If the motor is very hot when the radiator cap is removed, some flash boiling should be expected.

If the motor is running hot/overheating, then steam bubbles can cause air pockets in the cooling jacket of the block. The effect is the same (coolant overflow from tank). If the motor is running hot/overheating, that is an important detail that needs to be mentioned.

Have you checked the rest of the cooling system? T-stat, fan, condition of coolant, condition of the cap (holding pressure/top radiator hose hard)?

You are right, i forgot to mention that my car was overheating, and it was overflowing the coolant from the cap (when its closed)
and +1 on the T-stat that might also cause some problems.

 

[Dragstr05]

No where in the post does it say the motor is over heating. Can someone help me understand how it is possible for a radiator to be blocked inside and the motor NOT overheat?

If the motor is running hot/overheating, then steam bubbles can cause air pockets in the cooling jacket of the block. The effect is the same (coolant overflow from tank). If the motor is running hot/overheating, that is an important detail that needs to be mentioned.

Cant read into these things so far as to assume its an internal engine problem right off the bat. Reason? He would have atleast one of 3 things, none of which are mentioned. 1) Misfire and/or running rough. If combustion is getting into the coolant, he is losing compression. A motor does not typically run perfectly fine with low(er) compression. 2) Oil/coolant mixed, either in the crankcase or coolant resevoir. Now, he COULD have just combustion gas in the coolant, which chemical testing can prove, but that jumps back to number 1. 3) Coolant leak. Somewhere. He says there is none.

The radiator might not be blocked, but COULD have a restriction. Small enough to not cause driveability or overheating, but yet cause air pockets to form. If these pockets are forming in the radiator, they may very well simply deminish in the resevoir.

To the OP, I'm not calling any particular part a fault. But the one FREE thing you can do, and the simplest at that is to top of the resevoir, unbolt it and elevate it with the cap off. Alot of times vehicles with just these resevoirs, the resevoir isnt actually the highest point so it makes it difficult to bleed. So, get some coolant in there, elevate the resevoir and run the heat full blast center vents. A easy way to tell if you have air in the system is if the car is at full operating temp and you have little to no heat coming out.

Good luck.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Listen WMBURNS told you in post #2 what diagnostic procedures you need to perform to narrow this problem down. Do them and then update the thread.

 

[wmburns]

Thanks Kilgore_Trout for the vote of confidence. IMO it happens too often that those giving advice are too quick to assume something major wrong before ruling out the minor/obvious. In this case, I bypassed the overheating/boiling angle for several reasons.

1) No mention was made by the OP that the car was overheating or even anything above normal operating temperature.
2) The problem began suddenly. One would presume the cooling system was in good working order and full up until that point in time.
3) The OP mentioned overflow occurred after 3-4 minutes of idling. That is not enough time to go from cold to overheating unless the coolant system is completely blocked (not reasonable as the OP gave the impression the car is quite drivable).
4) The amount of coolant overflow is significant and happened repeatedly after just running the car.

If the cooling system is not keeping up with heat rejection, then it is entirely reasonable that steam bubbles will form. If this occurs, the steam will migrate to the high spots in the block and displace coolant. This coolant has no place to go except out the degas bottle.

Since the OP’s car is supercharged, it is reasonable the heat load will be greater than a stock car. It is also reasonable to rule out easier fixes before performing a major tear down (I wouldn’t even think about turning the first bolt without at absolute minimum a coolant system pressure test).

Considering the gravity of the repair, all problems with the cooling system should also be ruled out.
1) Need to know the coolant temperature. What is the temperature as reported by the PCM?
2) Check the concentration of anti-freeze. Needs to be between 40-60%. If too high, the coolant will not be as effective. If too low, corrosion is a problem. Check with the coolant at room temperature. If hot, the inexpensive specific gravity tester will not give accurate results.
3) Check for adequate pressure. Is the top radiator hose rock hard during normal operation? If not, there is a leak or the pressure cap is not holding pressure. This is an easy fix.
4) Does the fan work? Is it cycling on/off in response to load? Turn the AC on, the fan should come on as well.
5) T-stat working? It’s cheap/easy enough to replace for no other reason than to rule it out.
6) Is the radiator clean (inside and out)? While you are replacing the T-stat, clean and flush the radiator. Again cheap insurance. If money is no object, replace the radiator. A case can be made that your set up may overwhelm a stock radiator and fan especially if you enjoy “spirited” driving.

Try this diagnostic trick. Keep an eye on the temperature gauge. Should you notice it going up, turn on the heater. If the heater does not work (or quits working), this means that steam bubbles are in the coolant. PULL OVER as overheating is imminent. Aluminum engines do not take kindly to being overheated.

I stand by an earlier recommendation to pressure test the cooling system. This will let you know that the system is indeed tight and holding the necessary pressure.

A compression test will give extra valuable information.

Please update the post with the results. Good luck.

 

[bakos24]

Ok, thanks guys. Can I do a pressure test myself? or do I have to take it somewhere

 

[patman0911]

You should be able to borrow/rent one from Autozone, etc., or your local tool rental place and do it yourself.