How much power am I losing?

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 28, 2012

Ok, so I have a 02 2 v, and up until now, have had stock cams on my engine. Recently, I upgraded to stage one cams, but when I was installing them, I noticed that the one cam had what looked like a defect in the forging. So I was concerned that it may be a future problem, and decided to send it back. The cam guy tells me that they are currently out of blanks, and it'll take two weeks before I get another one.
Before I sent it back, though, I compared it to the stock one, and using a tape measure, I couldn't even tell any difference. WTF??
Since I was gonna be down for two MORE weeks (and I don't wanna be), I decided to run the stage one cam on the one head, and the stock one on the other, until the new one gets here.
Well it's back together, and running now, and I don't know that I can tell any difference from when I had both stock cams installed. (you'd think that if 2 stage 1 cams were supposedly worth up to 35 HP, I should at least have 17 more HP from the one),...but that junk feels exactly the same to me.
I mean can you even feel 17 HP?
So here's the deal. is there really any benefit to a "stage 1" cam, or is that all just a bunch of crap?

hotstang_46 · Apr 28, 2012

i have never modded a non ls engine with just cams., always heads and cams. But yes, they should be worth it. what other mods do u have?

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 28, 2012

hotstang_46 said:
i have never modded a non ls engine with just cams., always heads and cams. But yes, they should be worth it. what other mods do u have?

I really don't have any other mods worth talking about, but, I do I have a water 4 gas hydrogen injection kit installed, and straight pipes from the manifold to the flows dumped before the axle.

txredgt · Apr 28, 2012

Without supporting mods those cams won't do much. Also thinking that just because the stage 2's supposedly see a gain of 35 and you should get half of that isn't too bright either. Do you even know how camshafts alter your performance and how to utilize this new setup? Long tubes are what you will need to get to see something gained.

trinity_gt · Apr 28, 2012

a) What make and part number are these cams? You use the term "Stage 1" which is meaningless. Why not just say, for example, "Recently, I upgraded to Comp 262AHs, but when I was installing...", substituting the actual manufacturer and part number?

b) A tape measure? I'm not even sure how you'd measure a cam with a tape measure. At the very least you could use a vernier to compare lobe lift but that will tell you nothing about duration, lobe separation angle, intake centerline etc etc.

When mine was normally aspirated I gained a solid 20HP past 5500 with these mild ("Stage 1" if you prefer) Comps and lost virtually nothing down low so yes, IMO, they're definitely worth it.

1fun281 · Apr 28, 2012

cams are not only there to make power the main point of cams are they raise your power band, stock cars run out of breath real early in the power band, but with a set of good cams you can rev all the way to 6500 (or whatever the cam is built for) and the car still pulls without falling on its face, like others have said longtubes bring out the full potential in good cams, and a high gear 4.10+

My setup is a set of cheap stage 2 cams, mac longtubes and 4.30 gears, without a tune went 12.90 @105 with no suspension and stock cold air intake stock throttle body CL plenum and stock pulleys!

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 28, 2012

txredgt said:
Without supporting mods those cams won't do much. Also thinking that just because the stage 2's supposedly see a gain of 35 and you should get half of that isn't too bright either. Do you even know how camshafts alter your performance and how to utilize this new setup? Long tubes are what you will need to get to see something gained.

The way I see it, a bigger cam opens the valve more, the more the valve is open, the more air and gas get in. More in, more out. And I have a shorty on the head that has the stage 1 cam. I saw no reason to change over the ex manifold on the head w/ the stock cam until I can get the new cam back from Patriot.

trinity_gt said:
a) What make and part number are these cams? You use the term "Stage 1" which is meaningless. Why not just say, for example, "Recently, I upgraded to Comp 262AHs, but when I was installing...", substituting the actual manufacturer and part number?

b) A tape measure? I'm not even sure how you'd measure a cam with a tape measure. At the very least you could use a vernier to compare lobe lift but that will tell you nothing about duration, lobe separation angle, intake centerline etc etc.

When mine was normally aspirated I gained a solid 20HP past 5500 with these mild ("Stage 1" if you prefer) Comps and lost virtually nothing down low so yes, IMO, they're definitely worth it.

Look, I'm not so dumb as to not know that a 1/16th is equal to .060. If you measure the cam lobe, and cant come up w/ a 32nd of an inch, there must not be much of a difference.

