Battery Cable Vs. Welding Cable

94GTLaserRC · May 25, 2008

If you read some of the battery kits on Summit, you will see that some of them say "welding cable instead of battery cable".

Im assuming this is more flexible and allows you to weld the terminals on instead of just crimping them?

Any other info or plusses/minusses on using the welding cable instead of the battery cable?

Want to order my battery relocate kit this week.

Thanks
RC

turbogt · May 25, 2008

94GTLaserRC said:
If you read some of the battery kits on Summit, you will see that some of them say "welding cable instead of battery cable".

Im assuming this is more flexible and allows you to weld the terminals on instead of just crimping them?

Any other info or plusses/minusses on using the welding cable instead of the battery cable?

Want to order my battery relocate kit this week.

Thanks
RC

No, you don't weld copper.. There are different grades of each (battery and welding).. So you can't judge off of that either.. Whichever cable has the most strands will be the most flexible.. I used Stinger expert 1/0 gauge for my batteries, but it sells for about $6 per foot, but you can tie it in a pretty tight knot!!

94GTLaserRC · May 25, 2008

turbogt said:
No, you don't weld copper.. There are different grades of each (battery and welding).. So you can't judge off of that either.. Whichever cable has the most strands will be the most flexible.. I used Stinger expert 1/0 gauge for my batteries, but it sells for about $6 per foot, but you can tie it in a pretty tight knot!!

I wonder why they could call it "welding wire" if you cant weld it?

So basically, if Im buying a Kit from Summit, and i chose the "welding" wire, that just means that It is more flexible and easier to work with?

Thanks
RC

reddy351 · May 25, 2008

They call it welding wire because of it's original intended application...connecting a welder to the contact points on a welder. It is industrial wire that is made for carrying high amperage. (welding.)

It will work fine for battery cables. I used it to make 25' long jumper cables to carry around in the winter time.

94GTLaserRC · May 26, 2008

Thanks....That's a great idea....Make your own Jumper cables.

Thanks for the info.
RC

blksn955.o · May 26, 2008

Welding wire is cheaper by the foot than batt. cable.

If your thinking about getting the kit with wire and specificly the welding wire one. Look at the kit without wire and check out a local welding supply shop you may be able to get it even cheaper overall buy buying the kit without wire and getting your own wire local.

diablostang · May 28, 2008

I used 1/0 gauge welding wire for my battery relocation kit. Worked much better than the crappy wire supplied in my original relocation kit.

1slow95 · May 28, 2008

The wire supplied with my kit barely worked at all. Go with the welding wire.
Make sure you have a good ground as well!

94GTLaserRC · May 28, 2008

I orderd the TAY 48104...the Al. box with the welding wire. Should work well when I ever get to it.

Thanks
RC

madams74 · May 28, 2008

Welding wire is very fine strands of wire encased in the insulation (PICTURE ON RIGHT). Insulation is usually pretty flexible. It does bend easier, and is used for connecting the welder itself to the large alligator ground clamp (mig, tig,or arc), or the welding rod (arc only). You could pull up a picture of an arc welder in a google search and see how flexible this stuff is. The battery cable uses a much stiffer insulation and the strands are a little bit bigger on average (PICTURE ON LEFT). Kinda like comparing soft hair brush to a wire brush. I would not waste your efforts on crimping unless you have the real deal crimper on any style of cable. A specialty tool made just for crimping these connectors is suggested if you insist on having crimped connectors. A shop/bench vice is just ridiculous. I have one method I use and prefer. Get some heat shrink tubing that is big enough for your cable, and slide a piece up on there and back about 2 feet so the next section I mention does not force it to shrink. After you get that heat shrink up 2 feet, trim back enough insulation to expose enough wire to fit inside the copper lug you are going to have to buy. The lugs are rated in size based on your gauge of wire. You need to get a propane or mapp torch and flux cored solder as well. You simply insert the exposed wire into the lug, heat the lug with the propane or mapp torch and continue to apply the solder near the opening. The wire must be clean, oil free, and then the solder will wick into the lug. You have to use your best judgment on when to stop, but you can pretty much tell when it is done. After it cools a bit, you slide up the heat shrink and cover up the lug base and some of your wire. You can use the heat from a lighter, or very carefully the torch to shrink it. Easy and pretty..........

