And now... a completely hypothetical question...

32vmonster · Jul 13, 2004

5.0 cammer motor in gt. more power in cobra...both with live axle

GT5oh · Jul 18, 2004

I like the idea of a Cougar if ya get the chance check out this months issue of Hot Rod Magazine (Aug. 04) they have a great article about building a new Cougar under the 5 Cars Detroit Must Build article. They have some good ideas in there. I think if built with cars such as the Infiniti G35 as a direct competior it would be a hit in that category. The market is there for it. As far as the old Cougars having a bad stigma to them, I dont think that at all rember except maybe for the most recent fwd cougar all the other cougars were pretty good sellers and weren't considered poorly built or ugly at the time they were popular. Even the fwd car had good sales at the start. The problem with Mercury is Ford never stays behind it, it brings out new models with a lot of hype then deserts them after 6 or 12 months. Ford can never seem to decide what direction it wants to go with Mercury and changes its mind about once a year this is why Mercury is in trouble and why things like the 99-02 Cougar and 03-04 Maurauder failed they didnt stay behind the product and go all the way they stopped short and failed. I don't think many people are going to remeber the cougar as bad, that definatly wouldn't be a reason not to build a cougar. Mercury needs something like the Cougar to give it a reason to continue and exist they supposedly have like 7 or 8 all new models comming out in the next 4 years lets hope one of those is a new Cougar.

Sxhawnn · Jul 18, 2004

Put the GTR out in classic blue....
Give me a modern interpretation of "Eleanor"

I'd abandon my Evo for either one of those in half a second

eric n · Jul 18, 2004

I think the drag pack idea with the 4:10 gears and more drag oriented suspension and rubber is a SMOKIN idea given the love of many mustang fans for the quarter. GREAT IDEA which can be offered reasonably

brandon_lawson7 · Jul 18, 2004

eric n said:
I think the drag pack idea with the 4:10 gears and more drag oriented suspension and rubber is a SMOKIN idea given the love of many mustang fans for the quarter. GREAT IDEA which can be offered reasonably

and add a shift light in the instrument cluster too perhaps

brandon_lawson7 · Jul 18, 2004

GT5oh said:
I like the idea of a Cougar if ya get the chance check out this months issue of Hot Rod Magazine (Aug. 04) they have a great article about building a new Cougar under the 5 <A TITLE="Click for more information about car" STYLE="text-decoration: none; border-bottom: medium solid green;" HREF="http://search.targetwords.com/u.search?x=5977|1||||cars|AA1VDw"><A TITLE="Click for more information about car" STYLE="text-decoration: none; border-bottom: medium solid green;" HREF="http://search.targetwords.com/u.search?x=5977|1||||cars|AA1VDw">Car</A></A>s Detroit Must Build article. They have some good ideas in there. I think if built with cars such as the Infiniti G35 as a direct competior it would be a hit in that category.

I've read that article and I like the idea myself. It would be a good possible competitor in the upscale coupe market.

SVTdriver · Jul 18, 2004

brandon_lawson7 said:
and add a shift light in the instrument cluster too perhaps

I thought I read there already will be a shift light.

scottie1113 · Jul 18, 2004

Just two thoughts. No drag pack option, please. If you guys who are into the 1/4, go buy your own aftermarket parts, but keep the Mustang affordable. No flame intended here. I just don't believe that it's economically feasible or worth Ford's time to offer this for such a small market.

OK. Now comes the one for which I have to don my flame suit.

I was around for the original Cougars. I had a girlfriend who had one. While aesthetics are subjective, as are driving impressions, I didn't feel that the Cougar could even walk in the shadow of the cars of its day.

Frankly, I think Bill Ford should take Mercury out back behind the barn and put a bullet in its brain. It's a drain on Ford and I can't recall many memorable cars in its history. It's a redundant brand and deserves to go away like Oldsmobile and Buick.

Opinionated? Yes I am. I'm just sick of seeing our car companies throwing away good money after bad.

OK. Take your best shots..

SVTdriver · Jul 18, 2004

My problem with the drag pack option is. won't a 6-speed be useless on the dragstrip? Most guys I talk to don't even want to be in 5th at the end let alone 6th.

brandon_lawson7 · Jul 19, 2004

SVTdriver said:
I thought I read there already will be a shift light.

Where did you read that?

SVTdriver · Jul 19, 2004

I think it was on Brads site.

brandon_lawson7 · Jul 19, 2004

I cant find anything on it. If you find the link let me know.

