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egr question, lend me your ear.

  • Thread starter Thread starter blownlxvert
  • Start date Start date Feb 23, 2006

blownlxvert

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Nov 3, 2005
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endicott n.y.
Feb 23, 2006
#1
  • Feb 23, 2006
  • #1
my set up, 88 speed density with a s/c. im not concerned with eliminating the egr itself but i want to ditch all the plumbing. the pump was already removed and hoses are cut and plugged. also the egr tubes themselves are plugged with carbon, so probobly not functioning at all anyways. will i be better off ditching the mess of hoses and keeping the valve bolted on and plugged in?
 

jrichker

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Feb 23, 2006
#2
  • Feb 23, 2006
  • #2
I would highly recommend that you learn what equipment does what before removing any of it. Remove the wrong part and the computer goes into limp mode and runs at reduced performance levels.

The EGR and smog pump are two different systems. They do not share any components except the computer.

The smog pump or Thermactor Air System delivers air to the heads and cats. Without a working smog pump, the cats will clog and fail.

The EGR recirculates exhaust gases into the intake manifold. The EGR shuts off at Wide Open Throttle (WOT), so it has minimal effect on performance. The addition of exhaust gas drops combustion temperature, increases gas mileage and reduces the tendency of the engine to ping. It can also reduce HC emissions by reducing fuel consumption.

The EGR system has a vacuum source (line from the intake manifold) that goes to the EVR, computer operated electronic vacuum regulator. The EVR is located on the back of the passenger side shock strut tower. The EGR valve and the passages in the heads and intake manifold route exhaust gas to the EGR spacer (throttle body spacer). The computer uses RPM, Load. and some other factors to tell the EVR to pass vacuum to open the EGR valve. The EGR sensor tells the computer how far the EGR valve is open. Then computer adjusts the signal sent to the EVR to hold, increase or decrease the vacuum. The computer adds spark advance to compensate for the recirculated gases and the slower rate they burn at.

Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds.


The EGR sensor is basically a variable resistor, like the volume control on a radio. One end is 5 volt VREF power from the computer (red/orange wire). One end is computer signal ground (black/white), and the middle wire (brown/lt green) is the signal output from the EGR sensor. It is designed to always have some small voltage output from it anytime the ignition switch is the Run position. That way the computer knows the sensor & the wiring is OK. No voltage on computer pin 27 (brown/lt green wire) and the computer thinks the sensor is bad or the wire is broken and sets code 31. The voltage output can range from approximately .6-.85 volt.

EGR test procedure courtesy of cjones

to check the EGR valve:
bring the engine to normal temp.
connect a vacuum pump to the EGR Valve
apply 5in vacuum to the valve.
if engine stumbled or died then EGR Valve and passage(there is a passageway through the heads and intake) are good.
if engine did NOT stumble or die then either the EGR Valve is bad and/or the passage is blocked.
if engine stumbled, connect vacuum gauge to the hose coming off of the EGR Valve
snap throttle to 2500 RPM (remember snap the throttle don't hold it there).
did the vacuum gauge show about 5in vacuum?

if not, check for manifold vacuum at the EGR vacuum valve.
if you have manifold vacuum then connect vacuum gauge to the EGR valve side of the vacuum valve and snap throttle to 2500 RPM.
should read about 5in vacuum


Here's a book that will get you started with how the Ford electronic engine control or "computer" works.

Ford Fuel Injection & Electronic Engine Control 1988-1993 by Charles Probst :ISBN 0-8376-0301-3.

It's about $20 from Borders.com see http://www.amazon.com/ . Select boo...very good, and I found it to be very helpful.
 

blownlxvert

New Member
Nov 3, 2005
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endicott n.y.
Feb 23, 2006
#3
  • Feb 23, 2006
  • #3
um ok, i appreciate the disertation on the physics of the egr system. not being rude but its not my first time under the hood of a automobile. its a simple ques. deserving of a short and sweet answer. removing egr valve and associated plumbing seems to be common practice here in the mustang world and simple enough for a blind monkey to figure out. IS THERE A DIFFERENCE IN REMOVING THE ENTIRE SYSTEM, VALVE AND ALL COMPARED TO JUST REMOVING THE PLUMBING? thank you. difference meaning driveabilty, throwing codes lights etc. sorry if my wording threw you off but i am aware of the differences.
 

vristang

15 Year Member
Mar 31, 2005
4,933
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Seattle
Feb 23, 2006
#4
  • Feb 23, 2006
  • #4
Maybe you need to read jrichkers post again.
There is no external plumbing on the stock egr system. Most likely the plumbing you are talking about is for the smog pump. So your question doesn't really make sense.

I have pulled the egr off my car. I regret it every day. There are potential problems with the computer (timing), and there is no gain to be found in performance (wot). To truely remove the egr you will need to modify the computer code.

I would love to see a back to back dyno test, but never have.

If you are bound and determined to pull the egr, just be aware that there is a bad way, a worse way, and a not too bad way to remove this system.

jason
 

sunil6784

Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Boston, MA
Feb 23, 2006
#5
  • Feb 23, 2006
  • #5
A lot of people have had problems just by removing the EGR, makes the computer throw codes.
 
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