351 windsor build

351cougar69 · Oct 11, 2018

alright guys so i am new to the whole thread thing, i am building a 351 windsor and i need help so i figured id ask on here and see what everyone else thinks/ can help with. i have a 1969 mercury cougar with a 351 windsor, i already yanked the motor out and after closer inspection it is actually a 351 from a 79 galaxie so im already a little distraught as to how this will affect my build....area there any differences between the 69 and 79 block? i am going after power and torque like any reasonable man would and want to know where my build should begin... if you guys have any questions ask away

Steel1 · Oct 11, 2018

Nothing wrong with 79 block, I believe 69 has slightly shorter deck height and 2 piece rear main were 79 may be 1 piece.
You need to decide what kind of power you want to make/what your goals are for the car, block should handle upwards of 600hp.
Both blocks would be non roller but can easily run a roller cam with the correct link bar roller lifters.
May even want to think about building a stroker 393/408 etc. for more power.

hoopty5.0 · Oct 11, 2018

Build should begin at power goals. A well built 351 based motor can make a lot of power.

JD1964 · Oct 11, 2018

Whatever you do, professionally balance the entire rotating assembly components.. Crank, rods, pistons, flywheel, harmonic. Everything. This way it will make more power to the wheel and take more abuse without coming apart. A properly balanced engine will have minimal vibration and parts wont be beating each other up.

nelzfoxes · Oct 28, 2018

I swapped a 302 into my station wagon and then swapped out the 302 for a 351w. I used ford fuel injection from the start and stuck with the stock mustang roller camshaft. The power is good not great but the torque difference is pure street car gold. It pulls down low where you drive a street car most of the time. How did you like the 351 that was in the cougar? Since it wasn’t original anyway get an f4te roller cam block so you can run any cam made for the 87-93 mustang top it off with aluminum heads and run a power adder.

351cougar69 · Nov 15, 2018

thank you all for your replies, so i plan to make around 450 hp on the block itself and want to push around 650 to 700 down the line with a supercharger. now my next question, i originally thought my engine was a 393 stroker because of the piston stroke i had originally measured from inside the dish to the top of the block however now after measuring from top of the piston itself to the deck is actually a 3.5 instead of a 3.85 stroke... my question is, if i ordered a 393 stroker with a 3.85 stroke would this cause the piston to stick beyond the deck?? current specs are 4.030 bore, 3.55 stroke, 3.00 inch main journal, 6.200 inch rod length.. what do you guys think?

CarMichael Angelo · Nov 15, 2018

If you're measuring stroke it would be the same regardless of where you measured it from, whether you measured from the top of the piston, or inside of the dish, at the bottom of the bore it'll be the same. ( as long as you're taking the domes depth at TDC into account.) A 3.5" stroke up against a 4" bore is gonna net you 351 c.i. Even Taking into account the over bore, the engine will only be slightly bigger, certainly not 393 inches.

If you decide to stroke the engine, the piston changes everything. A longer stroke requires that the pin location in the piston is moved higher to allow the extra stroke w/o pushing the piston out of the hole.

And, a 408 is a better choice in strikers than a 393. It's a better rod angle ratio combination, will not cost that much more, and will be better for power in the long run because of it.

JD1964 · Nov 15, 2018

If you get a longer stroke crank, it needs to be matched with compatible pistons. The pistons are shorter to accommodate the longer stroke.

https://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2003/09/stroker/

351cougar69 · Nov 16, 2018

CarMichael Angelo said:
If you're measuring stroke it would be the same regardless of where you measured it from, whether you measured from the top of the piston, or inside of the dish, at the bottom of the bore it'll be the same. ( as long as you're taking the domes depth at TDC into account.) A 3.5" stroke up against a 4" bore is gonna net you 351 c.i. Even Taking into account the over bore, the engine will only be slightly bigger, certainly not 393 inches.

If you decide to stroke the engine, the piston changes everything. A longer stroke requires that the pin location in the piston is moved higher to allow the extra stroke w/o pushing the piston out of the hole.

And, a 408 is a better choice in strikers than a 393. It's a better rod angle ratio combination, will not cost that much more, and will be better for power in the long run because of it.