SVTdriver · Jul 19, 2004

No problem. But it was quite a while ago that I saw it.

calypsocoral302 · Jul 20, 2004

scottie1113 said:
Frankly, I think Bill Ford should take Mercury out back behind the barn and put a bullet in its brain. It's a drain on Ford and I can't recall many memorable cars in its history. It's a redundant brand and deserves to go away like Oldsmobile and Buick.

Opinionated? Yes I am. I'm just sick of seeing our car companies throwing away good money after bad.

OK. Take your best shots..

What Ford probably should have done (but it's too late now):

1) Build a large RWD production version of the 427 with a selection of powertrains ranging from the Duratech30 through a 300+ hp version of the 4.2L Jaguar V-8. Had that been done on a moderate time schedule, it would have beaten the Chrysler 300 to the punch and Ford would be profiting like crazy right now. SOMEBODY really dropped the ball on that.

2) Figure out what to do with Mercury. They could have used two very different, yet equally-effective strategies here. They could have either differentiated Mercury from Ford so that the marque would have a few distinct, performance-oriented cars of its own, justifying the separate network of dealerships currently in existance for Lincoln-Mercury; or they could have severed Mercury from Lincoln and start selling Mercury as upscale-trim versions of stock Fords... which is, in the end, really what they currently are.

3) Make Lincoln competitive. With the DEW98 platform, a link was established between Lincoln and Jaguar (via the Lincoln LS and the Jaguar S-Type, respectively). The top brass at Ford didn't want to have Lincoln follow Cadillac in the quest for world dominance. That's all well and good, but Lincoln could have competed in the mid-lux segment by making a new Continental based on a steel version of Jaguar's aluminum XJ chassis (sort of like what VW did with the Phæton, but with substantially more distinction)... which would give Lincoln a RWD car that could obliterate the Town Car and used their new styling direction to annhilate Buick and potentially snag some sales from Daimler-Benze and Chrysler. Instead, the Town Car is staying around until 2007, when it, and the LS, will be replaced by a pair of big FWD sedans with AWD options. How many Acura RL's do you see on the road? Yeah... that's what I thought...

Ford's skill at managing international marques is very impressive. Volvo has become 'hip', Mazda is dipping heartily into the young adult demographic, Jaguar has become much more profitable, and Aston-Martins sell well enough to keep the marque out of yet-another bankruptcy!

But, back in the USA, I'm somehow beginning to think that this whole "year of the car" marketing BS exists simply to hurl 3 distinct models (Five Hundred, Freestyle, and, later, the Fusion) at the Toyota Camry, hoping one of them will outsell it in their eternal quest to avenge the unseating of the Taurus as "America's Family Sedan".

*Climbs into flame suit* Okay, let 'er rip!

SVTdriver · Jul 20, 2004

calypsocoral302 said:
What Ford probably should have done (but it's too late now):

1) Build a large RWD production version of the 427 with a selection of powertrains ranging from the Duratech30 through a 300+ hp version of the 4.2L Jaguar V-8. Had that been done on a moderate time schedule, it would have beaten the Chrysler 300 to the punch and Ford would be profiting like crazy right now. SOMEBODY really dropped the ball on that.

2) Figure out what to do with Mercury. They could have used two very different, yet equally-effective strategies here. They could have either differentiated Mercury from Ford so that the marque would have a few distinct, performance-oriented cars of its own, justifying the separate network of dealerships currently in existance for Lincoln-Mercury; or they could have severed Mercury from Lincoln and start selling Mercury as upscale-trim versions of stock Fords... which is, in the end, really what they currently are.

3) Make Lincoln competitive. With the DEW98 platform, a link was established between Lincoln and Jaguar (via the Lincoln LS and the Jaguar S-Type, respectively). The top brass at Ford didn't want to have Lincoln follow Cadillac in the quest for world dominance. That's all well and good, but Lincoln could have competed in the mid-lux segment by making a new Continental based on a steel version of Jaguar's aluminum XJ chassis (sort of like what VW did with the Phæton, but with substantially more distinction)... which would give Lincoln a RWD car that could obliterate the Town Car and used their new styling direction to annhilate Buick and potentially snag some sales from Daimler-Benze and Chrysler. Instead, the Town Car is staying around until 2007, when it, and the LS, will be replaced by a pair of big FWD sedans with AWD options. How many Acura RL's do you see on the road? Yeah... that's what I thought...

1) While different versions of the 427 might have sold well. It also may not have. And I for one have not heard the official reason behind not building the 427. There may have been cost issues? This is not to say it should not have been done. I think it is a much better looking car than what they are offering.

