Dropping Weight.

fost9508 · Nov 8, 2004

In conversations I have had with people, dropping weight is the cheapest way to gain performance…Agree?/Disagree?

I have an 88 GT 5spd, which I would like to keep as a daily driver can anybody recommend ways to take weight off the car?

Thanks,

Fost9508

281pony · Nov 8, 2004

it isint as cheap as performance mods. you can spend 500 dollars on a fiberglass hatch and plexi window or buy a set of heads. do you think 100 pounds or 50 hp is going to be better?

some weight savings are free. rear seat delete, remove rear bumper brace. i wouldnt go as far as saying it is the cheapest way though since you can do alot of weight droppings and not feel a thing.

get racing seats, bypass smog, ac delete, relocate battery, remove rear bumper bracket, remove foglights/bracket, fiberglass hood, fiberglass hatch/plexiglass, tubular k-member, rear seat delete, stuff like that.

N8Miller · Nov 8, 2004

yeah, hes right. you can either drop weight or add power. both will make your car "feel" faster, but only will add HP. I would do the basic bolt-ons before you start to shave some pounds down. what all is done to your car?

crazypete · Nov 8, 2004

I disagree. Reducing weight is free (the first couple hundred pounds at least) but it will improve everything: handling, braking, acceleration, gas milage. It also reduces component stress and makes for a softer ride.

In my opinion:

Adding HP just makes it accelerate better and no other bonuses. Once you run out of meaningful weight reduction projects, move on to gears (torque multiplication: makes better use of torque for acceleration) then pullies (reduces parasitic drag), open exhaust (reduces backpressure so the engine exples exhaust easier), then traction adders (go faster by hooking up right away) and then add HP in the end. You can go quite fast before you need to add any extra HP. First you need to make best use of what's already there.

Plus you can do 90% of this stuff keeping a bone stock emissions legal setup.

I just finished crusading for weight loss in another thread so I recommend looking here for some good ideas:

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=515369

Good luck!

CrazyPete

GTthunder · Nov 8, 2004

i agree with pete. i dropped a good 4 points off my 1/4 et and i didnt spend any money at all

N8Miller · Nov 8, 2004

i think that fost has to define his defintion of performance based on his car. some would say that its braking, handling, stuff like that, but others are 1/4 guys and think that performance is lowering weight to get better ETs......
see what im gettin at?

autoXr1 · Nov 8, 2004

crazypete said:
and makes for a softer ride.

CrazyPete

It depends upon where the weight loss occurs...sprung/unsprung weight ratio. The heavier the sprung weight is compared to the unsprung weight, the softer the ride. Pulling weight off of the chassis without proportional weight losses in suspension/wheel/tire/brake components will lead to a harsher ride, and may not always lead to better handling if the vehicle is skipping across the road surface. Ride quality can be regained if the spring rates are decreased appropriately. There is a little bit more to the subject than meets the eye.

I do agree that the tires have the ability to grip the pavement with "X" amount of force and generally speaking, the lighter the vehicle, the tires can put a larger percentage of that grip towards accelleration, braking, lateral forces, etc. However, the suspension must be tuned, in response to this weight loss, to allow the tires to remain in contact with the pavement.

Then, there is the subject of reducing rotational weight (crankshaft, pistons, driveline, brakes, wheels, and so on), which puts more of the available power to the pavement. That may be another thread, altogether.

From a simple physics standpoint, vehicle weight significantly effects the performance characteristics, however, I'd do a little more research on the subject before I'd suggest gutting the vehicle. From an engineering standpoint, what kind of weight (sprung, unsprung, rotational, etc.), where it occurs (front/rear/left/right), and what compensatory chassis/suspension tuning has occured is probably more important. It's not what you do, but how you do it.

GTthunder · Nov 8, 2004

N8Miller said:
i think that fost has to define his defintion of performance based on his car. some would say that its braking, handling, stuff like that, but others are 1/4 guys and think that performance is lowering weight to get better ETs......
see what im gettin at?

i ctually use my car for drifting and not the track any more. i was just givng a good example. it also makes it easier to break traction or burnout and such

GTthunder · Nov 8, 2004

N8Miller said:
i think that fost has to define his defintion of performance based on his car. some would say that its braking, handling, stuff like that, but others are 1/4 guys and think that performance is lowering weight to get better ETs......
see what im gettin at?

i actually use my car for drifting and not the track any more. i was just givng a good example. it also makes it easier to break traction or burnout and such

fost9508 · Nov 8, 2004

Pete,

Very impressive and a bit intimidating. I don't think I will go your route cuz I still like the creature comforts, not to mention the car probably wouldn't run after I got my hands on all those wires. I am trying to keep it a daily driver, so I would like to keep the heat, A/C is a maybe depending where I live, and the smog stuff is a must. I guess I am stuck with a heavy car. Do you have any updated pics yet? What do you estimate your cars weight is at now?

