93 5.0 Microsquirt with Stage 3 trickflow tuning issues

[marxpreston11]

[EGO / idle]

1. egoRPM: 500 → 1100
2. egoTemp: 170 → 150
3. egoLimit: 10 → 5
4. egoKP: 45 → 60
5. egoKI: 15 → 5
6. egoKD: 5 → 0
7. idleadvance_rpm: 800 → 1000
8. idleadvance_clt: 120 → 140

[VE table ]
9. Whole table smoothed
10. Off-idle cliff removed (e.g. 65 kPa, 1000→1200 rpm was 42→68, now a ramp)
11. 25 kPa high-rpm dead corner cleaned (was dropping to 35, now ~45)
12. Idle cells came up slightly from the smoothing fill (65 kPa idle ~39→47)


[AFR table ]
13. WOT: 11.6 → 12.5–12.7 (rpm-tapered)
14. Idle: 13.8 → 13.5
15. Cruise: capped at 14.7


[Spark table ]
16. Whole table smoothed, knock-safe (no cell gained timing under load)
17. WOT peak: 34 → 33.5
18. Low-rpm jitter cleaned (44 cells, max move 1.5°)

First off thank you for your help.

I didnt change anything from your tune file. Seems to idle alot better but..... It still dies the second i touch the throttle. Its also very difficult to start back up once it is warm.

I have attached 2 logs, one just setting at idle and the second is setting at idle and dying.

Note, its not a option to show in the logs, but the injector pulse would sky rocket to 25 when lightly tapping the throttle.

Thanks

 

[Mustang5L5]

There's probably still a number of tweaks that need to be made. Your warmup enrichment prob needs to be tuned. If you go over to the VE analyze tab, there is a tab for warmup enrichment tuning. Enable that and let it run one full warmup cycle and make some adjustments. Have it run all the way to 180 degrees or so.

If it's not cranking once warm, you will need to adjust your cranking pulse at that specific temperature. Try adding more fuel at that temp and see if it helps or hurts. Try taking fuel out.

You also have your afterstart enrichment to tune as well.

Dying when you touch the gas might be the VE cells where your MAP goes might not be tuned correctly. You might have to open up your VE table and have that opened up along with seeing your AFR. Give it some gas and see what cell it goes to and what the AFR is. You might see it's way too rich or lean and can make the adjustments there.

There's a good video you can watch that goes over a lot of this. It's na hour long but you can skip through a lot. But it goes over tuning for good idle and warmpup enrich and other key things.


View: https://youtu.be/GjyyWQhGGJE?si=MCNP2YT-joKLNeHc



I will take a look at your datalog later tonight. I don't have tuning software on the PC that I am on right now

 

[marxpreston11]

There's probably still a number of tweaks that need to be made. Your warmup enrichment prob needs to be tuned. If you go over to the VE analyze tab, there is a tab for warmup enrichment tuning. Enable that and let it run one full warmup cycle and make some adjustments. Have it run all the way to 180 degrees or so.

If it's not cranking once warm, you will need to adjust your cranking pulse at that specific temperature. Try adding more fuel at that temp and see if it helps or hurts. Try taking fuel out.

You also have your afterstart enrichment to tune as well.

Dying when you touch the gas might be the VE cells where your MAP goes might not be tuned correctly. You might have to open up your VE table and have that opened up along with seeing your AFR. Give it some gas and see what cell it goes to and what the AFR is. You might see it's way too rich or lean and can make the adjustments there.

There's a good video you can watch that goes over a lot of this. It's na hour long but you can skip through a lot. But it goes over tuning for good idle and warmpup enrich and other key things.


View: https://youtu.be/GjyyWQhGGJE?si=MCNP2YT-joKLNeHc



I will take a look at your datalog later tonight. I don't have tuning software on the PC that I am on right now

Ok ill go over that video and mess with it a little bit. Thank you!

 

[marxpreston11]

There's probably still a number of tweaks that need to be made. Your warmup enrichment prob needs to be tuned. If you go over to the VE analyze tab, there is a tab for warmup enrichment tuning. Enable that and let it run one full warmup cycle and make some adjustments. Have it run all the way to 180 degrees or so.

If it's not cranking once warm, you will need to adjust your cranking pulse at that specific temperature. Try adding more fuel at that temp and see if it helps or hurts. Try taking fuel out.

