Kaase Heads

D Durden · Jan 5, 2004

Anyone know anything about these heads? I've seen the reports on Jegs, and a buddy of mine is considering them for a 427 Windsor stroker motor he's already got.

Are they all that and a bag of chips or are they chips of a different kind? Can you even get them?

Ohio 1989GT · Feb 9, 2004

I think they are in the new jegs catalog, and are under the "Jeg's" name....

94Blue302GT · Feb 9, 2004

the new Kaase heads should be really good heads, even though they're just jegs heads. They have a canted head design (if i read correctly) which allows the fuel and air to dump into the cylendar much more easily. Basically, the valve would be on an angle that allows it to flow away from the cylendar wall, vss the straight valve design, in which the fuel and air hits the valve and tries to spread itself out and against the wall of the cylendar. Black70fastback can help you out with this even more. Tell him Lee sent ya.

65ShelbyClone · Feb 9, 2004

I just looked them up on the Jegs site and I must say they are quite intriguing, but there are a few things I dont like. The peak flow is ate .800 lift for both intake and exhaust ports, but none of the valvetrain included in the head assemblies is capable of that. The second is that they compare the Kaase heads to AFR 185s, which are not only less expensive, but have smaller intake valves and much smaller intake runners. I'd rather see a comparison with more equal heads like AFR 205s(price) or 225s(size).

94Blue302GT · Feb 9, 2004

Well, the canted valve design is really old technology being brought back to use in these heads. an 800 lift? shoot, and i thought i was making an improvement with .500 lift! True, the prices are up there, and I wouldn't get them until it goes down again. I think the price is just high right now because it's new and has that "Kaase" name on it. With the angled valves, your lift is FAR more effective than a straight on valve, so all the SIZE of the runner is more easily dumped into the head. I'm sure that since AFR has done plenty of research, it probably matches up with the 205 or 225's in flow rate, but does it more efficiently.

D Durden · Feb 9, 2004

They make LOTS of claims, but no one has done a clear article or test on them. They promise HUGE number gains (like in the 100's of horsepower), but I'm really skeptical.

And why is JEGS carrying a Ford-based product? Normally, they're like that waitress from the Blues Brothers: "We carry parts for BOTH kinds of cars . . . gm AND chebbie!"

94Blue302GT · Feb 9, 2004

D Durden said:
They make LOTS of claims, but no one has done a clear article or test on them. They promise HUGE number gains (like in the 100's of horsepower), but I'm really skeptical.

And why is JEGS carrying a Ford-based product? Normally, they're like that waitress from the Blues Brothers: "We carry parts for BOTH kinds of cars . . . gm AND chebbie!"

Well, cuz they can sell them, of course!!! That's the name of the game, isn't it? And i'm pretty sure that if you slap on heads to our cars, no matter what kind they are, they alone aren't going to produce a 100 horse gain. that's just impractical. Bummer though!

Ohio 1989GT · Feb 9, 2004

I just wish one of the magazines used them in one of those head comparo's to get a equal foting for all of them. Does anyone on here run them? Dyno/Timeslips

Matt90GT · Feb 9, 2004

check the latest or last month of Popular HotRoding magazine. it is the one with the red fox body mustang on the cover with bullit wheels.

They did a build up on a stock 89 shortblock with 100K miles. Impressive numbers. with a cam, 750 carb, victor intake at 7800 RPM got 500hp.

But they are spendy as you have to also buy new valve covers for them

Black70Fastback · Feb 9, 2004

my car craft, march issue, has a big write up on them. they are basically a set of clevland design heads for a windsor that still have rectangle ports and use windsor intakes and hedders instead of just actually bolting on cleve heads. and they are a bit more streetable than the cleveland i guess.
in my opinion, they should be a pretty hot thing for the windsors. ESPECIALLY a large cubic inch 427w. little steep for the pocket book though.

oh well, im still sticking with my cleve block with the closed chamber 4vs

SmockDoiley · Feb 9, 2004

You gents must never read Car Craft then because they just ran a 3 page extensive article on the Kaase heads. The heads outflowed everybody else at .300 and .400 lift along with peak lifts. True that there max is at .800 but that doesnt mean you have to take them to that extreme to make more power than the other brands. It just means they have more potential. They outflow everybody else starting at .300!! These things will make 500+ on a 100k mile 302, so the potential is there. Pick up the articel because I dont feel like breaking it all down for you. The downside is the price, plus you have to get special valve covers to clear the valvetrain. You have to remember that canting the valves and putting the side load from the pushrod to the rocker at 90 degrees greatly reduces valvetrain stress and wear so these heads will last longer by theory. And they do compete with 205s/and 225s.

Ohio 1989GT · Feb 9, 2004

Wow I'm in over my head

I looked at the catalog and was thinking wow that is a great price for a pair of new heads at only $850. Of course now I know that is for each - never knew why they sold them one at a time

I also was thinking this was a better street/strip head - would this be possible? Probably doesn't matter though, can't afford these $850 a pair heads....(bangs head against wall )

D Durden · Feb 10, 2004

Oh, you can (or could) get the article from Jegs online, too.

