I Broke One (Water Pump Bolt!)

[Grandmaster]

Well, after being oh so careful, and giving that one last bolt that was on there tough an extra day to soak in wd-40, i broke it. That sucker must have barely been holding together on the inside. The bolt is the bottom one on the left hand side of the water pump (passenger side), its the one that is a bolt and not a stud. What am i supposed to do now? Its a pretty long bolt, and it broke off right where the threads start, so judging in comparison to the other bolt of that kind from the other side of the pump, i have about 3/4 inch of bolt in there. When it happened i thought it was just stripped, i had it moving but it wasn't going anywhere, so i just pulled on it with some plyers while twisting it, and it came out, missing the aforementioned portion. The pump is off but it does me no good until i get that thing out...soo..

Anyone know a good "easy" way to get it out? Aren't there things like taps and extractors etc? I dont know what i'm talking about, dont get me wrong, i think i just read that in a random thread a while back or something. Any help is greatly appreciated, THIS IS MY DAILY DRIVER!! Luckily my dad is letting me drive his *sigh* civic to school etc and i'm supposed to be starting a new job this week Thanks a lot for any help!!
-Eric

 

[Daggar]

That sucks. Try getting a punch in there so you can dimple the remains of the bolt and get a drill on it. You can try an easy out once you get a hole in the bolt drilled but I've never known an easy out to be easy. More than likely, if you can't the bolt to turn at all you'll end up drilling the whole thing out. Try to use the largest bit you can without drilling out the threads. After than you can run a tap in there to clean the rest of it out. It's a pain in the arse no matter how you look at it. If you end up drilling the threads out then you can either tap the hole for a larger bolt or put in a Heli-Coil.

 

[stang976]

yea do a search in the 'classic' section from last week and your questions shall be answered

 

[Grandmaster]

Thanks! Anyone else with methods keep em coming please, i appreciate the help a lot! By the way, what's a heli-coil?
-E

 

[Daggar]

Thanks! Anyone else with methods keep em coming please, i appreciate the help a lot! By the way, what's a heli-coil?
-E

In techinical terms (j/k):

It's a springy looking piece of twisted metal that threads into a drilled opening to allow you put threads in that opening. You can buy a kit from a parts store... they're cheap. The kit will tell you what size hole you need to drill in order to install the heli-coil that you need for a specific size bolt and thread. Once you see one it'll be clear what it is and how it works.

 

[Grandmaster]

Ok cool. I guess i'm gonna make a trip to sears and the auto stores around here to try to find some extractor bits and give that a shot since that seems like the first "maybe i'll get lucky" step. What is a good lube to shoot in the bolt hole? P.B. blaster or something? i cant remember the name, i read it in a thread before....
-E

 

[Grandmaster]

ttt

 

[jrichker]

http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=1088 Use drill bushing 5/16” OD, 5/32” ID, ¾” long, price $8.57 This centers the drill bit in the housing bolt hole so you don’t get off center and damage the water pump, timing cover housing or engine block


http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=18&Keyword=Y drill bits - use 5/32” Cobalt/TiN coated bit #78530433, price $3.91


http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=1951&Keyword=Y Screw/bolt extractors. Use EZY-OUT Screw Extractor #63760037 Price $2.67


One step specialty item: See Drill-Out® Broken Bolt Extractors drill bushing, reverse twist drill & extractor all in one unit. Best to use when the bolt breaks off with the remaining part below the start of the threads. See #05027164 for the one for a 5/16" bolt. Price $18.38 each. You MUST have a reversing drill motor (either air or electric) to use this bit.


A long shank tap should be used to chase the leftover metal out of the original threads. Also recommended to clean the corrosion and dirt out of the threads before you reassemble everything. Cleaning the threads will help prevent the bolts from seizing next time (yes, there will be a next time).

Long shank 5/16” taps

http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=287&Keyword=Y 5/16” pulley tap, 6” shank #04801189 price $14.26

OR second choice, will not clean all the bottom threads unless you grind the end of the tap.

http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=286&Keyword=Y extension tap, 6” reduced diameter shank #04701181 $16.17

See http://www.windsorfox.com/detail.cfm?id=ENG-TBK for Stainless Steel Water Pump Bolts with Custom stainless steel studs. Allow the use of factory accessory brackets without hunting for obsolete parts or using spacers.