You also have your afterstart enrichment to tune as well.

Dying when you touch the gas might be the VE cells where your MAP goes might not be tuned correctly. You might have to open up your VE table and have that opened up along with seeing your AFR. Give it some gas and see what cell it goes to and what the AFR is. You might see it's way too rich or lean and can make the adjustments there.

There's a good video you can watch that goes over a lot of this. It's na hour long but you can skip through a lot. But it goes over tuning for good idle and warmpup enrich and other key things.


View: https://youtu.be/GjyyWQhGGJE?si=MCNP2YT-joKLNeHc



I will take a look at your datalog later tonight. I don't have tuning software on the PC that I am on right now

Man i tried going every which way. Im just about to give up so tired of it... I put the stock in its runs great i use this tune it sounds like the car is going to blow up and runs like . I'm about to post the microsquirt for sale, been a few years in the making fighting with this ****

 

[Mustang5L5]

WHy did you go with the microsquirt instead of the stock ECU?

 

[marxpreston11]

WHy did you go with the microsquirt instead of the stock ECU?

Wanted more power and reliability with eletric fans. Did alot of research leading up to the purchase and everyone loved it.

With the 4.10s in here and the top end kit it was eating gas. Figured y not.

 

[Mustang5L5]

I didn't even see a fan configured. Did you set one up?

I think the challenge i'm having is that microsquirt datalogs so few values that it's not what i'm used to seeing with my MS3. I'm simply not experienced enough to bang out a functional tune with so little input.

I still see you running very rich in those logs. AFR 10-12. DO you smell pig rich at idle?

Another question worth digging into. Your injector dead-time number? Where did you get this info? Was this just part of the original base tune you got?

1.3 is a pretty high value. This is essentially telling the ECU it takes 1.3ms for the injector to open and fuel to start flowing. As a result, the ECU is holding the injectors open longer. For comparison, i'm at 0.9 here.

What injectors do you have so we can see if you have the right value here. This might be part of the problem. You might have to drop this 1.3 to 0.9

 

[rwfid]

One thing that makes it hard to be of any help is most of our unfamiliarity with the microsquirt. Most of us are running MS3s in one form or another and I don't know what info anyone else is able to get out of your datalogs, but I see almost nothing that is of any use. The info in your tune is quite different than what we see in ours. Have you posted on the Megasquirt forum? There are several people on there that should be able to pick up on your issues.

 

[marxpreston11]

I didn't even see a fan configured. Did you set one up?

I think the challenge i'm having is that microsquirt datalogs so few values that it's not what i'm used to seeing with my MS3. I'm simply not experienced enough to bang out a functional tune with so little input.

I still see you running very rich in those logs. AFR 10-12. DO you smell pig rich at idle?

Another question worth digging into. Your injector dead-time number? Where did you get this info? Was this just part of the original base tune you got?

1.3 is a pretty high value. This is essentially telling the ECU it takes 1.3ms for the injector to open and fuel to start flowing. As a result, the ECU is holding the injectors open longer. For comparison, i'm at 0.9 here.

What injectors do you have so we can see if you have the right value here. This might be part of the problem. You might have to drop this 1.3 to 0.9

Yes my clothes smell like ass every night I go to bed hahahah. I have no clue where u found that value at never saw it before.

The fan was setup under something I can't remember exactly. But yes I have fan temp set at 180, with a negative output to a relay.

I have 24lb injectors. I believe oem ford performance

 

[marxpreston11]

One thing that makes it hard to be of any help is most of our unfamiliarity with the microsquirt. Most of us are running MS3s in one form or another and I don't know what info anyone else is able to get out of your datalogs, but I see almost nothing that is of any use. The info in your tune is quite different than what we see in ours. Have you posted on the Megasquirt forum? There are several people on there that should be able to pick up on your issues.

No I have not, should I?

Also, im not sure on the data logs. What other information should I include?

 

[Mustang5L5]

Also, im not sure on the data logs. What other information should I include?

I think you are hardware limited. I looked at the logging profiles and you have everything turned on. It;s just limited by what the microsquirt can output.

