Mustang vs. Camaro

willys1 · Jan 4, 2004

1960's---Camaro
1970's---Camaro
1980's---Mustang
1990's---Camaro
2000---Mustang----Has anyone seen the new Camaro??
Just when the mustangs are getting really fast Camaro and Trans ams vanish!!

Icepick · Jan 4, 2004

I think there will be a 06 Camaro with a 400hp engine. That's what i heard anyways.

FiveOhhStang · Jan 4, 2004

Well IMO I had a Firebird, there great cars for what they are...BUT GM did it to themselves by not advertising for the F-Body..I heard there was only like one comercial in the 90's sometime....well I guess well be seing the 'Maro back in a few though I heard some rumors aswell..
-Nick

IndyBlk5.0 · Jan 4, 2004

the heated debate begins....

FiveOhhStang · Jan 4, 2004

Lol...True...

90mustangGT · Jan 4, 2004

FiveOhhStang said:
Well IMO I had a Firebird, there great cars for what they are...BUT GM did it to themselves by not advertising for the F-Body..I heard there was only like one comercial in the 90's sometime....well I guess well be seing the 'Maro back in a few though I heard some rumors aswell..
-Nick

No kidding, an advertising campain might have saved the F-body. I remember the '98 T/A commercial for the Ram Air, I only saw it once. It pulls up to a light behind a sports car, looked like a RX7 or something and it shows it lunge at the car and then shows the back of the T/A and makes a burp sound and the sports car is gone. or should I say 8-up.

I hope they bring it back without making a retro car out of it. I think if the GTO flops they will go with thier SS concept and make it the new F-body I hope the SSR will be soon replaced. People want a sporty but practical car which they can drive everyday, which the Mustang forfills perfectly, the F-body didn't, so they couldn't sell enough to be practical. The vette isn't a practical car either.

hllon4whls · Jan 4, 2004

Well, IMO fords advertising sucks. Dodge has some of the best commercials out there. Ford needs to really market the lightning and the cobra, the mach 1, etc.

You barely see commercials about the new O3 150. But I sure see the chevy commercial about base hp of the new silverado.

Ford needs to get some real advertisements going!

dustang90 · Jan 4, 2004

I see commercials for the new F-150 all the time. And as for the F-body, it wasn't really the lack of advertising the killed it, it was that the Mustang was far cheaper to buy than the Firebird or the Camaro, Mustangs were outselling the Camaro and the Firebird. Incase no one has noticed, Chevrolet is getting very expensive. A new Z71 goes for about 36,000, and new Suburban for about 45,000 and the new Impala goes for 28,000. How do I know all of this, I work at a Chevrolet dealership, but don't worry, I am in the body shop painting, I am not selling. Fords are much cheaper the Chevrolet buy about 5-10%. Chevy needs to come down on price. They are almost as expensive as their Cadillacs and Oldsmobiles, which they are skyrocketing too. My grandfather just bought a new Escalade that is like the Avalanche(I think that is what it is called) and he paid 58,000 for that. Now I don't know about you guys but GM is too expensive now compared to what Ford sells their vehicles for.

dustang90 · Jan 4, 2004

oops sry didn't meant to post again

SmockDoiley · Jan 5, 2004

Yeah I dont think it was about advertising because Dodge advertises all day long and they dont sell crap. I think what killed the F-body was price, practicality, and insurance rates. It was a crappy car to drive, low to the ground, no room, rubbed on bumps because the long front end, too sporty for women and older people, and no aftermarket. As for price it was just too expensive, and the insurance on those things is off the wall because they come with 300 horses compared to what 240 at the time for the mustang. Chevrolet has a problem with being behind the times too. The looks of all their cars are so plane jane, and they keep pushing iron heads and pushrod engines. As a car company why would you market old tech for high dollar? I saw a recent press release praising the new technology of the tried and true pushrod LS1 in the corvette. What an oxymoron like military intelligence. I left GM because they just dont seem to care for enthusiasts and they have forsaken everything and just dont want to get with the times. They ditched the Caprice Classic which was a great cop car, they then can the F-body and convert the Impala to front wheel duty. Whats next? And GM Performance Parts? Ever seen that catalog what a joke. And look at history. Look how many firsts Ford has through time in regards to the power war. First with the roller cam, first with fuel injection, first with 5 speed I believe, and first and still only with overhead cams. I know other cars have overhead cams but I'm talking about the pony wars. There are others and I'm sure TIMMY will chime in with his anal 2 cents. Back in the day with the IROCS and stuff you couldnt get a stick with a 350, only the 305. I mean dont let the driver have too much fun now. I left for Ford because I want to support a company that strives to keep trying new things and have fun with their products and not be afraid to market a new idea. Look at all the great stuff they sell. Look at GM, what do they have? Nothing!! Even the Corvette sucks for a race guy. Only 1 out of every 10 Vettes come with a stick!! What crap is that?

mike keirstead · Jan 5, 2004

Off topic a little but thats ok......

