How rare is rare?

Detector

Detector

Active Member
Dec 12, 2004
62
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29
#1
I don't know about you guys but I love watching ebay and some of the claims on the auctions. It seems almost every Mach I listed on ebay claims to be rare, yet they list it having a 351c, AC, PS, PB and a 4 speed with rear sport seat.

Now maybe I'm just seeing all rares being listed but they all seem to have the same options so how can that be rare? Seems to me a truly rare Mach I would be No AC, No PS, No PB, No fold-down rear seat and a three-speed manual trany.

I know there are books that list the number of cars produced with what options, but is there some place on the Internet to find this? Is there such thing as a rarity number? For example, how rare is my 1970 Mach I Calypso Coral, No AC/PB/PS standard rear seat, standard 3.00 axle(no posi) 351 Windsor v2 and three-speed manual trany?

I know these were the 'standard options' for Mach I's but just how many were ordered with no added options? If not very many wouldn't that make it truly rare? :p
 
#2
I read somewhere that you also have to take into account how desireable the rare option is. Just because they didn't make many with a certain configuration doesn't mean it is worth more. A car without A/C may be rare but if I can't drive it here in Texas, what's the point?
 
#3
Capt Dan said:
I read somewhere that you also have to take into account how desireable the rare option is. Just because they didn't make many with a certain configuration doesn't mean it is worth more. A car without A/C may be rare but if I can't drive it here in Texas, what's the point?
Click to expand...


I agree.......I would pay more for a car that is loaded with options as opposed to one that is void of them. Of course I have never bought a classic car for quick re-sell either.
 
#4
Detector said:
I don't know about you guys but I love watching ebay and some of the claims on the auctions. It seems almost every Mach I listed on ebay claims to be rare, yet they list it having a 351c, AC, PS, PB and a 4 speed with rear sport seat.

Now maybe I'm just seeing all rares being listed but they all seem to have the same options so how can that be rare? Seems to me a truly rare Mach I would be No AC, No PS, No PB, No fold-down rear seat and a three-speed manual trany.

I know there are books that list the number of cars produced with what options, but is there some place on the Internet to find this? Is there such thing as a rarity number? For example, how rare is my 1970 Mach I Calypso Coral, No AC/PB/PS standard rear seat, standard 3.00 axle(no posi) 351 Windsor v2 and three-speed manual trany?

I know these were the 'standard options' for Mach I's but just how many were ordered with no added options? If not very many wouldn't that make it truly rare? :p
Click to expand...


Well, from looking all around I see your point, people throught the term around all the time.

I see "rare" as a car that there are not many of, I don't care about options being there. Just the fact that the model in question had a low production number. And also the value people hold on them. The Shelby's how nice they are seem to be over hyped to me. There are other cars that where made less of and are amazing.

1968 1/2 Cobra Jet Coupe, or Convertable are "RARE", only 553 Coupes where made and even less convertablies.
 
#5
Thats the way I've always seen it. The fewer the rarer. I agree I prefer AC over non-AC but that should be considered a comfort or option and not a rarity. I can see advertising it as fully optioned but it sure doesn't seem to be very rare.

Personally, A muscle car with HP robbing AC/PS/PB kind of defeats the purpose. I like how one person listed his basic pony on ebay. "No AC no PS no PB just fast." Is there such thing as a luxury muscle car?

Hehe! I can see the ebay add now.

1970 Mustang Mach I muscle car unfortunately optioned for your grandmother with AC, PS, PB and automatic transmission just like the other 35,000 luxury muscle cars made that year.

I guess my pint is at what point does a car officially get stamped rare? If 25,000 of the 46,960 made all have the same options, that hardly makes them rare right? So what is rare, 1 of 2,000, 1 of 5,000 1 of 25,000?
 
#6
Production:

*****************1965******************
2d Hardtop 501,965
Convertible 101,945
Fastback 77,079
GT-350 562
TOTAL: 680,989
*****************1966******************
2d Hardtop 499,751
Convertible 72,119
Fastback 35,698
GT-350 2,378
TOTAL: 607,568
*****************1967******************
2d Hardtop 356,271
Converitble 44,808
Fastback 71,042
GT-350 1,175
GT-500 2,050
TOTAL: 472,121
*****************1968******************
2d Hardtop 249,447
Convertible 25,376
Fastback 42,581
428CJ Fastback 2,253
428CJ Hardtop 564
428CJ Convertible 13
GT/CS 4,025
GT-350 2d Fastback Coupe 1,253
GT-350 2d Convertible 404
GT-500 2d Fastback Coupe 1,140
GT-500 2d Convertible 402
GT-500KR 2d Fastback Coupe 933
GT-500KR 2d Convertible 318
TOTAL: 317,404
*****************1969******************
428CJ Convertibles 50
Boss 302 1,934
Boss 429 859
GT 5,396
Mach 1 72,458
Total Shelby Production 2,362
TOTAL: 299,824
*****************1970******************
Boss 302 6,318
Boss 429 498
Mach 1 40,970
Twister Special 351C 48
Twister Special 428SCJ 48
Convertibles 7,673(1,474 with deluxe equipment)
Grande Coupes 13,581
Total Shelby Production 789
TOTAL: 190,727
*****************1971******************
Boss 351 1,806
TOTAL: 149,678
*****************1972******************
Olympic Sprint Convertibles 50
Olympic Sprint Hardtops ?
TOTAL: 125,093
*****************1973******************
Mach 1 35,440
TOTAL: 134,867

///////*********************************\\\\\\\\\\

Those in bold would be the ones I would say are Rare or hard to find now days. I don't agree with how much people sell 65-66 fastbacks for. There were a lot of them.