For example, this is one screen that I can see on my MS3 setup. (this was a cold start) I have many other screens based on what i'm trying to do. Also to the right, i have the tune loaded and can see my VE/AFR table so i can see what the engine does at a snapshot in time.

I'm having trouble seeing this on your datalogs. I've just never dealt with microsquirt so not sure if that's just how it is.

 

[Mustang5L5]

I have 24lb injectors. I believe oem ford performance

Which ones and how old? The older EV1 style injectors like the 93 Cobra? Or newer USCAR-car connector style injectors.

How many years old are they and how many miles?

I think i'm going to have you change that number down. Just not sure what yet. That should shorten your pulsewidths at idle and give you better fuel control.

I think I want to tell you set it to 0.9 but i'm not 100% sure yet.

 

[rwfid]

The more sources you can find to help you, the easier it will be to solve your problem. The guys that make these computers and the MLV and TS programs frequent there and you will find more MS2 and microsquirt users.

 

[marxpreston11]

Which ones and how old? The older EV1 style injectors like the 93 Cobra? Or newer USCAR-car connector style injectors.

How many years old are they and how many miles?

I think i'm going to have you change that number down. Just not sure what yet. That should shorten your pulsewidths at idle and give you better fuel control.

I think I want to tell you set it to 0.9 but i'm not 100% sure yet.

They are brand new, just purchased them. less than 100 miles on them. I changed it to .7 and it seemed to help quite a bit.

 

[marxpreston11]

I think you are hardware limited. I looked at the logging profiles and you have everything turned on. It;s just limited by what the microsquirt can output.

For example, this is one screen that I can see on my MS3 setup. I have many other screens based on what i'm trying to do. Also to the right, i have the tune loaded and can see my VE/AFR table so i can see what the engine does at a snapshot in time.

I'm having trouble seeing this on your datalogs. I've just never dealt with microsquirt so not sure if that's just how it is.

Here is a data log with every logging profile on, let me know. this was just sitting at idle

 

[rwfid]

The injector deadtime definitely seems too long to me also, and throw four squirts on there and it seems like it would take forever to get fuel into that engine. The other thing I noticed was the 1000 RPMdot threshold in the closed loop settings. Might that be too high? I looked at my idle from a couple of days ago and my RPMdot wasn't topping 200.

 

[marxpreston11]

The more sources you can find to help you, the easier it will be to solve your problem. The guys that make these computers and the MLV and TS programs frequent there and you will find more MS2 and microsquirt users.

Im terrible with these forums and have no idea how i would even do that.

 

[Mustang5L5]

They are brand new, just purchased them. less than 100 miles on them. I changed it to .7 and it seemed to help quite a bit.

SO they are the new Ford Racing LU24A's?

FORD PERFORMANCE 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET

FORD PERFORMANCE 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET|Ford Racing Parts

performanceparts.ford.com

If so, here's the dead time curve at 39psi

SO based on Microsquirt wanting the value at 13.2 volts, that works out to 0.97 assuming your static fuel pressure is set to 39psi. If not there are correction factors we can apply


There's a half-assed way to check. Once you are fully warmed up at idle, take your idle VE cells and just add 10% fuel to them. AFR should go 10% richer.

If the AFR doesn't change much or at all, your dead time value is too high. If it changes waaay too much. It's too low.

 

[marxpreston11]

The injector deadtime definitely seems too long to me also, and throw four squirts on there and it seems like it would take forever to get fuel into that engine. The other thing I noticed was the 1000 RPMdot threshold in the closed loop settings. Might that be too high? I looked at my idle from a couple of days ago and my RPMdot wasn't topping 200.

After changing that, I cant idle under 1300

 

[marxpreston11]

SO they are the new Ford Racing LU24A's?

FORD PERFORMANCE 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET

FORD PERFORMANCE 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET|Ford Racing Parts

performanceparts.ford.com

If so, here's the dead time curve at 39psi

SO based on Microsquirt wanting the value at 13.2 volts, that works out to 0.97 assuming your static fuel pressure is set to 39psi. If not there are correction factors we can apply


There's a half-assed way to check. Once you are fully warmed up at idle, take your idle VE cells and just add 10% fuel to them. AFR should go 10% richer.

If the AFR doesn't change much or at all, your dead time value is too high. If it changes waaay too much. It's too low.

Yes those are it for sure