Build Thread 1978 Mercury Cyclone. The pig is in the pen.

CarMichael Angelo · May 23, 2015

Boosted92LX said:
@madmike1157

Sorry for the lame reply this morning. I'm woking nights and was too zombied out to wrap my head around what you were asking for. The two part quicksteel was definitely the ticket! I'll try to do bettet next time, lol.

No worries, You gotta know I had a plan to use one product in my head when I asked the question, and unless overwhelmingly advised against, would've went that way regardless.

In this case, The head itself is the "wall" that the hole butts up against, so the patch cant be forced through the hole by water pressure. I coulda went either way w/ either epoxy, or a silicone based product and it would've stay'd put. The good thing about the two part epoxy is that there is now a "cap" on top of the hole like a cork in a champagne bottle, as opposed to the plug-like end result I would've had using silicone.

CarMichael Angelo · May 23, 2015

Noobz347 said:
Too late for the party but I might have tapped and plugged that hole.

You're always late to the party. Besides,.... this party was pretty stale, and we didn't have Ruffles, so everyone left early.

And, No,....you couldn't have tapped and plugged the hole.
#1. You had a head, and a head gasket at the "bottom" of the hole to worry about hurting w/ the tap,

and....

#2. You couldn't get a tap in there in the first place.

CarMichael Angelo · May 23, 2015

Still waiting on my tuner to send me his version of my tune file. He responded by e mail last night and said that he would get me the file by this weekend and he'd follow that w/ a Teamviewer live tune session to fine tune the map. (Gotta love the times we live in, when dude can actually be 40 miles away from you, but because of a computer, and the internet, can also be in your garage at the same time)

Noobz347 · May 23, 2015

madmike1157 said:
You're always late to the party. Besides,.... this party was pretty stale, and we didn't have Ruffles, so everyone left early.

And, No,....you couldn't have tapped and plugged the hole.
#1. You had a head, and a head gasket at the "bottom" of the hole to worry about hurting w/ the tap,

and....

#2. You couldn't get a tap in there in the first place.

Ah... I went back and reread the portion about the goal being to NOT pull the head.

Noobz347 · May 23, 2015

madmike1157 said:
(Gotta love the times we live in, when dude can actually be 40 miles away from you

I keep trying to explain this to people. The technology we live in is utterly amazing. It's the overwhelming supply of douchebags that use that tech to ruin everything. We already have working systems that are beyond anything that science fiction could have predicted during the 70s. Granted there's lots that was dreamed up that's just not possible and lots more that will take us generations to realize...

We live in a curious time. The technology advances faster than crowd funding can support. It wasn't that long ago that we had to work hard and wait for answers and discoveries.... Now we wait on financing.

Sorry... Please return to your regularly scheduled Gila Monster.

CarMichael Angelo · May 23, 2015

Noobz347 said:
I keep trying to explain this to people. The technology we live in is utterly amazing. It's the overwhelming supply of douchebags that use that tech to ruin everything. We already have working systems that are beyond anything that science fiction could have predicted during the 70s. Granted there's lots that was dreamed up that's just not possible and lots more that will take us generations to realize...

We live in a curious time. The technology advances faster than crowd funding can support. It wasn't that long ago that we had to work hard and wait for answers and discoveries.... Now we wait on financing.

Sorry... Please return to your regularly scheduled Gila Monster.

Naww,...I'll walk down the path a bit w/ you.

The wife and I were kinda talking about something similar w/ regard to how fast technology is evolving and how certain devices that have been around for decades have become dinosaur extinct only in the last few years.

Records/turntables, reel-to reel audio recorders, 8 tracks, cassettes, CRT TV's, analog cell phones,
CD's DVD's, soon,.....even terrestrial radio will be a thing of the past

Noobz347 · May 23, 2015

All extinct. Now audio compression and data transmission is getting so good that digital reproduction has surpassed any analog (even vinyl) for recording. Yeah, I know... old news but it's just now really entering the consumer market. Waiting on the financing portion again. heh

Boosted92LX · May 23, 2015

madmike1157 said:
Naww,...I'll walk down the path a bit w/ you.