2) I agree something needs to be done about Mercury being a knock off of Ford products. But I am not entirely sure that there is enough "performance oriented" market out there. At least not for mercury (Though they have not had any performance oriented vehicles in quite a long time). So maybe they need actual mercury only model. Like the cougar except not just a rebody of the mustang.

3) While making Lincoln competitive is a good goal. There is only so much money the company can risk in a single year. Especially with all the problems they have had losing money. I'd say give it a little time. Volvo and Mazda and astonmartin were all being helped along. At the same time they were developing the mustang and all the other new cars that are coming out in the next couple years. That's a lot of money for a company that people were saying was in trouble for losing billions of dollars. As for the continental. I haven't seen one of those in ages. But I have seen town cars and the LS. And I don't think losing the town car model would be a great idea.

calypsocoral302 · Jul 20, 2004

SVTdriver said:
2) I agree something needs to be done about Mercury being a knock off of Ford products. But I am not entirely sure that there is enough "performance oriented" market out there. At least not for mercury (Though they have not had any performance oriented vehicles in quite a long time). So maybe they need actual mercury only model. Like the cougar except not just a rebody of the mustang.

I disagree with you here, especially if one were to look at sales of Infiniti, Acura, and Lexus. While these luxury companies do share some of the underpinnings with their mainstream counterparts, the lux versions are almost always more powerful and almost always feature sportier handling. Mercury provides neither in comparison to stock Ford models. That was my point.

SVTdriver said:
3) While making Lincoln competitive is a good goal. There is only so much money the company can risk in a single year. Especially with all the problems they have had losing money. I'd say give it a little time. Volvo and Mazda and astonmartin were all being helped along. At the same time they were developing the mustang and all the other new cars that are coming out in the next couple years. That's a lot of money for a company that people were saying was in trouble for losing billions of dollars. As for the continental. I haven't seen one of those in ages. But I have seen town cars and the LS. And I don't think losing the town car model would be a great idea.

True enough. As for the Continental I had envisioned, I was picturing it as a new 4-door saloon, outright replacing the Town Car, whose platform is so ancient it can only compete with the Buick LeSabre and maybe the DeVille, which is being replaced next year.

scottie1113 · Jul 20, 2004

I think you're right about the Town Car. Its buying population is literally dying off, and it finds itself in a similar position to Cadillac a few years ago when they felt the need to regenerate themsleves.

Again, I believe the whole Mercury line is redundant and needs to be scrapped. They're esentially rebadged Fords, offer nothing unique, and have little appeal to buyers, other than the nostalgia of a very tired name.

351CJ · Jul 20, 2004

Unfortunately it appears that D/EW-98 and the LS will be gone in 2 years. Jag will continue on with an updated DEW-98, but no more North American products with D/EW-98. There have been rumors of a new Mark Coupe and a new LS sedan based off D2C, the 05 Stang platform, but these rumors may not be true.

There was just an article in Automotive news that said that Ford is developing a new Town Car and a new Continental off of the FiveHundred platform. The 500 platform is based off the Volvo S80 platform. So it appears Lincoln will not compete with BMW, Mercedes etc. This may be a good strategy as Ford already has Jag to compete with those true luxury brands and Volvo which also competes with them to a certain extent. If Ford can turn Lincoln into a "Better" Buick and Chrysler, it may actually work as there are a lot more possible sales in that price bracket. It would seem silly to have Ford with 3 true luxury brands, Jaguar, Volvo and Lincoln all competing with each other. I say it would be better to get Jag in a position to truely compete head to head with BMW, Mercedes, Audi, the new Caddilac, etc. and let Lincoln slot in a step lower.

If Lincoln slots in a bit lower, it really raises the question as what to to with Mercury. Ford really needs to do something with Mercury besides taking a Ford and putting a new grille and Mercury emblems on them. It's clear that there is a market for conservative styled cars, like the 500 and also a market for in your face styled cars like the 300C and Magnum. Ford should make the Mercury versions with bold styling to compete in that market while using more conservative styling for the Ford models (or viseversa.)

scottie1113 · Jul 21, 2004

I believe that Ford could compete in all segments of the car market if they closed down Mercury, focused their efforts on improved quality, and offered better choices to the car buying public. The Five Hundred amy give them a chance.

If I were Bill Ford, Mercury would be history tomorrow. But I'm not, so this lame brand will totter along until someome realizes that there is really no justification for carrying this marque anymore.

SVTdriver · Jul 21, 2004

You almost make it sound like Ford is ignoring quality to keep the mercury models going. Which we all know is not true. There have been rumors of the demise of mercury for a while now.

And now... a completely hypothetical question...

32vmonster

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