how much hp is too much?

0to100to0 · Dec 30, 2005

I'm thinking about 550-600 for my '65 coupe.

Money is not really an option...i'm thinking the entire restoration will cost about $35k for everything including major chassis and suspension modifications.

is this too much power?
will it not be able to get traction?
will it turn the body into a pretzel?
will it be extremely uncomfortable on the street?

thanks
Matt

brianj5600 · Dec 30, 2005

550 done right is great, look at the new Z-06. To get it right with a 65 Mustang will be no easy task. If you are only looking to go straight it is easier, there are proven methods with out too much work. Getting power to the ground in a handling suspension is a whole 'nother book.

rbohm · Dec 30, 2005

thats going to depend on how you set up the chassis and suspension, and how you build the power. as well as what compromises you are willing to make. if you dont mind filling bottles, nitrous is one way to augment engine power, or you can add a forced induction system. as for the suspension, what compromises are you willing to live with there? do you mind a stiff ride? are you willing to give up some cornering ability? what size wheels are you looking to use? what tires?

start with the chassis, and make it as stiff as possible. the stiffer you make the chassis, the more effective your suspension mods will be.

550-600hp is doable, but one recommendation i have that you need to take very seriously is to install a 6 point cage in the car along with everything else.

MustangMatt1966 · Dec 30, 2005

Like rbohm said, its not hard to get 500 to 600 hp...but its keeping the car safe thats the key...is this car going to be street driven? if so traction is a must. if you get cought in a rain storm with that much hp, one blip of the throttle will send u into a tail spin...it happend to me with only 325 hp....get a 6 point cage, 5 point racing harness and traction....remember, its nice to go fast, but its also nice to be alive

RFMustangGT · Dec 30, 2005

too much HP? I didn't know there was such a thing.

gp001 · Dec 30, 2005

Why do people always pick some big hp number and then try to build a car around it?

I've always found it easier to decide what I want to build the car to do and then the numbers fall into place.

Ronstang · Dec 31, 2005

gp001 said:
Why do people always pick some big hp number and then try to build a car around it?

I've always found it easier to decide what I want to build the car to do and then the numbers fall into place.

I couldn't agree more. There are a lot of cars out there that are only good for burnout contests.

Red Barchetta · Dec 31, 2005

I forgot who said it as well as exactly what he said, but when asked a similar question, a famous race car driver who raced in the 24hrs of Le Mans replied "when I can light the tires up at the end of the Mulsanne Straight." Yeah...that's just about the right amount of horsepower.

70vert · Dec 31, 2005

Ask Bugatti

follow all advice and more from the guys on this forum to get that power on the ground, but ask Bugatti how much is too much and they might have a figure around 1,000:

http://www.bugatti-cars.de/bugatti/index.html

and go to "Models" and "Veyron 16.4" It's an absolutely ludicrous car, and would seem impossible to drive, but apparently it's a cat:

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=19&article_id=10395

of course, it's got AWD, so assuming it has 50/50 weight distribution, you can take your weight distribution and take the rear portion of that as a percentage of 1,000 to get your HP target. Or something like that.

steel1212 · Dec 31, 2005

gp001 said:
Why do people always pick some big hp number and then try to build a car around it?

I've always found it easier to decide what I want to build the car to do and then the numbers fall into place.

I think this is the way to do it. Setup all your other parts around your car, roll cage, suspension and brakes. Then as you build your engine it you will have done enough to realize what you need or want.

10secgoal · Dec 31, 2005

TOO much, is juuust enough.

0to100to0 · Jan 1, 2006

the reasons for building a car around the numbers

many people who are building these "restomods" are not building them to compete in drag or circle track racing...they are building them to create their dream car. their dream car has 550 horsepower, 12.11 inch brakes, a 4.11 rear end, and more cubes than you think you can cram into a small block. we build these cars because we dream about these numbers at night. maybe we are in a middle of a midlife crisis (not me, i don't think, i'm only 22) but whatever the reason, we love to think more about the parts than we do about the whole.
-Matt

10secgoal · Jan 1, 2006

I've always built around the numbers. No sense in throwing in a cage or 4 link for a 400 hp car.

rbohm · Jan 1, 2006

you should decide first what engine combination you are going to use, and then build the chassis, suspension, and brakes around that combo. if you build a chassis to handle say 400hp, but then you decide to build an engine that makes 650hp, you could end up with a car that has problems handling the power. going the other way, if you build the car to handle 650hp, and then build a 400hp engine, then you haver a car that handles the power with no problem, and the chassis will last much longer.

Hack · Jan 1, 2006

0to100to0 said:
I'm thinking about 550-600 for my '65 coupe.

Money is not really an option...i'm thinking the entire restoration will cost about $35k for everything including major chassis and suspension modifications.

is this too much power?
will it not be able to get traction?
will it turn the body into a pretzel?
will it be extremely uncomfortable on the street?

thanks
Matt

My opinion is that no one can answer this question for you. It's a matter of personal taste and no matter how many opinions are given, you won't know until you drive a car with that much horsepower.

I suggest you rent or buy a car that has 550-600 hp and is roughly the size of a '65 coupe and use it like you plan to use this '65 coupe. I think that will really help you to decide.

Oh, and my personal opinion is that 250-300 is PLENTY for such a small car.

gp001 · Jan 1, 2006

0to100to0 said:
many people who are building these "restomods" are not building them to compete in drag or circle track racing...they are building them to create their dream car. their dream car has 550 horsepower, 12.11 inch brakes, a 4.11 rear end, and more cubes than you think you can cram into a small block. we build these cars because we dream about these numbers at night. maybe we are in a middle of a midlife crisis (not me, i don't think, i'm only 22) but whatever the reason, we love to think more about the parts than we do about the whole.
-Matt

I guess the "dyno queen" craze is passing from the ricer crowd to the classics. Sees silly to build a useless contraption, but that's just MY opinion.

86bluecobra · Jan 1, 2006

I would say that when you start breaking things all the time and you stop being able to afford to fix rear ends trannies etc etc you have too much HP

Classic_Stang · Jan 1, 2006

Sounds good to me. I'd suggest an overdrive tranny and finding a really good shop to stiffen the chassis. If the chassis isn't done right, it'll twist the car up bad. Drivability is seen in the eye of the beholder. If you like the way old cars feel/handle, it will be fine. If you want it to handle like a newer car, forget it unless you have a lot of cash. Just can't be done unless you replace the entire bottom half of the car.

jerry S · Jan 2, 2006

gp001 said:
I guess the "dyno queen" craze is passing from the ricer crowd to the classics. Sees silly to build a useless contraption, but that's just MY opinion.

I was watching an episode of Top Gear a few weeks back and they were comparing these two euro hatchbacks. One had 200 hp and the other 250. The 250 hp car could not get around the track any faster than the lesser powered car for the simple reason that it could not get the extra power to the wheels. The engine overwhelmed the suspension.

In my case, I had a budget that allowed for one of the following combos:

1. twin turbo, 408 dart stroker with 205 or 225 AFRs and stock suspension and brakes and no other real modications.

2. stock 351W rebuilt with new pistons/rods, alum heads, new intake, and carb that putsout 400 hp, 4 wheel power disks, new wheels and tires, tubular UCAs and LCAs, new springs, leafs, konis, subframes, jacking rails, etc.

I went with number 2.

jerry S · Jan 2, 2006

But if the original poster has $35k to spend, then maybe he can get 500 usable hp to the ground. After all, MDJay has a blown 302 that puts out 550 hp and seems to be very streetable. Of course he has a full suspension and brake retrofit to handle all of it so I guess with $35k to spend, he can do it.

how much hp is too much?

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