The wife and I were kinda talking about something similar w/ regard to how fast technology is evolving and how certain devices that have been around for decades have become dinosaur extinct only in the last few years.

Records/turntables, reel-to reel audio recorders, 8 tracks, cassettes, CRT TV's, analog cell phones,
CD's DVD's, soon,.....even terrestrial radio will be a thing of the past

Noobz347 said:
All extinct. Now audio compression and data transmission is getting so good that digital reproduction has surpassed any analog (even vinyl) for recording. Yeah, I know... old news but it's just now really entering the consumer market. Waiting on the financing portion again. heh

Hey, have you guys seen my earbuds? I left them right here next to the Mr. Fusion...

Noobz347 · May 23, 2015

So THAT'S where my prototype went.

Mike told me he never saw it.

Boosted92LX · May 23, 2015

^^^LMAO!!

CarMichael Angelo · May 23, 2015

Well I was pleasantly surprised today. Despite the fact that it was the wife's birthday, she preferred to hang out at her pool ( no-mans land as far as I'm concerned). That is the same SOP that happens on any given weekend day.

So what was I to do?

Well go to the garage of course.

I had to try and stop that rear leak. (the one coming from the rear hose fitting I pictured above).

Despite the fact that I removed the starter w/o too much drama, the fitting was about 1/3-1/2 inch away from hitting one of medusa's tubes, and could not be removed because of that. so, doing the best I could, I applied the same two part epoxy that fixed the front leak.

I replaced the starter.

The wire that I thought was suspect is actually the ECU needing some sort of programming, or I have the wire in the wrong port. Right now, the water pump doesn't turn on because of it.

For the purpose of checking the thing out, I jerry rigged a switch into the circuit, so I could turn on the pump manually.

I re-filled the engine w/ water, and the rear fix promptly started dripping that same as before.

I moved on. I started the engine. It starts on it's own w/o any throttle input from me.

I run it up to temp, (in this case, that appears to be 160, because I have no bypass unless I run the heater (where there is a heater control valve)). Once I run the heater, the heater control valve opens, and lets water run through the heater core, and directly into the upper radiator hose,....effectively bypassing the T stat altogether.

I alternate opening and closing that valve to get the engine up to 180 so the fan will come on, and the Tstat will open. (Which I still don't know if it ever did).

Although the engine idles (not close by any means) the Innovate W/B gauge is reading 11.9 (Waaay too rich) conversely, the ECU, thinks that it's some where in the 13.7-14.0 range. I tried to change that by clicking on the cell that the dot was bouncing around in, and changine the number, but could not see any real change. Something is wrong w/ the communication between the wideband, and the ECU.

I was able to affect the timing though. The computer thought it was 24.9 degrees at idle, and the timing light said it was more like 20. I was able to make the offset changes take effect, and now the ECU, and the timing light agree with each other, so I'm sure the fueling thing is just something that I'm not doing right.

None the less, knowing that I wasn't gonna burn the engine down, I ran it for about 3-5 minutes. Turned it off when smoke started to rise off the exhaust side of the engine.

The black paint I sprayed on top of the silver paint is DOA. Weirdly, the silver remains. The fact that the engine did that to the tubes while running at 11.9 AFR means that it didn't happen because the thing was too lean, or that the timing was non-existent. It was gonna happen regardless.

Call it a simple quirk of fate, call it karma, call it what ever you want, but I am not leaving that ugly assed flaking paint as a focal point on the exhaust header. I'm gonna look on Tuesday, and see if there is a local shop doing high temp coatings. If not, I'll send it to Jet hot, or some place like it to get the flaking paint problem permanently dealt with. ( I was gonna do it anyway, I guess it is gonna be sooner than later)

To do that means I'll obviously have to remove the hot side.

Then I can fix that damn leaking rear hose.

But I'm not gonna do that till I get the tuner's file loaded (if he sends it tomorrow). Otherwise, if he waits too long I may just end up doing it myself.

Sorry for the delayed extendo-tease,...I will post a vid/sound clip when I get it dialed in.