Thank you for this explanation that makes alot of sense ok, also I did see what you mean about the 408 stroker kit being the same cost wise and just includes a longer stroke, so my next question would then pertain to valve reliefs, 1 how do I know if I need them, should I get them, and how could I still get around 9.5:1 compression... I apologize for all the questions btw this is the first engine I build ever, I'm taking notes from a teacher of mine in college who built motors in his you ger years and combining that with knowledge here and on Google to put together my engine lol. Anywho I want to run possibly afr 205 on this build as I've read amazing things from them and have a mild edelbrock cam, I could replace it if necessary however I had planned to keep it; it has a 224 int lift and 234 exh lift duration at 0.50 inch

Steel1 · Nov 16, 2018

https://www.rbracing-rsr.com/compstaticcalc.html
Use the above calculator.
I would imagine those cam specs you listed are duration not lift ?
If that is lift you will definitely need a bigger cam.

CarMichael Angelo · Nov 16, 2018

A 408, with 205 heads will be cheated out of a lot of power if you choose the wrong cam. That is something ALWAYS best left up to the experts. When the time comes for you to choose a cam, and you know everything else about the combination
(I.e. The cars weight, transmission, gear ratio, your intended use, type induction,) then you call dude at XYZ cam grinder, and they'll tell you what's best.

the head you choose will come in different chamber sizes to allow you a lower CR if you so desire, and 9.5:1 is a good target for a pump premium engine. You'll also have to have a pretty significant dish in the piston when going to an engine as big as a 408.

Do you homework, prepare to spend a bunch of money, and don't set a goal that seems too lofty.
( like any big stroker combination will seem) by the time you're fully into a 408 with AFR heads, and all the bolt ons, you'll be in the $7,000.00 range. And if you aren't being honest with yourself, 7 k may as well be 70k.

a91what · Nov 16, 2018

The above about letting the experts help with the cam selection is true, I let Brian Freezy design my cam for a 306ci engine with a eaton m112 blower on top of it. told him what i wanted out of the combo and he ground me a 224i 236e at .050 duration .57x lift on both cut at a 114* lsa..... a big cam for a 306, the car drives like its stock sounds real nice at idle and rips when the boost comes in.... let an expert set you up, you wont be disappointed.

90sickfox · Nov 17, 2018

For a 393 stroker...the correct pistons would be 302 pistons....correct ?

That was the budget stroker for years...393 crank + 302 pistons with .030 bore. Essentially, only needing a crank and some 302 pistons.

With 408 you need specific pistons ( I thought ).

Steel1 · Nov 18, 2018

90sickfox said:
For a 393 stroker...the correct pistons would be 302 pistons....correct ?

That was the budget stroker for years...393 crank + 302 pistons with .030 bore. Essentially, only needing a crank and some 302 pistons.

With 408 you need specific pistons ( I thought ).

Correct

CarMichael Angelo · Nov 18, 2018

90sickfox said:
For a 393 stroker...the correct pistons would be 302 pistons....correct ?

That was the budget stroker for years...393 crank + 302 pistons with .030 bore. Essentially, only needing a crank and some 302 pistons.

With 408 you need specific pistons ( I thought ).

That may have been the case back in the day, but now days, a 351 w block, and 1000.00 gets you 408-416 c.i.

Crank, rods, pistons, ( hyperucraptic ) pins, bearings, and locks. For somebody that is just looking for a big power, big torque " big block in a small block" pkg, that isn't looking to add a power adder on top of it, this would be perfect.

351 windsor build

351cougar69

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Steel1

Mustang Master

hoopty5.0

mechanicus terribilis

JD1964

there is enough sticking out to grab on to

nelzfoxes

351cougar69

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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

JD1964

there is enough sticking out to grab on to

351cougar69

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Steel1

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CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

a91what

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90sickfox

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands

Steel1

Mustang Master

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

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351 windsor build

New Member

Mustang Master

mechanicus terribilis

there is enough sticking out to grab on to

New Member

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

there is enough sticking out to grab on to

New Member

Mustang Master

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

SendMeUrDataLog

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands

Mustang Master

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

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