65 Fastback front end rise

[chemeng]

Hey guys,

Just did a ton of mods (listed below). When I nail the accelerator the front end rises and won't settle back down. Total rise is about 4 inches. Really throws the toe out and the car is all over the place. I have to get out and bounce on the front bumper a few times to get it right again. I have stock upper and lower A arms, springs and shocks. Upper and lower A arms are new, all tie rods are new.

Recent Mods include:

TCP Manual Rack
Granada disc brakes with Granada spindles
331 Stroker w/aluminum heads
T-5 Conversion

Had power steering originally so with all the mods above I've removed a lot of weight from the front end if it makes any difference.

Anybody run into this?

Thanks, Mike

 

[Sicarius428]

You probably took close to 100 lbs off the front end. Something must be binding because if it were the springs, you wouldn't be able to get it to come back down. Can the shocks be holding it up. Try pulling them out and see if you can compress them outside the car. Possibly the manual rack has some binding... not really sure. Good luck.
Kevin

 

[cardude]

i have had binding before when doing my LCA. good idea that I got off this forum is to loosen up the LCA and put the weight of the car on it then re-tighten. it could be in the bushings.

good luck

 

[dodgestang]

Granada disc brakes with Granada spindles

Solution
Well heck....I can't find the solution....Cloney had it typed up once and I can't seem to find it.

there it is
http://www.sunflower.com/~vervaecke/our_story.htm
http://www.sunflower.com/~vervaecke/granada.htm

 

[2bav8]

Funny, I have Granada spindles and that problem has never occured.

Now, a combination between Granada spindles and the rack and pinon might be causes excessive toe changes (bump steer)?
Try a set of Baer Trackers, allows bump steer to be adjusted.

 

[bnickel]

for some reason it doesn't happen to all cars with the granada spindles, not sure if anyone has ever figured out why, though.

 

[2bav8]

There was a guy on the VMF (moneymanager) who had the same problem, but he had 65-66 spindles. Turned out his upper control arm bushings were shot and was causing the suspension to bind.

That was after he spend big $$$ to have somebody else figure it out for him.

When the suspension was reassembled and tightened, was it on the ground or up in the air?

 

[chemeng]

65 Front end rise

There was a guy on the VMF (moneymanager) who had the same problem, but he had 65-66 spindles. Turned out his upper control arm bushings were shot and was causing the suspension to bind.

That was after he spend big $$$ to have somebody else figure it out for him.

When the suspension was reassembled and tightened, was it on the ground or up in the air?

It was up in the air, they pre-packed the upper A arms then replaced springs/suspension. I am looking hard at my stock shocks, got them at Autozone and am wondering if they are bottoming out and sticking. Don't think it is the rack, had the problem before I put it in and replaced the upper control arms. Didn't have the problem until I put the stroker in and had enough horses to raise the front significantly.
I will check/replace front shocks with better ones and re-torque lower control arms then grease the crap out of everything.

Thanks for the suggestions!

MikeR

 

[chemeng]

Hey Dodgestang,

Just read "Our Story", exact description of what is happening. My Granada exchange has been one problem after another. IF I go back to '65 spindles and restore the geometry will bumpsteer go away? Is this a problem with all Mustangs and wide tires?

Thanks, MikeR

 

[prpony]

Take a look at your strut rod bushings. I had the same problem and it turned out to be expired bushings cracking and falling apart after installing new suspension parts.

 

[Sicarius428]

Well if you hit a good bump which causes the tires to toe in... it will lift the car some and not settle if the tires are still toed in. Kind of like how I can't fit a jack under my k-member on my 90 without a board under one tire but when I let it down, I can pull the jack out just fine. The front suspension fully extended in the air, narrowing the track and when I lower it, the tires are putting the force outwards so the suspension cannot fully compress till I move the car relieving it. Not sure if I confused you more or myself more with that... hope that helped.
Kevin

 

[chemeng]

It has all new strut rod bushings. It is definitely bump steer, I've got 3" difference in toe just by flexing the suspension. I've got 17" tires to go with the Granada spindles that really aggravate the problem. Checked the tie rods, they are a good half inch above the lower control arm. I've read the tie rods should be even with the LCA. Not good since they are trying to rotate in different arcs.
Have to decide if I want to do the Baer Bumpsteer kit or swap back to the '65 spindles and all new brake system. Hate to spend another $160 on the kit, if it doesn't work then spend extra on the new spindles/brakes.
MikeR

 

[Eyeless_Seven]

Drive foward and it raises up, put it in reverse and it will drop back down.
Seen it happen before when a friend replaced a upper control arm not sure what caused it. His was on a stock brake setup.

 

[mdjay]

Does the car make any sounds, when it settles down or when you push down on it?

 

[chemeng]

Doesn't make any sounds. I can't push it down on the asphalt, has to be on the smooth concrete then you can hear the tires squeal as the toe goes back in place. I have to back it up if I am on the road, only way to get the rise back down again.

 

[mdjay]

You need to take a close look at the UCA when it is stuck. I've seen some imported aftermarket UCA's that have some extra material that could bind by the shaft. If possible, get it on a 4 post when it's in the raised position.

I'm hoping you greased all the new joints and UCA shaft upon installation.

 

[chemeng]

Yes, pre-loaded the UCA's before I put them in. Heard some won't load properly if they aren't greased before installation. Really laid the grease to all joints several times.
It really looks like a Bumpsteer issue. I have Granada spindles and wide (17") tires. Seems to be the combination that fails. Trying to decide whether to dump the whole thing and go back to a '65 spindle or try the Baer Tracker Bumpsteer kit.
Thanks, MikeR

 

[dodgestang]

'65 spindle or try the Baer Tracker Bumpsteer kit.
Thanks, MikeR

I run the 65 spindle, the baer kit, ssbc front disc, 17x8 and a 245 tire. I do not have this issue.

 

[65 fastback]

I've got Granada spindles on my '65 and do not have this issue. I did have bumpsteer, but was able to make it unperceptable with the Baer Tracker kit. See signature for other front end components.

Tim

 

[Thomas Williams]

Solution
Well heck....I can't find the solution....Cloney had it typed up once and I can't seem to find it.

there it is
http://www.sunflower.com/~vervaecke/our_story.htm
http://www.sunflower.com/~vervaecke/granada.htm

Could you post the fix again, it won't load. Thanks