Boosted92LX · May 24, 2015

madmike1157 said:
Well I was pleasantly surprised today. Despite the fact that it was the wife's birthday, she preferred to hang out at her pool ( no-mans land as far as I'm concerned). That is the same SOP that happens on any given weekend day.

So what was I to do?

Well go to the garage of course.

I had to try and stop that rear leak. (the one coming from the rear hose fitting I pictured above).

Despite the fact that I removed the starter w/o too much drama, the fitting was about 1/3-1/2 inch away from hitting one of medusa's tubes, and could not be removed because of that. so, doing the best I could, I applied the same two part epoxy that fixed the front leak.

I replaced the starter.

The wire that I thought was suspect is actually the ECU needing some sort of programming, or I have the wire in the wrong port. Right now, the water pump doesn't turn on because of it.

For the purpose of checking the thing out, I jerry rigged a switch into the circuit, so I could turn on the pump manually.

I re-filled the engine w/ water, and the rear fix promptly started dripping that same as before.

I moved on. I started the engine. It starts on it's own w/o any throttle input from me.

I run it up to temp, (in this case, that appears to be 160, because I have no bypass unless I run the heater (where there is a heater control valve)). Once I run the heater, the heater control valve opens, and lets water run through the heater core, and directly into the upper radiator hose,....effectively bypassing the T stat altogether.

I alternate opening and closing that valve to get the engine up to 180 so the fan will come on, and the Tstat will open. (Which I still don't know if it ever did).

Although the engine idles (not close by any means) the Innovate W/B gauge is reading 11.9 (Waaay too rich) conversely, the ECU, thinks that it's some where in the 13.7-14.0 range. I tried to change that by clicking on the cell that the dot was bouncing around in, and changine the number, but could not see any real change. Something is wrong w/ the communication between the wideband, and the ECU.

I was able to affect the timing though. The computer thought it was 24.9 degrees at idle, and the timing light said it was more like 20. I was able to make the offset changes take effect, and now the ECU, and the timing light agree with each other, so I'm sure the fueling thing is just something that I'm not doing right.

None the less, knowing that I wasn't gonna burn the engine down, I ran it for about 3-5 minutes. Turned it off when smoke started to rise off the exhaust side of the engine.

The black paint I sprayed on top of the silver paint is DOA. Weirdly, the silver remains. The fact that the engine did that to the tubes while running at 11.9 AFR means that it didn't happen because the thing was too lean, or that the timing was non-existent. It was gonna happen regardless.

Call it a simple quirk of fate, call it karma, call it what ever you want, but I am not leaving that ugly assed flaking paint as a focal point on the exhaust header. I'm gonna look on Tuesday, and see if there is a local shop doing high temp coatings. If not, I'll send it to Jet hot, or some place like it to get the flaking paint problem permanently dealt with. ( I was gonna do it anyway, I guess it is gonna be sooner than later)

To do that means I'll obviously have to remove the hot side.

Then I can fix that damn leaking rear hose.

But I'm not gonna do that till I get the tuner's file loaded (if he sends it tomorrow). Otherwise, if he waits too long I may just end up doing it myself.

Sorry for the delayed extendo-tease,...I will post a vid/sound clip when I get it dialed in.

Mike, you probably know this, but with the innovate wideband you have to do a free air calibration or it won't read correctly. I accidentally powered mine up with the sensor disconnected and it lost calibration, and did all kinds of stupid stuff. Also make sure you go into your settings ( you're running mega squirt right? ) and be sure you have the right wideband selected as they use different input voltages.. My learning experience, hope it helps.

CarMichael Angelo · May 24, 2015

Boosted92LX said:
Mike, you probably know this, but with the innovate wideband you have to do a free air calibration or it won't read correctly. I accidentally powered mine up with the sensor disconnected and it lost calibration, and did all kinds of stupid stuff. Also make sure you go into your settings ( you're running mega squirt right? ) and be sure you have the right wideband selected as they use different input voltages.. My learning experience, hope it helps.

Who the hell is up at 3:30 AM Sunday morning doling out advice on a web forum?