Or when people say its a replica or clone, they think it holds more value which it doesn't, you just made a car look like another car, you can't go selling it off just under the value of the real deal. I have a replica but I would only sell it for a little more than what I put into it which is everything.
 
#7
Detector said:
Personally, A muscle car with HP robbing AC/PS/PB kind of defeats the purpose. I like how one person listed his basic pony on ebay. "No AC no PS no PB just fast." Is there such thing as a luxury muscle car?

Hehe! I can see the ebay add now.
Click to expand...

I always thought the classic Mercury Cougars were considered luxury muscle cars?
 
#8
Saw this on ebay, $2,000

View attachment 506101

The rest of the car is completely rusted, the frame looks like it is about to bust. I know pictures can make things worse than they really are, but this thing looks like a piece and the bid is already at 2k.

YOu can find a nice Fastback for around that and it actually has an engine and trans, driveshaft, interior, guages. etc..
 
#12
Darkness Falls,

The production numbers you posted are more complete than others I've seen, but why are some cars listed as "Fastback Coupe"? A 2 door hardtop is by definition a coupe from the French word coupe - to cut. As in the back of the car is cut off. There should be an accent on the "e", but I don't have that script.
 
#13
Anyone familiar with a book called Mustang by the numbers? Does this book break down the production numbers on things like AC, PS, PB, Paint color, Wheels, interior options and sport seat? I would like to know who many 1970 Mach I's in Calypso Coral with a three-speed trany, no PS/PB/AC/Sport seat and a 351 Windsor were produced. Would it tell me that?
 
#14
A classic Mustang on the street fits my definition of rare. I see one or two a month around here these days (not counting car shows and club events of course).

To fit the term "rare" for production numbers I'd have to say there were under 5,000 ever made, but FoMoCo did not track how many were made with PS or AC back in those days so an option list outside of body style and drivetrain is anybodys guess. So all we are left with is a list like the one posted above and with regard to options...the more the better. Seating arrangements were recorded, deluxe versus standard interiors too, but they did not even track GT equipment groups. Although they know how many cars came with A-codes they don;t know how many of each other category were, so there's a lot of guesswork involved.

Ultra-rare would be special edition things like the E-Code '68s (10 made IIRC) or playboy pink '69 GT verts.

Here's the list for 1967:
65A Hardtop, Standard Buckets 325,853

65B Hardtop, Luxury Buckets 22,228

65C Hardtop, Bench Seat 8,190

63A Fastback, Standard Buckets 53,651

63B Fastback, Luxury Buckets 17,391

76A Convertible, Standard Buckets 38,751

76B Convertible, Luxury Buckets 4,848

76C Convertible, Bench Seat 1,209
 
#15
Detector said:
Anyone familiar with a book called Mustang by the numbers? Does this book break down the production numbers on things like AC, PS, PB, Paint color, Wheels, interior options and sport seat? I would like to know who many 1970 Mach I's in Calypso Coral with a three-speed trany, no PS/PB/AC/Sport seat and a 351 Windsor were produced. Would it tell me that?
Click to expand...

The Marti report is used to determine a cars uniqueness.
 
#17
Thanks MCABOSS. What I wish you could find is a break down not just of single option production numbers, but combined options. For example, I'm not sure how many 1970 Mach I's were produced in Calypso Coral so lets say 4,000. I like to be able to find out how many of this 4,000 had a three-speed manual trany.

Again I have no idea how many 1970 Mach I's were produced with a three-speed trany neither. Although the three-speed is the standard option it seems that most were ordered with either a four-speed or automatic. If this is the case then it would, in my opinion, make the standard option rare rather than the others.
 
#19
darkness falls said:
Saw this on ebay, $2,000

View attachment 505995

The rest of the car is completely rusted, the frame looks like it is about to bust. I know pictures can make things worse than they really are, but this thing looks like a piece and the bid is already at 2k.

YOu can find a nice Fastback for around that and it actually has an engine and trans, driveshaft, interior, guages. etc..
Click to expand...

Pictures make everything loook BETTER than it really is!!!! I have not seen even a kinda nice FB for 2K in a LONG time, Gone in 60 :bang: and Ebay buyers with more $$$ than brains have driven the prices on even the worst junk out of sight :owned:
 
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