94GTLaserRC · May 29, 2008

madams74 said:
Welding wire is very fine strands of wire encased in the insulation (PICTURE ON RIGHT). Insulation is usually pretty flexible. It does bend easier, and is used for connecting the welder itself to the large alligator ground clamp (mig, tig,or arc), or the welding rod (arc only). You could pull up a picture of an arc welder in a google search and see how flexible this stuff is. The battery cable uses a much stiffer insulation and the strands are a little bit bigger on average (PICTURE ON LEFT). Kinda like comparing soft hair brush to a wire brush. I would not waste your efforts on crimping unless you have the real deal crimper on any style of cable. A specialty tool made just for crimping these connectors is suggested if you insist on having crimped connectors. A vice just ridiculous. I have one method I use and prefer. Get some heat shrink tubing that is big enough for your cable, and slide a piece up on there and back about 2 feet so the next section I mention does not force it to shrink. After you get that heat shrink up 2 feet, trim back enough insulation to expose enough wire to fit inside the copper lug you are going to have to buy. The lugs are rated in size based on your gauge of wire. You need to get a propane/mapp torch and flux cored solder as well. You simply insert the exposed wire into the lug, heat the lug with the propane/mapp torch and continue to apply the solder near the opening. The wire must be clean, oil free, and then the solder will wick into the lug. You have to use your best judgment on when to stop, but you can pretty much tell when it is done. After it cools a bit, you slide up the heat shrink and cover up the lug base and some of your wire. You can use the heat from a lighter, or very carefully the torch to shrink it. Easy and pretty..........

Believe it or not I actually followed most of that Where would I buy those terminals though and

2. If the core flux solder the one that says it is "for electric conductions"?

Thanks
RC

madams74 · May 29, 2008

94GTLaserRC said:
Believe it or not I actually followed most of that Where would I buy those terminals though and

2. If the core flux solder the one that says it is "for electric conductions"?

Thanks
RC

You can buy the lugs at Advance, Autozone, Pep Boys in the battery area. Usually you will find them with the replacement battery cable ends. You can get them in nickleplated or copper. I prefer copper. Just make sure you get the right size for your cable, and the right size hole for your threaded stud that it will be placed over. You can always drill or even file the hole larger if it is not big enough. Go to Radio Shack to be sure you have the right solder. There are plumbing solders that are not flux cored and made of silver for your home pipes as to not poison you with lead. These are not for electrical connections. You need to get rosin flux cored tin/lead mix. Should be like a 60/40 mix on average. I like to use a smaller diameter. Not the thick stuff. A .030 or so diameter is perfect. Just not the crap that you see that looks like a pencil. I use solder all the time for other projects, so it is nice to have around in the smaller size anyway. Honestly you can buy descent solder at Walmart in the auto bulb/terminals area, but you can always ask at Radio Shack...........

blksn955.o · May 29, 2008

Use the map gas MUCH hotter and will make things go faster.

With things so small and loose you may want to use a vice to hold the term. and secure the wire to make sure it does not move. That way you can also let things cool down and you dont have to worry about things heating up and burning your hands.

94GTLaserRC · May 29, 2008

madams74 said:
You can buy the lugs at Advance, Autozone, Pep Boys in the battery area. Usually you will find them with the replacement battery cable ends. You can get them in nickleplated or copper. I prefer copper. Just make sure you get the right size for your cable, and the right size hole for your threaded stud that it will be placed over. You can always drill or even file the hole larger if it is not big enough. Go to Radio Shack to be sure you have the right solder. There are plumbing solders that are not flux cored and made of silver for your home pipes as to not poison you with lead. These are not for electrical connections. You need to get rosin flux cored tin/lead mix. Should be like a 60/40 mix on average. I like to use a smaller diameter. Not the thick stuff. A .030 or so diameter is perfect. Just not the crap that you see that looks like a pencil. I use solder all the time for other projects, so it is nice to have around in the smaller size anyway. Honestly you can buy descent solder at Walmart in the auto bulb/terminals area, but you can always ask at Radio Shack...........