Kit comes complete with nine polished stainless 12 point bolts, four stainless studs and nine stainless oversized washers.

Price: $58.95

 

[Killer50stang]

Well, after being oh so careful, and giving that one last bolt that was on there tough an extra day to soak in wd-40, i broke it. That sucker must have barely been holding together on the inside. The bolt is the bottom one on the left hand side of the water pump (passenger side), its the one that is a bolt and not a stud. What am i supposed to do now? Its a pretty long bolt, and it broke off right where the threads start, so judging in comparison to the other bolt of that kind from the other side of the pump, i have about 3/4 inch of bolt in there. When it happened i thought it was just stripped, i had it moving but it wasn't going anywhere, so i just pulled on it with some plyers while twisting it, and it came out, missing the aforementioned portion. The pump is off but it does me no good until i get that thing out...soo..

Anyone know a good "easy" way to get it out? Aren't there things like taps and extractors etc? I dont know what i'm talking about, dont get me wrong, i think i just read that in a random thread a while back or something. Any help is greatly appreciated, THIS IS MY DAILY DRIVER!! Luckily my dad is letting me drive his *sigh* civic to school etc and i'm supposed to be starting a new job this week Thanks a lot for any help!!
-Eric

First off is it leaking? If you have no major leaks you might be able to seal it with gasket sealer. If it is leaking majorly you will probably have to drill it out and retap the threads. Check the torque specs as well. You don't want to overtighten. Good Luck!

 

[PhLoBuS]

I had to drill and make the hole bigger and put a different bolt through

 

[Grandmaster]

Hey guys thanks for all the help. I have an idea though...
You know how the upper intake sits on the lower intake, which sits on the block? Well it looks like the water pump sits on the piece bihind it like the upper intake does on the lower. What i'm saying is, what if i take that box off (the one that's between the pump and the block)? Does it come off pretty easy? All i'm thinking is it will be a LOT easier to get to the bolt and work on getting it out with the tools. Will this work, or does the bolt go into the block? I measured it and it looks like the bolt goes right TO the block but not IN the block.

If anyone knows if this would work please let me know before i try to take it off. I think its only 4 bolts that holds that box on. Sound good? THANKS!!
-Eric

p.s. its the bolt on the lower passenger side. The one that is a bolt but not a stud.

 

[Michael Yount]

Eric - you're talking about taking off the timing chain cover I think. The balancer has to come off, and there are 4 bolts up from the oil pan that have to come out too. Be sure to get the replacement gaskets bits for the bottom of the front cover if you remove it. I suppose it's possible that if you remove the cover, there'll actually be some of the bolt sticking out of the block. That may allow you to get on it wiht vice grips, or to grind a slot in it so you can get a flat blade screw driver in it.

Galvanic corrosion is usually what does in the water pump bolts. So check the rest of them. If they're in bad shape, put new ones in; use a clean up thread chaser on the holes. And be sure you use some kind of thread sealer on the threads when you put it back together. Cover all the threads with the sealer completely - I prefer ARP moly assembly lube/thread sealer.

 

[Grandmaster]

Woah thanks for the help!! Well i decided to give some bolt extractors a shot before taking off the cover. I went and got a set (to make sure i have the right size and i thought they'd be good tools to have working on older cars) of bolt extractors/matching bits and some PB Blaster. I'm gonna let the PB Blaster sit on it today and while i'm at school tomorrow, then i'll try to get it out tomorrow. If that doesn't work, i think i could get it out easily if i had the cover off, but the problem is taking that off. So thanks for all the help guys and keep em coming if you feel like it.
-E

EDIT: Michael, i want to make sure we're talking about the same "box." Its the one that the coolant flows into from the water pump, i asume it separates it out to go to different areas from there. It is the one that the pump bolts to etc. Just making sure, like i said thanks for the help.

