Exhaust leak + rattle to Dealer = Cross Member Vibration

[Jenns01TA]

The humor of it all.... How does an exhaust leak become a vibration from the cross member? Somewhere between reality and fantasy is the Twilight Zone.......

So, I have this nice little ricer sound when I juice the Stang. It is also heard at around fast idle in the morning and then drops off. I look. Hmmm.. Small crack in the weld at the muffle and the pipe. No biggie. But, I decide to take it in Wednesday 7:00 am and tell my usual service advisor that there is crack in the weld where the pipe meets the muffler and there is a resonating vibration from the muffler.

YUP. He types the ususal.... "customer reports exhaust leak. Check and report"

This same man has been with me through 3 TSBs and a light assembly issue. He really should have known. But, he decided to listen to his guys.

I am always a lady. I never raise my voice or act less than dignified. My only requirement has always been that I be told when my vehicle moves from one tech area to another. This gives me a chance to try to redirect this man before his "techs" spend useless wasted hours where there is no problem.

So, he calls me yesterday at about 12:00 to tell me that the exhaust tech does not think it is an exhaust issue. He thinks it is a vibration that is traveling from the cross member. I proceed to have a discussion concerning this purported issue and try to redirect him back to the exhaust. NOPE. WOMAN = NO IDEA. Alrighty then. I tell this gentleman, "Okay George, here we go again. Tell the guys to have fun and get back to me when they get back to exhaust world"... He laughs with a nervous tone....

I get a call this morning... "Jenn, George from Future Ford. Well, the lot attendant that started your car to move it this morning heared the resonating vibration sound. We sent the car back to the exhaust tech and yes, ma'am you are correct. He found the crack in the weld you said was there and it appears the vibration is the due to the interior muffler baffles being cracked. We need to order........ " YOU THINK?

I say "So, I guess it is out of the question to send yesterday's tech over to Marco Muffler and pick me up a Flowmaster AT series 40 instead huh?".... AGAIN he emits his nervous laugh.

So, I tell him to Button up the lil stang. I need the car and I will bring it back when the muffler arrives. When I go to get it, I swing by to thank this poor man for his time. He walks me out and proceeds to say

"I have an agreement to make with you. You were right. You have always been right. I am making a note in your vehicle Oasis profile that says if the customer reports a problem. Concentrate in that area unless she says she is unsure." "I have 4 hour labor in suspension that I now have to justify. If a tech comes to me again and says "I don't think... I am sending him back to the shop with a "Find it...it's there..Jenn said"... He shook my hand and gave me a wink... Ending with "Young lady, it is a sincere pleasure doing business with you, I only wish my technicians were half as capable in diagnostics." WWWOOOOOOTTTTTTT

Lesson learned for him. I walked away with a little pep in my step and a smile knowing I just escaped.... THE TWILIGHT ZONE.

Jenn

 

[The Fang]

They should pay you for the diagnosis. huh?

 

[gneal]

Awesome story Jenn.

 

[bigcat]

the tech is always the last to know. why is it so hard for dealers to hire good techs? instead, they hire the hacks, even if their work comes back 3 or 4 times to get it right.

there are some really good techs out there, but i never seem to be able to find them locally.

 

[Jenns01TA]

the tech is always the last to know. why is it so hard for dealers to hire good techs? instead, they hire the hacks, even if their work comes back 3 or 4 times to get it right.

there are some really good techs out there, but i never seem to be able to find them locally.

Good question. My guess is the fact that some dealerships use shady practices to contain costs and prevent warranty work, even if it means redirecting a known issue on a work order to a tech area that has nothing to do with the original problem. My exhaust issue for example. Or when I had a missing bell housing bolt and they tried to tell me that is how a Mustang should sound and it "was normal".

Most consumers are not astute and these shop techs are asked to milk an issue along in hopes that the 3/36 expires before the real problem is resolved or the customer (like me) calls a spade and makes them fix it.

Good techs are as methodical and careful as a doctor. The good ones live by an unspoken belief to do no harm and to ensure a vehicle is in safe working condition. This is one of the reasons why my dad walked away from an employer once. He was asked to pass inspection on seat bolts that would be used in Ford vehicles. The bolts had stress fractures and he would not allow their use. He was told to pass them or he was welcome to walk. He walked.

