410ci 100% street car - manual valve body?

BlackVert

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#1

• Jul 25, 2007

• #1

I am 99% convinced that I want to go with a manual valve body for my car. Please tell me if I am going to regret it. Here's the pertinent info:

- 410ci stroker motor
- 3.27 gears
- 100% street car, essentially a daily driver, not in the snow tho
- Forward pattern manual shift VB from broaderperformance.com
- there is a shift modulator that takes manifold vacuum to soften part throttle shifts

The car was, up until now, a 302 with a manual tranny and 3.73 gears, so I am used to shifting all the time. My reason for going to an automatic is that the 4R70W can handle the power of my new motor, and they are very inexpensive compared to getting a manual tranny and clutch built that can handle this motor's power. And it might be nice down the road to convert to a full automatic if the gridlock in the DC area gets much worse ....

I am thinking that this will be similar to the manual tranny, except I won't be using my left foot anymore. Am I making a mistake?

Will I be able to put it directly into 2nd and drive around in the neighborhood without shifting at all?

 

Grn92LX

Fidanza Man!

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#2

• Jul 25, 2007

• #2

I'd use a reverse manual vb. No, if you put it in second, it'd be like starting out in second gear. You'd probably heat the trans and converter up.

 

BlackVert

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#3

• Jul 25, 2007

• #3

I haven't found anyone who makes a reverse pattern manual VB for a 4R70W ... I agree tho, that would be more convenient.

I'll just have to shift from 1st into 2nd around the neighborhood, no big deal.

 

F

fordtech28

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#4

• Jul 25, 2007

• #4

If it were me I would take it to a tranny specialist to see whats up with .It can be something inside the transmission not working right I've heard many people say great things about putting a 4R70W tranny behind a big motor with no problems if they have problems its normally mechanical like the torque converter not being right for the tranny and motor combo or the tranny being in need of a full rebuilt if it was purchased used since they can look good when you take the pan off but have clutch packs fused to each other .I bet you are super frustrated right now with the tranny hopefully it will all pan out .Good Luck

 

BlackVert

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#5

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believe me, i've done that. they hooked it up to their own test controller and said the tranny was fine; it isn't being given the correct commands.

i have taken it to all the places i can think of, and noone wants to touch it because they say too much custom stuff has been done to it.

so i was between going to a manual VB or a baumannator, and i decided on the manual VB because the install is much more straightforward.

 

blksn955.o

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#6

• Jul 25, 2007

• #6

IDK...

I see alot of guys on the nloc opt for the nater' over a manual on mass air swaps.


Granted that is with an E4od but if its a street car sitting in traffic...I would bet it gets old fast.

It would be cool though, just my .02

 

earleys94gt

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#7

• Jul 25, 2007

• #7

The way I see it, you'd be getting the action of a manual but in the automatic package(without the clutch pedal). If the manual VB offers "5 speed" like accel. and "get up and go", I'd lean more toward the VB. That, plus the more straight foreward installation you mentioned.

 

Pokageek

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#8

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• #8

NM

 

BlackVert

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#9

• Jul 25, 2007

• #9

what do you mean you can't downshift? are you saying you can't shift from 3rd to 2nd if you are slowing down or whatever? wow

and what do you mean about not being able to HOLD a gear? you can lock the torque converter.

 

94-302-vert

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#10

• Jul 26, 2007

• #10

I had a sebring before this that had the "manual valve body" for all intents and puposes... thought it would be cool... I ended up never using it... without the ability to dump the clutch vs shift easy it took all the fun out of it...

To me I would go with the 'nator since you are staying with the auto.

 

BlackVert

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#11

• Jul 26, 2007

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chris, what i am talking about is a fully manual auto, meaning that if you don't shift it, it won't shift. shifting is not optional. it is very much like a manual tranny, just without the clutch.

you put it into overdrive with a switch located on the shifter handle, and you can choose to lock the torque converter if you want with another switch located wherever you choose to put it. for me, that will probably be on the steering wheel, near the cruise control switches on the left side, assuming i can fab something up there.

 

Pokageek

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#12

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[NM

 

94-302-vert

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#13

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Chris, I was simply saying that without the clutch is not as good as a mnaul and you may as well just have the automatic. Just my $0.02 from where I am sitting.

 

Grn92LX

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#14

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You can absolutly hold the gears with a manual VB. You can absolutly downshift. Its like driving a stick w/o the clutch. Go for it!

 

Pokageek

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S351Saleen77

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#16

• Jul 26, 2007

• #16

Pokageek said:

I'd be very weary of a blanket statement like that. My cousin cannot do what you are saying and it woul ruin his trans.

Chris, I would be absolutely sure b4 you start clicking thru the gears.

Click to expand...

I do know that Drag racers use them to hold the gears before shifting.

How much are these auto tranny's and a stall conv?? A new Tremec and clutch is around 2k I think.

 

BlackVert

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#17

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94-302-vert said:

Chris, I was simply saying that without the clutch is not as good as a mnaul and you may as well just have the automatic. Just my $0.02 from where I am sitting.

Click to expand...

having the option to be automatic as well is definately a plus. but i have had no luck finding a local shop willing to take on any kind of involved installation, which is holding me back.

Pokageek said:

I'd be very wary of a blanket statement like that. My cousin cannot do what you are saying and it woul ruin his trans.

Chris, I would be absolutely sure b4 you start clicking thru the gears.

Click to expand...

believe me, i intent to make sure before i go fully manual. if i can find a local shop willing to install a baumannator, i will probably go that route, because then i have both options available to me.

 

BlackVert

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#18

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S351Saleen77 said:

I do know that Drag racers use them to hold the gears before shifting.

How much are these auto tranny's and a stall conv?? A new Tremec and clutch is around 2k I think.

Click to expand...

You can get a used 4R70W for under $500, and a good TC goes for about $650.

 

Ozz

I think I have a problem here.

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#19

• Jul 26, 2007

• #19

What setup is your cousin using that he can't downshift? Is it broken? So what's he supposed to do, drive it up to 3rd (or 4th if he has it) and then keep it there until he shuts the car off?

Driving a full manual VB car in traffic is no problem at all. All you do is move the shifter, it's not like you have to keep dicking around with a clutch - THAT gets old fast. To me, anyway. So I don't bother. You can come to a complete stop while fully in 3rd and it won't ruin anything as long as your converter isn't LOCKED UP (doing so while locked up it will take its toll on your converter but it won't blow it up the first time unless it's a POS). Otherwise, no problem and it acts as any other transmission would. If you accelerate from that point, while still in 3rd, you'll feel lag just as if you were in a stick drive car and started in 3rd. No real difference. Just bring it back to 1st or 2nd and proceed down the street.

Regarding the original question, as far as putting it in 2nd and letting it shift goes, like I told you before you can do that but ONLY IF YOU GET A VALVE BODY THAT IS MADE TO OPERATE AS SUCH. There's a FULL manual valve body meaning you up/down shift everything, and there's a manual valve body that operates like stock in "D" position but also lets you shift on your own whenever you want. Different parts. Other than the bonus of being able to put it in D and let it handle itself they are basically the same thing.

BlackVert - if you ever happen to be up here in MA for some reason I'd love to let you feel the car and transmission.

 

Pokageek

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#20

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