Car wont FIRE!

[FordRacing302]

I have a 83 mustang with '69 302 in it and it will not FIRE...I just recently bought a brand new dizzy and a pertronix ignitor system and I also got a Accel super stock coil to go along with that....I check for spark at the plug and its fine, I look down the carb and I see plenty of gas but it just will not start...Could someone lead me in the right direction, im stumped.

I think it might have to do with firing order and timing??? So where do I start with that???

 

[69Rcode_Mach1]

First confirm your firing order. It should be 15426378, if that doesn't work you need to verify your timing. To do that you should also verify TDC with a piston stop. Once verified set the damper at 10 degrees advance. Then take the cap off the distributor and rotate it until it is pointing to the #1 plug wire. This will get you very accurate timing provided your pointer is correct, hence the use of a piston stop. Now it should fire especially if you are getting spark and gas. If not then the next thing to check is the spark plugs. I have had this problem too, and my plugs turned out to be fouled. Just because they spark does not mean they aren't fouled. Make sure you have your gap set properly and take them out and give them a scrub with a toothbrush and some brake cleaner. It should fire up after all that, unless your wires or cap could be bad. Hope this helps.

 

[krash kendall]

You have get the #1 cylinder to TDC. Crank at 0*, piston at top of bore and both valves closed. Install your distributor and locate the rotor to point to where you want #1 to be on the cap. Then advance it a bit so it will start by rotating the distributor clockwise a little. Then wire the leads counter clockwise in the order 15426378. It sounds like yours is completely mixed up, you are 180* out, or your timing is way off.

 

[FordRacing302]

Thanks for your help guys...Ill give ya an update tomorrow once I get a chance to correct the problem

 

[FordRacing302]

Well, I took off the pass side valve cover and set the #1 piston on TDC (compression stroke) and then set the distributor a little advanced, and then checked my firing order...Went to try to start it and its still wont do anything, no pop or any kind of sound...So now im really stumped as to what to do??

 

[86bluecobra]

i would say the dizzy is 180 out it seems to happen to us all.

 

[krash kendall]

Are your plugs getting wet from flooding? Is the motor turning over fast enough or have you cranked all the juice out of the battery? What else has been done since the last it ran?

 

[FordRacing302]

i would say the dizzy is 180 out it seems to happen to us all.

But I really dont see any way that it could be??

 

[FordRacing302]

Are your plugs getting wet from flooding? Is the motor turning over fast enough or have you cranked all the juice out of the battery? What else has been done since the last it ran?

Thats the thing, "since it last ran"...Ive never personally seen this motor run and neither did the previous owner, this car keeps getting passed on from 1 person to the other saying that theyll get it running...since the motor was dropped in this car, it has never run

 

[86bluecobra]

i had my 302 out of my truck sitting on the ground when i replaced the distributor. i thought for sure i had it in right. turns out im an idiot some how i must have been top dead center #1 cylinder on the intake stroke not compression or something. truck wouldn't fire. thought ok ill try doing the 180 flip. boom it fired right up. im a idiot. however i was watching rides when the ford engineers were making the new a/c cobra prototype and those guy engineers had the distributor 180 degrees out on the 390 v-10. so i dont feel so bad after i saw that.

 

[krash kendall]

Are you trying to pass old laquered-up gas through it?

 

[FordRacing302]

So how do I go about flipping it??? lol

 

[FordRacing302]

Are you trying to pass old laquered-up gas through it?

Maybe, should i pour some fresh gas throught the carb??

 

[krash kendall]

You can turn the crank one more revolution past what you thought was TDC then pull the cap to see what lead the rotor is pointing at then re-wire it from there. Or go back to the beginning of the thread and follow the instructions Rcode and I gave you.

 

[FordRacing302]

I think it might be my spark, I tested it at the coil and saw a nice fat blue spark, but when I tested it at the spark plug it was a weaker orange...So I knew that the only thing not new in my ignition system was my rotor and cap so I went out and bought a new one but I also need new wires because its a different cap...So tomorrow im going out to pick up the wires and hopefully that will give me a hot spark, all the auto stores are closed tonight

 

[69Rcode_Mach1]

The spark is supposed to be blue, that is hot. Use the method I stated. I just went through this and eliminated all the possiblities. Use what I said to get the timing it is almost exact, If it still doesn't fire then it is 180 degrees out. It is a 4 stroke engine so it may be firing when there is no gas in the cylinders. Then we will go from there.

 

[FordRacing302]

Well I have the passenger side valve cover off and im watching the lifters move so I can get it on TDC, but the weird thing is the exhaust lifter goes down first and the the intake immediately after the exhaust comes up??? I thought this was supposed to be the other way around??

I took my plugs out and gapped them to around .050 and the spark was fat and blue so thats not the problem anymore

 

[FordRacing302]

And another thing you should know is I was working on the car with my friend when we decided i needed a new dizzy so I went inside real quick and when I came out I saw that he yanked the distributor without marking anything, So maybe I installed the dizzy wrong??? How can I check that?

 

[69Rcode_Mach1]

Again go read my post on setting the timing that is how you will know if the dizzy is installed correctly. If you cannot get it to point to the number one plug you are not on the correct tooth. If you can get to it and it doesnt start you are 180 degrees out. So you need to crank it over one more time and then restab it ot get it on the compression stroke.

 

[latamud]

And another thing you should know is I was working on the car with my friend when we decided i needed a new dizzy so I went inside real quick and when I came out I saw that he yanked the distributor without marking anything, So maybe I installed the dizzy wrong??? How can I check that?

All that would have messed up was the timing. With the information on this thread, you should be able to figure it out. You are getting a spark at the plug. You do have fuel entering the intake. Now you need to get them to meet at the same "time". If you have the valve cover off and watch the timg that way, turn the crank clockwise.

Now, the way you explained it"the exhaust lifter goes down first and the the intake immediately after the exhaust comes up" that is correct. As the exhaust valve is opening the piston is coming up for the exhaust stropke pushing the gasses out. Then, the piston comes back down causing a vacuum while the intake valve is open, drawing fuel into the cylinder. Then the intakve valve closes, and up the piston goes compressing the fuel and when it hits the top the spark ignites, etc.

A rough way of getting TDC,from the point in between the exhause valve closing and the intake opening, start with your ratchet at 12 o'clock, and clockwise do one full rotation back to 12. Then, check your balancer timing marks and try to get it closer. If it isn't marked no biggie. At this time, start at the spark plug side of the #1 plug wire. Follow it to the distrubutor cap. Make not of where the wire meets the cap. Lift the cap. The rotor should be close to the spot. Remember, the rotor rotates counter clockwise.

If the rotor is not close, do not pull the distributor. Loosen the mounting bolt and without lifting it up rotate the housing so the #1 spot on the cap meets the end of the rotor. Tighten it back up. From here, try starting the car. If it still doesn't start, loosen the dist. and have someone turn the key. While it is cranking, turn the dist. over a few degrees one way and see if it stumbles. If not, turn the other way. You shoud find a happy medium. That will basically get your timing in the vacinity to start the engine. Good luck. Oh yeah, don't forget to put your valve cover back on.