Good techs do not want to go to bed at night knowing that a family may die or become injured because they made a bad diagnostic call or failed to find the problem. Most techs coming out of these chop-shop 18 month ASE courses only want a paycheck and if they are asked to overlook a cracked strut assembly, stuck caliper piston assembly and just replace the pads it doesn't matter to them. It isn't their car or their family.

Society, bigcat. It is what it is. But, there is a good start as to why the good, careful, methodical techs are working for private shops. There are not many private shops around either, so we are stuck with what we have.

Caveat Emptor!

 

[351CJ]

. why is it so hard for dealers to hire good techs? instead, they hire the hacks, even if their work comes back 3 or 4 times to get it right.

It all comes down to $$. The system of paying techs a flat rate for any repair job (rates as determined by Ford ) ends up under paying the techs in many cases. The primary objective is to get the car back to the customer in the least amount of job time rather than properly diagnosing & fixing the problem. Many techs with some smarts leave the Ford dealers to find a job elswhere where they will be properly paid for their skills.

 

[bigcat]

It all comes down to $$. The system of paying techs a flat rate for any repair job (rates as determined by Ford ) ends up under paying the techs in many cases. The primary objective is to get the car back to the customer in the least amount of job time rather than properly diagnosing & fixing the problem. Many techs with some smarts leave the Ford dealers to find a job elswhere where they will be properly paid for their skills.

i know, i have been by ford warranty myself. still not as bad as dodge warranty though. lets say i dont work for dealerships anymore

 

[Jenns01TA]

Got the replacement OEM muffler put on today. I was simply amazed at the Jennesque/Hemmingway write up they had on the work order. WOW! All that over a simple exhaust leak/cracked baffle that I told them was there. Simply amazing.

Point of interest to me is that for the cost of the rental car the service advisor was willing to rent for me if I had not told him to just button up the Stang and I would pick it up pending the part arrival, I could have had that Flowmaster.

 

[bigcat]

funny how that works....

 

[310stanger]

a dealer tech goes where the money is. thats the nature of the game. i know guys that have been to 10 or more dealers. so as many bad ones as there are theres some really good ones. normally if the dealer is a really well ran business and has there stuff in order youll find some really great techs. often a lot of customer concerns dont ever get looked at properly because most writers are very lazy and jus dont listen. then we have a repair order with a very poorly written line thats very vague. this is very annoying. in your case with your exhaust problem i dont know how the "exhaust" guy missed what he did being as that if i specialize in exhaust i look at the whole exhaust. who knows there could be something wrong or not. but at least by looking i dont have to be the moron getting judged about my skills cause i oversaw something. it comes down to hacks getting hired because nobody wants to really do this job anymore, all the guys that are real good have either moved on to other things or better car lines. as far as you being right, yes you can be right on a number of things but it would be in poor business if we always jus took the complete advice of the customer. theres a difference between listening to their concerns and having them give their suggestion and then jus automatically taking their word for it everytime. we gotta be professional and show our skills and do the right thing. but im thinking that whole thing in ur oasis is pretty tongue in cheek. its easy for them to assume your wrong when they gotta deal with customers to lazy to read their manual and know how to shut their oil reminder off. good luck in having your muffler issue resolved. i can assure you that if your car came into my service bay i would look at exactly what your concern is and either find a real issue or not. its always better to get paid warranty time then to pull a car in and then have a no problem found and get paid nothing.

 

[Jenns01TA]

Thank you for your insight 310. This is a good example of why I remain polite and patient in all my dealings. Forming honest relationships and building trust and respect takes many interactions. Mr. George German at Future Ford has just came to this conclusion.

I am very relieved that this was warranty work. Because if it was not, I would have had to pay for unnecessary diagnostic services at insane ASE Labor rates when I told them what the problem was. Once warranty is up, I go to my shop. Independent operation with trusted mechanics who respect me and my vehicles.

I think if you reread this thread you will find that I agreed with most of the points you have made.

Jenn

 

[tr7driver]

so, uh, why do theses cars have so many problems in the first place?

 

[Jenns01TA]

Not so many problems as it appears. New platform, new assembly plant. TSBs are showing that the redesign was actually pretty clean considering.

Issues and concerns get more press and posts than accolades and compliments.

 

[Marine One]

Not so many problems as it appears. New platform, new assembly plant. TSBs are showing that the redesign was actually pretty clean considering.

Issues and concerns get more press and posts than accolades and compliments.

I agree 100%. I was very impressed with my new car. Very tight. No squeaks rattles or groans, no leaks at the top or windows. Fit & finish appear to be very good.