Uhh....... you are evidently.

Thanks, I did free air the Innovate, and set it as such in the EGO correction of Tunerstudio. I'm more inclined to believe the 11.9 AFR displayed on the innovate gauge than I am the 13.7/14.0 in Tuner studio,.....but the fact remains that there is still a 2 point differential between the two, and it appeared that I could not make the changes to the AFR table make any difference in the innovate gauges display.

Boosted92LX · May 24, 2015

madmike1157 said:
Who the hell is up at 3:30 AM Sunday morning doling out advice on a web forum?

Uhh....... you are evidently.

Thanks, I did free air the Innovate, and set it as such in the EGO correction of Tunerstudio. I'm more inclined to believe the 11.9 AFR displayed on the innovate gauge than I am the 13.7/14.0 in Tuner studio,.....but the fact remains that there is still a 2 point differential between the two, and it appeared that I could not make the changes to the AFR table make any difference in the innovate gauges display.

Yeah, my sleep pattern is still wonky.. I crashed back out after being up a few hours.. haha.

I experienced the same inconsistency between Tunerstudio and my wide band but (not two whole point though.)my tuner went in and changed a voltage input setting I believe to get it to match.. he used a seperate wideband the he stuck in the tailpipe To verify the reading

There is a parameter adjustment in there somewhere for it, I do not recall where it is.. although personally I wouldn't monkey with it unless you had something to verify with like he did..

RacEoHolic330 · May 24, 2015

Jet Hot's 2000 degree black coating would look great on those headers, Mike. The price they send you will include coating the inside of the pipes as well. I didn't know that until I got my pipes back from them.

CarMichael Angelo · May 24, 2015

Boosted92LX said:
Yeah, my sleep pattern is still wonky.. I crashed back out after being up a few hours.. haha.

I experienced the same inconsistency between Tunerstudio and my wide band but (not two whole point though.)my tuner went in and changed a voltage input setting I believe to get it to match.. he used a seperate wideband the he stuck in the tailpipe To verify the reading

There is a parameter adjustment in there somewhere for it, I do not recall where it is.. although personally I wouldn't monkey with it unless you had something to verify with like he did..

I have the innovateLC-1's analog brown wire split to both the gauge, and the ECU. The yellow wire that is a second analogue output ( that isn't hooked to anything right now) can be configured to match the WB output going to the gauge, and provide a second, dedicated signal. I think I will do that

jrichker · May 24, 2015

Depending on the combined input resistance of the A/F gauge & the computer, you may not have enough current to drive both without having an inaccurate reading. If the combined input resistance is too low, there would be less voltage for the gauge and the computer.

CarMichael Angelo · May 25, 2015

Ok,...how freakin' giddy am I?

The "tuner" that I was gonna pay 100.00 to build me a start up map didn't find it important enough to mess with it, (or is just too busy).

But leave me alone to my own devices, and I'm gonna figure the thing out one way or the other.

I'm gonna post this little engine run vid. . All in all, I'm pretty happy at this point. While not perfect, the engine runs at 180, the fan comes on and cools it to 170, the water pump comes on at 150 and remains on after that. The thing is idling between 13.0 and 13.7 right now, and that may change as I get more comfortable w/ the tuning software.

I need to qualify that you are hearing the solid lifters under that valve cover. When I said you've never heard anything like it, I shoulda said you've never heard anything like it in a car.

Now if were talking John Deere tractor,......then yeah, you've heard it before.

I was kinda expecting to hear more overlap on the cam, and that may come w/ tuning, right now the engine is idling at about 1000 RPM. The way it idles, I think I could cut that by another 250 RPM.

02 281 GT · May 25, 2015

I think that sounds very nice!

jrichker · May 25, 2015

What's the blue flash on the rear passenger side of the engine? It looks like spark is jumping around.

Now that you have it running, what's the plan for the cam break in run I remember reading about?

Build Thread 1978 Mercury Cyclone. The pig is in the pen.

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

I like to dress like a pretty girl

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

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my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

Agreed...My wife has great Boobs

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