Here's my only beef. If you look at the CC article, I BELEIVE it said the heads they were using weren't PRODUCTION Kaase heads but, instead, prototype heads that were SUPPOSED to be representative of production. Mmmmmm . . . just don't like the sound of that.

I mean, it's EASY to claim "we got this stock 302 with 100k, put on our heads with a good intake and cam and KAPOW we almost trippled the horsepower". This rings in my ear with the same tone as things like "Afternoon Project: Front Disc Brakes". Sure, it's an afternoon project as long as you have 5 guys off of Fittapaldi's pit crew, a Snap-On truck full of tools, and two design engineers. If it's you, your friend, your wife, a few tools from Craftsman, and a six pack of Rolling Rock, well, expect it to be 4 weeks. But, I digress!

If they're basically 351C heads, why couldn't you take 351C heads and machine them to perform like the Kaase? How much would it cost and is it even possible?

Just curious . . .

And now, the big question: is anyone actually USING them? How do they feel? If you have a monster 409 or 427 that's humping 500 horse ALREADY with mediocre heads, what should these do? 700hp? 800hp? or 503hp? LOL!

Black70Fastback · Feb 10, 2004

i mean basically 351c injenuity but still very much windsor heads. well the 351c is a diff block. the deck hieght and width is different. the ports are massive round ports instead of the rectangle ports and some of the waterjackets dont line up. intakes and hedders would be hard to find, often needing maching. it wouldnt always cool right. the heads would need some modification there. (althouh i believe thats fairly easy)

it thats what you wanted to do. 302 "boss" heads were be good. they are cleveland heads fitted on the 302 from the factory. those factory intakes would work too and possibly some aftermarket ones then too but those werent fuel injected.

other than that. the kaase heads are aluminum so lighter than the iron clevelands and aslo aluminum burns fuel faster.

SmockDoiley · Feb 10, 2004

Its called a Clevor and its really easy. The heads bolt right on, but you have to drill a few coolant passages and plug some up. As for the large runners, just get the 2V type which flow great for the street. Intakes are easy to find or you can run spacers.
BTW, whats so hard about front brakes? I converted to 5-lug disc brakes with new spindles and everything all by myself and it only took 4 hours.

D Durden · Feb 10, 2004

SmockDoiley said:
BTW, whats so hard about front brakes? I converted to 5-lug disc brakes with new spindles and everything all by myself and it only took 4 hours.

That was just an example . . . not really THE thing (I've got 'em, too . . . all the way around ). BUT, what I mean is all those "Afternoon Project" articles in the magazines. You know, the ones that only take two hours to do . . . as long as you've got the 3 technicians that designed the "project", a machinist, 2 mechanics, and a Snap-On tool outlet store complete with a lift, paint booth, and acid bath all rolled into one . . . . It's sorta' like it only took you an afternoon and 2 friends to finish up Calculus 3. Did I mention my friends were Steven Hawking and Vladmir Ruschev?

65ShelbyClone · Feb 10, 2004

Black70Fastback said:
302 "boss" heads were be good. they are cleveland heads fitted on the 302 from the factory. those factory intakes would work too and possibly some aftermarket ones then too but those werent fuel injected.

other than that. the kaase heads are aluminum so lighter than the iron clevelands and aslo aluminum burns fuel faster.

The Boss 302 heads are based on the Cleveland design, but are not merely Cleveland heads fitted on a 302. They are a different casting with smaller chambers and will not bolt onto a 351C. Using boss 302 heads also requires a Boss 302 intake. Something I havent seen mentioned yet is the fact that the Kaase heads have canted inline valves and the Cleveland's are not only canted, but rotated, creating much shorter ports.

How fast a head burns fuel has more to with the chamber design than the material of which it is cast, but even so, iron retains more heat than aluminum and is proven to make more power over aluminum, so it seems logical that iron heads would promote a faster burn. With some luck you might find some aluminum Cleveland heads of Australia.

SmockDoiley · Feb 10, 2004

I understand you though. It works the other way too, and makes me laugh. I always contact JBA before I start something because I like to hear what they have to say, how much they charge, and the amount of labor involved. They quoted me for 6 hours labor with their "trained team" to install a Procharger for me. Well my friend and I, with no previous supercharger experience, did it in 4. I also called them about reclocking the blower because it needs to point down for the intercooler I was going to install. They said they don't touch that stuff and that disrupting it like that can screw it up, and that only Procharger should do that. Instead of sending it to Procharger, I called them, and they said it takes an allen tool, and 2 minutes. Needless to say, I did it myself and it works fine. It goes to show that sometimes you cant trust the "pros" and that every project should be done with a warning for nothing is truly bolt on. How common is the Mustang, yet everytime I buy a "complete kit" or bolt in part I have to mess with it to get it to work.

D Durden · Feb 11, 2004

SmockDoiley said:
How common is the Mustang, yet everytime I buy a "complete kit" or bolt in part I have to mess with it to get it to work.

EXACTLY!

C.Harris · Feb 11, 2004

Here is a pic from the CC article on flow numbers vs. the GT40X heads. While peak flow is at .800 lift the numbers don't drop off much at all at the .600 range. And even at .500 the magical 200+ cfm on the exhaust side is achieved.

http://forums.stangnet.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18590&stc=1

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