1fun281 said:
cams are not only there to make power the main point of cams are they raise your power band, stock cars run out of breath real early in the power band, but with a set of good cams you can rev all the way to 6500 (or whatever the cam is built for) and the car still pulls without falling on its face, like others have said longtubes bring out the full potential in good cams, and a high gear 4.10+

My setup is a set of cheap stage 2 cams, mac longtubes and 4.30 gears, without a tune went 12.90 @105 with no suspension and stock cold air intake stock throttle body CL plenum and stock pulleys!

There is too much debate on whether or not longtubes are worth the expense and hassle. I've got one afterburner shorty on there now, and I had a hell of a time getting it on there.

AZmustang98 · Apr 28, 2012

You were already entering hell when you decided on shorties. At least make it worth while and do LTs. Also... There is more than just lift to factor in cam lobe design. And I'm no expert lolz

Bob Hughes · Apr 28, 2012

I've never done cam work to my car and please correct me if I'm wrong, but did you say you're running two totally different cams in either head. Something tells me that could not be good for the engine....and ur driving it with one header replaced and one still stock? It just seems like a potential for damaging something.

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 28, 2012

Bob Hughes said:
I've never done cam work to my car and please correct me if I'm wrong, but did you say you're running two totally different cams in either head. Something tells me that could not be good for the engine....and ur driving it with one header replaced and one still stock? It just seems like a potential for damaging something.

Yeah, a stage1 can and shorty in the passenger side, and the stock unit and exhaust manifold on the other. Seems to run ok though, can't be that much of a big deal?

Bob Hughes · Apr 28, 2012

It just seems to me that the motor is built to be symmetrical, and now ur changing lifts snd durations in one side that as minute as it may be is going to add stress to one side of the motor. More air more power on one side would mean more downward force on the crank, on one side....I'm no super mechanic but I can't see any longevity in that (as in bearings and parts wearing uneven.) You wouldnt put nitrous jets on one side of the motor or supercharge half the motor it all works on even symmetry....just my thoughts.....I wouldn't leave it that way for long.

slayerripkdc · Apr 28, 2012

madmike1157 said:
Yeah, a stage1 can and shorty in the passenger side, and the stock unit and exhaust manifold on the other. Seems to run ok though, can't be that much of a big deal?

So you only installed a cam on one side and an aftermarket header on one side? Why in the world would you run your car like that?

Boosted92LX · Apr 28, 2012

madmike1157 said:
Yeah, a stage1 can and shorty in the passenger side, and the stock unit and exhaust manifold on the other. Seems to run ok though, can't be that much of a big deal?

Mike, Mike, Mike.... man, don't you know one bank of the engine is going to make more power than the other set up like that? Dude, it's going to pull uneven when you punch it. You'd sure better be careful leaving stoplights, that car's liable to veer off to one side an smash into the car next to you...

jetmech807 · Apr 28, 2012

SSeater said:
Mike, Mike, Mike.... man, don't you know one bank of the engine is going to make more power than the other set up like that? Dude, it's going to pull uneven when you punch it. You'd sure better be careful leaving stoplights, that car's liable to veer off to one side an smash into the car next to you...

But if he lowers the air pressure a few pounds on the drivers side it should balance it out......

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Boosted92LX · Apr 28, 2012

jetmech807 said:
But if he lowers the air pressure a few pounds on the drivers side it should balance it out......

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Yeah, in theory, but with the kind of power he's making it'll probably just spin the tire on the rim and explode.

jetmech807 · Apr 28, 2012

Maybe adjust the tie rods a bit.

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CarMichael Angelo · Apr 28, 2012

Lowering the air pressure on one side? Yeah it was pulling to one side if I got on it but I thought that was because the hub on the passenger side is so badly worn. Now that I know that I can correct the drift when I leave by lowering the driver's side tire to correct it, I'm pumped that there is such a cheap fix. Thanks Allen.

Boosted92LX · Apr 28, 2012

Hey, you could just buy an old fogger kit and just install the passenger side nozzles. Put the 50 hp pills in, done. That way the tires will still wear evenly.

madmike1157

Bullitt347 · Apr 28, 2012

ROFLMAO

jetmech807 · Apr 28, 2012

The air pressure was my BS answer. No respect I tell ya, no respect.

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How much power am I losing?

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

hotstang_46

Member

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

txredgt

trinity_gt

1fun281

Member

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

AZmustang98

Member

Bob Hughes

Member

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

Bob Hughes

Member

slayerripkdc

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

jetmech807

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

jetmech807

CarMichael Angelo

my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

Boosted92LX

It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

Bullitt347

I have been doing it wrong this whole time

jetmech807

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How much power am I losing?

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It's only an inch or two. What's the big deal?

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