E303 vs B303 - which provides more low-end torque?

Lab Rat · May 25, 2004

Given the following setup, which of the two Ford cams will produce more low-end torque, E303 or B303? And what about idle quality?

Intake side:
AFR 165's
Trickflow idle to 5500 rpm street intake
Ford 70mm throttle body
Pro-M 75mm MAF

Exhaust side:
BBK long tubes
Off road H-pipe
Magnaflow cat/back

Thanks in advance!

Matt

SwAmPf0x · May 25, 2004

Neither will give low end like the stock cam, probably the E would be better of the 2, for more low end torque with either cam get an indexed timing chain and install at 4 degrees advanced.

SmockDoiley · May 25, 2004

Talk about mismatched parts!! Your exhaust, throttle body, and heads are screaming more rpms, but your intake and advanced cam are screaming low end power, streetability and 5000 rpm power peak. As for which cam, the Ecam because it has less duration which helps idle quality and streetable low end power. With those parts you have on your car I wouldnt go advancing any cam because it wont match the rest of the engine and youll fall on your face before your heads and exhaust are done.

Qwk88LX · May 25, 2004

I believe the B-cam peaks above 4000rpms while the E-cam makes power above 2500rpms. So I would say the E-cam.

Lab Rat · May 25, 2004

SmockDoiley said:
Talk about mismatched parts!! Your exhaust, throttle body, and heads are screaming more rpms, but your intake and advanced cam are screaming low end power, streetability and 5000 rpm power peak. As for which cam, the Ecam because it has less duration which helps idle quality and streetable low end power. With those parts you have on your car I wouldnt go advancing any cam because it wont match the rest of the engine and youll fall on your face before your heads and exhaust are done.

How do you figure that longtubes and an H-pipe are "screaming more RPM's"? The way I have it figured, if you're going for high RPM power you're going to be running shorty headers and an X-pipe. Longtubes by design are going to provide peak toruqe in the low RPM range. I must have missed something in Exhaust 101

Matt

astronut1885 · May 25, 2004

I have the E cam, and it makes good low torque. Honestly, though, I wish I had gone with a bigger cam, but for streetability, the E can't be beat.

houstonstangguy · May 25, 2004

IMO you should go 65mm throttle body, but back to the topic. The E is definitely more streetable than the b, but why limit yourself to those two cams and not a cam better suited to your application? I would go custom myself. Contact Ed Curtis and ask his opinion on your setup and what he could provide in way of a custom cam. www.flowtechinduction.com

QDRHRSE · May 25, 2004

I partly agree with "Doiley". The AFR's really flow on top. The intake is probably not suited to the heads. Long Tubes make good power all around....better than shorties. Whoever said shorties are better for high RPM's needs to read up. Long tubes make torque period. I have heard of a lot of people using an E cam with AFR's with good results. I don't think an E or B is the best cam for that set up but either will work. Something more agressive will make better use of the excellent flow #'s that the AFR's have. A cam with more lift would especially be better. Remember the B and E cams were designed for a GT40 style head.

Michael Yount · May 25, 2004

Ford Racing offers crate engines with both the B and E cam, with both the X and the Y heads. With the Y heads they rate the engines at 315 (e cam) and 320 (b cam) HP. With the X heads they rate them at 340 (e cam) and 345 (b cam). Not trying to get into a debate about the accuracy of their numbers - the point is, there's simply not gonna be a whole lot of difference between the two. With either you'll notice a significant drop in low rpm (below 2500 - the heart of street driving range) torque, and many people have idle quality/stability issues with both on efi set ups. And, if you're gonna spend the money on the rest of the set up, spend a few dollars more on your camshaft. There are others out there that will either 1) equal the topend performance of the alphabet cams while producing stronger low end numbers, or 2) produce similar low end numbers to the alphabet cams while being significantly stronger on top.

90mustangGT · May 25, 2004

B303 = 224/224 @ .480/.480
E303 = 220/220 @ .498/.498
The B cam has more durration, alot more overlap, but less lift. The E cam has less durration, no overlap, but more lift.

I have the B cam on 1.7's advanced 2*. Low vaccume, much rougher idle. Kind of sluggish below 3800 but once you hit 3800 it really kicks in hard.

blown93feature · May 26, 2004

I can tell ya that most of these alphabit cams (not all) are cams that are supercharger or turbo recomended if you read up on them and for the most part they tell ya that if you don't have a standard trans with a non power adder motor than idle quality is sometimes an issue.The "E" will give you the less of the idle issue blues and will produce more low end torque and will slightly pale in comparison to the b as the rpms rise but make no mistake it will perform as expected.

I have ran more than one type of these ford gems and as of right mow I have the infamus "E" and with 10lbs of boost and a pig rich a/f and still made 461rrh and 420 rwt (too loose of a stall) without a tune and even at 5700 where most of the tfs heads that are unported on the exhaust side fall off the chart the motor wanted more.I will go to 6g next time and see what happens as this motor combo is all based on the stock bottom end with 1.72rr's being used on the tfs heads and intake and fms hcp unequal shorties.

I thought that when I went to exhaust 101 that long tube were the king of high rpm torque increases but maybe I was taught wrong.

SmockDoiley · May 26, 2004

A dollar a donut that long tube headers provide topend power with a loss down low. A shortie will never outflow a long tube. Like I said, the lower duration in the Ecam will make more lowend torque but less topend power because it wont keep the valves open long enough to provide air for the faster cylinders. If I were you, I would look into TrickFlow cams because they are the same cheap price as an alphabet cam, but they are dual patterned. Dual pattern compensates for Ford's weak exhaust side, but also still provide a decent idle. Their middle cam has the same duration as the B cam, 224, but the exhaust side has 232, and the lift is .542/.563. That cam will still idle fine since its the same duration and lift as the X303 except for the exhaust side of course, and I have an X303 in my car right now. I can get my car to idle down at 500 if I want it to. If I could do it again, I'd do the TrickFlow cam because I need more exhaust support for my supercharged combo.

grrrrrrr · May 26, 2004

I have the b303 in my car. If you want low end torque that is better or comparable to the stock cam, you're going to be a bit disapointed.. That said, the top end pull when it hits 2500 - 3000 rpm really starts to get interesting... The lope is noticeable at startup but when the motor warms up it all but disappears. I do have problems sometimes when the idle starts to fluctuate and it might die, but it's nothing a blip of the throttle won't cure. The guy I had bought this cam from (he bought two, the e and the b) decided after putting in the e cam that he wished he had put in the b, but since the work was already done he decided against it. So there you have it, a perspective from a b cammed mustang..

grrrrrrr · May 26, 2004

OH! and I only have idle issues in the heat of the summer...

Lab Rat · May 26, 2004

SmockDoiley said:
A dollar a donut that long tube headers provide topend power with a loss down low.

Ohhhh, I think you might owe me a donut on this one! I just read something about this topic a couple weeks or so ago. Seems that what I read said that above 4000 rpm that there was little to no difference between unequal shorties, equal shorties and longtubes, but that below 4000 long tubes had higher torque numbers. Can't remember where I read this though, give me a little time to find it. And if I can't then I'll concede the point.

Matt

89CopCoupe · May 26, 2004

MMFF built a combo almost identical to yours (24lbers?) with the 'E' and made 286@5600/316@4200 ...... both numbers dyno'd at the rear wheels through a T-5.

The article stated that although the numbers weren't huge, the combo had a nice broad powerband from 2600-5800.

E303 vs B303 - which provides more low-end torque?

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