Thanks for the help.

N8Miller · Nov 8, 2004

fost,
you can get a tubular K member/a arm kit/ coil over for about $700. that along with some other minor things and you just dropped 100-125 lbs. that is worth a tenth or two there.

crazypete · Nov 8, 2004

If you're willing to do without A/C, then you can still do most of that weight removal just fine. The emissions stuff doesnt weight much, it just takes up tons of room. The stock 4-cat system is the heaviest of the bunch (but that can be replaced by a much lighter midpipe with high flow aftermarket catylists), followed by the airpump.

This piece of hardware, in my humble opinion, is a complete waste of space! Ford couldnt think of a better way to pump a light stream of air than a 10-15 pound huge acessory item, darnit. Even if you keep that, it still doesnt weight much. The EGR and PCV dont weight anything.

For heat, I gave up on the dryer tube thing (it got so cold here in new england that the cold air moving past the headers was still cold when it entered the cabin!) and got a pair of transmission coolers. One is up front doing transmission cooler duty in front of the radiator. The other is inline with the return line and is zipped into place under the dash where the stock fan assembly used to be. It has a grid of 9 pc fans tied to the top. It cools the transmission while heating the cabin. Doesnt weigh 5 pounds, maybe 7 pounds fully filled.

One of the best things for weight modification is to move the battery to the trunk. What a difference in traction! Weight off the nose and right above the rear axle.

autoXr1 · Nov 8, 2004

N8Miller said:
fost,
you can get a tubular K member/a arm kit/ coil over for about $700. that along with some other minor things and you just dropped 100-125 lbs. that is worth a tenth or two there.

Fost, Nate is right on with this one, especially for a daily driver. The stock Mustang is front heavy, so removing some front end weight will improve the front/rear weight distribution. The A-arm kit and coil-overs will lighten the unsprung weight and, as a result, will improve the handling and ride, assuming a properly selected spring rate and shock combo.

Anthony Jones Engineering (AJE) has gained the reputation for making some of the best front end systems available for a Mustang race car (drag and roadrace). Not only are they lightweight and strong, they are also engineered with improved front end geometry for better handling.

PhLoBuS · Nov 8, 2004

how much does the rear seats weigh?

Legendary · Nov 8, 2004

N8Miller said:
fost,
you can get a tubular K member/a arm kit/ coil over for about $700.

WHERE!

crazypete · Nov 9, 2004

Dude, go to ebaymotors and type "mustang k member" in the search. There will be some fellows selling ENTIRE MM D&D tubular front ends for $500. Shipping will be another $100-150. These have the tubular a-arms, k-member and coilovers. I ordered one and have it sitting in my basement awaiting install. It looks real nice and sturdy. I wonder how it will hold up on the street? Ebay is the bomb!

Legendary · Nov 9, 2004

Anybody know how these kits' hold up to everyday street driving?

autoXr1 · Nov 9, 2004

PhLoBuS said:
how much does the rear seats weigh?

Maybe 15lbs, if that. It's pretty much all foam, except for the fold-down assembly.

autoXr1 · Nov 9, 2004

Legendary said:
Anybody know how these kits' hold up to everyday street driving?

I think it may depend upon the design of the K-member. The K-members designed for drag racing are typically a bit lighter in construction because it's assumed that there will be minimal lateral loading. I have seen folks posting pictures of broken welds on street-driven cars with drag race K-members.

Those that are built more for road racing are typically heavier-beefier pieces that should hold up to just about anything you can throw at them, but are still quite a bit lighter in weight than the stock piece. Many manufacturers offer both versions.

crazypete · Nov 10, 2004

How about something like the groundpounder? I plan on slapping one of these into my stang soon. Am I begging for disaster? My street is a slalom of potholes, ripples and uneven pavement.

Dropping Weight.

fost9508

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