The one I have is "lead free" but it is for electrical conductions.. That's no good?

WHen I looked I only found ones that were lead-free.

RC

madams74 · May 29, 2008

Lead free solder needs more heat to make it flow, so MAPP gas is must. The problem with lead free solder is that it tends not to wick as well, and can easily cause cold solder joints. The term "cold" solder joint has nothing to do with heat. It simply means that it looks like it is going to hold but after some movement and vibration the connection weakens and causes problems. It tends to stress crack in the joint, especially around a heat source. 90% of most electronics that flake in and out and work sometimes and then you tap on them, and the problems goes away are a cold solder joint somewhere. I would buy the good stuff, and just stay clear of lead free.

FYI:
My company is staying away from it as long as we can, but one day EPA or customers will require it for everything. I dread the day. Anyone here have an RCA television that does not work, but you have to smack it every now and then,and it works? RCA's made in Mexico are famous for their cold solder joints on their televisions. Easy fix, get a hot iron and go to town on the joints, works everytime. Especially near the rear transformer. XBOX 360 owners also having the red ring of death? Same problem, cold solder joint. Why? Lead free solder........

94GTLaserRC · May 30, 2008

madams74 said:
Lead free solder needs more heat to make it flow, so MAPP gas is must. The problem with lead free solder is that it tends not to wick as well, and can easily cause cold solder joints. The term "cold" solder joint has nothing to do with heat. It simply means that it looks like it is going to hold but after some movement and vibration the connection weakens and causes problems. It tends to stress crack in the joint, especially around a heat source. 90% of most electronics that flake in and out and work sometimes and then you tap on them, and the problems goes away are a cold solder joint somewhere. I would buy the good stuff, and just stay clear of lead free.

........

Hey...does Using the heat shink around the terminal connectors after the solder is applied help that at all? It's hard for me to find the "good" stuff.

Thanks
RC

madams74 · May 30, 2008

Heat shrink prevents the oxidation from occurring on the post. Copper, and solder will tarnish quickly and make it look like the green tone of the Statue of Liberty in a few weeks. It is not really necessary though, but your half performing the job. If your afraid of your ability to solder it would also prevent the wire from coming loose and laying down on a grounded area of the engine compartment. People are saying to themsleves now "Wait, it does not matter it is a battery cable and the cable it not live because it is off the battery." Wrong. The cable is still attached to a spinning alternator, which would still allow those wonderful thermal fuses inline with you alternator wiring to go up in smoke. I would use it.

Your vague on the "good" stuff. If you mean heat shrink, I was referring to the solder. Heat shrink is heat shrink. You can find some of it with a interior coating but it is not needed. Autozone, Advance, Napa, Pep Boys, Carquest, etc they all got the stuff in a bag. It is usually with the crimp on wire terminals. You can buy a multicolor tubing bag with different sizes as well. I have given you everything you need, but for you to have a hard time finding these things makes no sense. Man I grew up in the hills, near a Kentucky and Ohio border town, we had a Radio Shack, and parts stores.

94GTLaserRC · May 30, 2008

No...what I meant was "good stuff" meaning solder with lead...Cant find it at HD.

My question with heat shring meant: will having the heat shrink help prevent some of the Cold solder joints from occuring, since the shring keeps it wrapped tighter, so the joing may not jar loose?

I will check Radio shack for the lead solder. I want to to this job RIGHT!!

RC

Gearbanger 101 · May 30, 2008

94GTLaserRC said:
I wonder why they could call it "welding wire" if you cant weld it?

.....Sorry, I don't mean to laugh RC, but I hit the floor when I read this. Reminds me of the kid who asks why they call them "Hamburgers" if there's no Ham in them?

...but you get it now.

94GTLaserRC · May 30, 2008

I used to ask that...LOL

Anyway...Battery kit came in today!

RC

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