What heads for a 6k rpm 351W?

[FastDriver]

My best friend is tired of playing with the incon kit on a 302. He wants to go to a 351W for the increased block-strength/power-potential. Right now, he has a set of GT40X heads. I think they'd be too small for a 351W, but I don't know what to recommend for him. He's very budget-minded. So, for example, a new set of AFRs would not be an option. If I had to put a number on it, I would say a grand would be the absolute upper limit for the heads.

He's open to getting a used set.

I'm going to buy him a custom FTI cam for x-mas to go with whatever heads he gets. He's also got an Edelbrock Performer intake. I'm wondering if a long-runner intake would still be the best option or if a short runner would be more appropriate. Recommendations/examples, please?

 

[BlownFiveLiter]

He could probably port the GT40's and achieve his desired results. Check with Thumper460 and/or TMoss about porting them up on a budget. There should be enough material that they can be ported quite a bit, and being a forced induction application, probably enough that he could break a factory 351 block.

 

[90lxcoupe]

x2 on porting the gt40's. I think that head was used on fords 392 crate motor

 

[57fairlane]

the x heads really aren't that bad when ported . . . I would run a better intake either way.

 

[Shaolin Crane]

man you buy your friends mustang parts for christmas, i need more friends like you

 

[FastDriver]

Porting sounds like a pretty reasonable idea. How much do guys charge for porting? Is it something that depends on what you want them to do? If so what should be done? Also which intake should be used? Buy another one or like the heads just have the performer ported out too?

 

[Shaolin Crane]

Porting sounds like a pretty reasonable idea. How much do guys charge for porting? Is it something that depends on what you want them to do? If so what should be done? Also which intake should be used? Buy another one or like the heads just have the performer ported out too?

decent port job is around 600-1000 bucks around here

 

[90lxcoupe]

I'd say call up fox lake and get a quote from them. Porting cylinder heads is an art and since CNC porting is so common now, getting a good hand port job is harder to come by. Fox lake will flow the heads and everythign, so you can give the numbers to the cam grinder and your bud will be that much better off. It dosen sound like he wants anything insane, i'd say just do a bowl blend and clean up the runners and chamebers. Also, get a good valve job done, a head could be ported to the gills, but if the valve seat angle isnt right then the heads are junk

 

[FastDriver]

Thinking about it a little more, that doesn't sound like the best use of his money. Wouldn't the X heads sell for $600-$800? For the extra $600-$1000 it would've cost to port them added to the money he'd get for selling the X heads, he'd be able to put $1,200-$1,800 towards a set of cylinder heads without noticing a difference in his wallet. That would pretty much get him a premium set of heads for that 351. So, back to the original question, which heads would be appropriate for the added displacement?

AFR185s or 205s might be appropriate but are definitely on the expensive side. What are some other sets of heads that would be appropriate but are on the more budget-minded side of the spectrum?

Chris

 

[NIKwoaC]

Hot Rod magazine did a "Junkyard Jewel" 351 a while back with the X heads and made around 400hp at the flywheel. That was a carb engine though.

Look at the book preview for this, and you can read the article I'm talking about:

Amazon.com: Hot Rod Horsepower Handbook (Motorbooks Workshop) (9780760318140): From the Editors of HOT ROD Magazine: Books

 

[Shaolin Crane]

im sure edelbrock e streets and patriots are in his price range

 

[liljoe07]

Posted via Mobile Device

TFS Fast as Cast 190cc heads would be my choice.

I think your friend needs to save his pennies a little longer. Putting an engine together shouldn't be rushed. Take the time and do it right.

I surely wouldn't waste my time or money porting.a set of GT40's. Even in ported form, there are other heads that can out perform them OOTB.

 

[blackened88lx]

Posted via Mobile Device

TFS Fast as Cast 190cc heads would be my choice.

Ding ding ding. Took everyone long enough. TFS heads are very reasonably priced and there's not too much that works better. They sell for dirt cheap used. Find a set of ported Twisted wedges or something if he doesn't want to buy new. Victor jr. or Super vic intake with an elbow and 90+mm tb. Don't waste the money on a custom cam for a mild boosted application imo. 1300rwhp has been made with a turbo 302 and an F-303. The F cam is a proven boost cam, and it's the only letter cam that's good at anything. Any improvement that could be made with a custom cam can be made by turning the boost up 2 psi. That's the beauty of boost.

 

[FastDriver]

In the same way, boost can overcome restriction from inappropriately small cylinder heads. Run enough boost and you can split a 302 with the stock E7s, and a stock intake. That doesn't mean that getting a set of heads is the wrong idea.

The ugly truth about boost is that at somewhere around 15psi, plus or minus depending on a list of things, detonation becomes the fundamental tuning issue. Getting a good custom cam costs $325 from Ed Curtis. While that's considerably more than it would cost for an F-cam, if it drops the requisite boost needed to make power by 2 psi, it's worthwhile to me.

190cc TFS heads sound pretty nice. I stay on the lookout for some used ones. Thanks for the recommendation on intakes. What is the RPM operating range for the two Vic intakes?

 

[liljoe07]

RPM range is dependant on a few things. Heads and Cam can both change the RPM band.

 

[2000xp8]

Thinking about it a little more, that doesn't sound like the best use of his money. Wouldn't the X heads sell for $600-$800? For the extra $600-$1000 it would've cost to port them added to the money he'd get for selling the X heads, he'd be able to put $1,200-$1,800 towards a set of cylinder heads without noticing a difference in his wallet. That would pretty much get him a premium set of heads for that 351. So, back to the original question, which heads would be appropriate for the added displacement?


Chris

That's my thoughts.
Porting heads doesn't really pay in most situations.
Cnc twisted wedges, or edelbrock has a newer set of heads the XT that work very well.
I can't say for afr, because i don't know their pricing on their larger heads.

 

[RydeOn]

afr 185s are the same price as the 165s!

ive even seen them used for 1000.

to answer your question though.. anything in the 185-205 cc range

 

[393strokervert]

I have E7's on my 393. They are highly ported & polished with w/1.6 & 2.02 valves & with the TF stage1 cam It pulls hard all the way to 6k with no problems. not sure how much higher it would go but the limiter is set at 6k & it gets there in a hurry, although I don't do it often...don't need to

 

[90lxcoupe]

Posted via Mobile Device

TFS Fast as Cast 190cc heads would be my choice.

x3, those heads are modeled after trick flows more expensive CNC heads, great for the money.

 

[blackened88lx]

In the same way, boost can overcome restriction from inappropriately small cylinder heads. Run enough boost and you can split a 302 with the stock E7s, and a stock intake. That doesn't mean that getting a set of heads is the wrong idea.

The ugly truth about boost is that at somewhere around 15psi, plus or minus depending on a list of things, detonation becomes the fundamental tuning issue. Getting a good custom cam costs $325 from Ed Curtis. While that's considerably more than it would cost for an F-cam, if it drops the requisite boost needed to make power by 2 psi, it's worthwhile to me.

190cc TFS heads sound pretty nice. I stay on the lookout for some used ones. Thanks for the recommendation on intakes. What is the RPM operating range for the two Vic intakes?

I agree to a point. You could look at it like that but I believe the heads are much more important than the cam.

The Vic intakes have a very high rpm range but that's for n/a motors. It's a completely different story with boost. I guess a good starting point would be what kind of numbers is he looking for?