 

[Grandmaster]

UPDATE

UPDATE: AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHH
LOL

Ok for real this is hard. I decided to go at it today with the extractors. For one thing i cant see inside the hole so i have NO idea how in the world i'm supposed to line the bit up. Its nuts. Anyways i hacked at it for a while to no avail. I think i'm gonna check with mr. haynes to see how hard it is to take the timing chain cover off. But i have one question first:

Does the bolt thread into the block, or into the cover, or into both? That's the main thing i need to know now. I think i'm gonna end up having to do it this way. This bites, i think i might end up needing that jack and stands after all if i have to get to the pan.

Thanks for the tips!
-E

 

[Michael Yount]

I think the only two bolts that thread into the cover are the two at the top - you can see the back of them (working from memory here). I believe all the rest are longer bolts that pass through the cover and thread into the block.

 

[Idwitheld-1`]

I have done 2 of these. It is never easy.

If the bolt snaps due to corrosion It is highly unlikely an extractor will be able to remove the remaining stud. You risk snaping the extractor in your one and only hole.

I have used square extractors, twist, left cut drill bits....the problem is in developing enough torque to break the corrosion. Plus this all is dependent on how good you are centering the extraction hole. Plus, how often does the bolt snap off and leave a perfect right angle surface to work on? If your me then NEVER!

Bottom line is you need good, clean access to see what's going on in there. Center punch the stud using a bushing to force-align the punch. This is your guarantee that your on-center. Drill out the stud using progressively larger bits.

When drilling out the stud, the bit cuts its path. DO NOT FORCE IT! The last thing you need is a hardened bit in your ONLY hole. I have a drill bit sharpener. Sharpen frequently. This process takes hours, but eventually you get close enough that you can clean the hole with a tap. In one case I had to increase the hole size and re-tap for a Metric13 (I think...been about 5 years)...this was the only way to retain maximum block boss and have a threaded fastener.

Anyways, the name of the game here is patience. It can be done, but I just feel with coroded bolts extractors are probably not going to be much help. Oh and I did both without removing the timing cover.

 

[rd]

I think both lower bolts on the pass side are bolts, and both go through the timing cover into the block. There are 3, the top one typically has the small 3/8 head on it.

As annoying as it sounds, I doubt this will come out with the drill and easy out method. If you take the timing cover off, you will have an inch or so of broken bolt to put vice grips on.

These typically get corroded into the timing cover and break. Drilling and putting in an easy out will not work because the entire surface of the bolt is still bound to the hole in the cover. If you pull the cover, you remove most of what is holding the bolt.

Been there, done this. Pulled the cover, the broke bolt was finger tight.....

 

[RsStanG1987]

This happened to me like2 months ago. I drilled the bolt out then tapped it and got a new Bolt. Took me no less then an hour or so. not to hard just make sure you have a real sharp bit.

 

[jerry beach]

I will offer you yet another method. Although the ones metioned above are the correct solution.

I have 2 bolts broken off in my block that go to the WP. I was in no mood to deal with it on that particular day when my pump needed replacment. So I bought a brand new pump (not a re-man) and used plenty of gasket sealer on both sides of the WP gasket. I also took the cover off the WP (sheet metal held on by two bolts) and applied gasket sealant to both sides of that gasket. I carefully snugged it up and have had no leaks for the last 3 years or so. I let it sit for 24 hrs after I got done. If you let it sit before putting water in it and adding pressure, I think your chances are best. One of the other main bolts to my WP is heli-coiled, I can tell because the threads spun in the hole when taking it out. That was a pain. Thanks to a mechanic (wanna be) that worked on the car before me. Some will say that I rigged it, but I say it is fixed. I am confident I can take it apart again and put it together the same way without a problem. It takes a degree of skill to get some messed up stuff working without fixing the problem.

 

[jrichker]

UPDATE: AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHH
LOL

Ok for real this is hard. I decided to go at it today with the extractors. For one thing i cant see inside the hole so i have NO idea how in the world i'm supposed to line the bit up. Its nuts. Thanks for the tips!
-E

Go back and re-read my previous post. The drill bushings I listed are to keep the drill bit centered in the hole and make sure that you drill the center of the bolt as close as possible. There is a complete list of tools & parts you need to do the job right, with a minimum amout of time & trouble.