I think the new MUSTANG is going to look sinister with a set of Draglites with big slicks out back and little skinnies up front.......Wonder who will be the first to do that.

Dont count chevy out just yet...they have something on the drawing board as far as CAMARO is concerned and i think we will see it in 06. Thats just me though...i hope they come out with something anyway. I was sad to see the camaro go even though im a ford guy.....theres just something about a 37 year fight that is kinda cool.

CAMARO vs MUSTANG is not over.......CHEVY IS JUST RELOADING.

mike keirstead · Jan 5, 2004

willys1 said:
Just when the mustangs are getting really fast Camaro and Trans ams vanish!!

They are RELOADING....Chevy is by no means afraid of FORD.

SmockDoiley · Jan 5, 2004

Even if they do, these power bouts only last so long and I'm sure the EPA will shut us down. We can only generate more and more power for so long and when Chevy jumps in it will be too late. The ground work is already laid with Ford and they have claimed a lot of people including SLP so Chevy has an uphill fight if they want to gain respect. Even if this Camaro is fast, it needs to be quality, good sharp, mass produced, and comfy for grandma. Something they've never managed to do before. The key is to keep the base model available for everybody but lay the ground work for a guy like me to make it bad ass. Then also sell an option like the SS for guy who wants something crazy like the Cobra. The standard GT is very well mannered that anybody could own as a family car, yet strap an exhaust and blower on it and you have another car. Or just buy a Cobra and youll piss your pants. GM doesnt seem to understand this concept. They build the Camaro too mean to where only a few kinda of people will appreciate it so of course sales are poor. And then of course they market the car to where its impossible to buy for less than $28000 and nobody wants it.

mike keirstead · Jan 5, 2004

I am excited about the next 3-4 years in the FORD vs CHEVY battle.

I even think Dodge may try and take a piece of the pie. Wouldnt it be cool if they came out with a V-8 rear drive coupe that wasnt 80000 and could compete with the pony cars. That would really be awsome....but until then i am going to keep my 89 Gt. I am happy with its performance. I have no trouble driving past those pesky GMs. I am not stock, but its NA.

I say to GM and Dodge "do your worst"

hllon4whls · Jan 5, 2004

SmockDoiley said:
Yeah I dont think it was about advertising because Dodge advertises all day long and they dont sell crap. I think what killed the F-body was price, practicality, and insurance rates. It was a crappy car to drive, low to the ground, no room, rubbed on bumps because the long front end, too sporty for women and older people, and no aftermarket. As for price it was just too expensive, and the insurance on those things is off the wall because they come with 300 horses compared to what 240 at the time for the mustang. Chevrolet has a problem with being behind the times too. The looks of all their cars are so plane jane, and they keep pushing iron heads and pushrod engines. As a car company why would you market old tech for high dollar? I saw a recent press release praising the new technology of the tried and true pushrod LS1 in the corvette. What an oxymoron like military intelligence. I left GM because they just dont seem to care for enthusiasts and they have forsaken everything and just dont want to get with the times. They ditched the Caprice Classic which was a great cop car, they then can the F-body and convert the Impala to front wheel duty. Whats next? And GM Performance Parts? Ever seen that catalog what a joke. And look at history. Look how many firsts Ford has through time in regards to the power war. First with the roller cam, first with fuel injection, first with 5 speed I believe, and first and still only with overhead cams. I know other cars have overhead cams but I'm talking about the pony wars. There are others and I'm sure TIMMY will chime in with his anal 2 cents. Back in the day with the IROCS and stuff you couldnt get a stick with a 350, only the 305. I mean dont let the driver have too much fun now. I left for Ford because I want to support a company that strives to keep trying new things and have fun with their products and not be afraid to market a new idea. Look at all the great stuff they sell. Look at GM, what do they have? Nothing!! Even the Corvette sucks for a race guy. Only 1 out of every 10 Vettes come with a stick!! What crap is that?

Yeah, but they got the 8.1 liter vortec available in the 2500. That thing is sweet. Runs like a stuck pig till 4500! Sounds sweet with factory exhaust. Wish ford would tune the V10 to run like that.

Other than that ford is on top of the game right now. The 03 cobra and lightning are awesome. The new F-150 finally has some hp in the 5.4 (4.6 still sucky) the powerstroke is the highest hp and torque of any diesel. Hopefully they can hold onto it.

In my experience, however....Fords customer service sucks! They dont know how to treat customers at the dealership. Getting a loaner is damn near impossible. My vehicles are always returned dirty. They dont check the car to make sure all is right.

85_SS_302_Coupe · Jan 5, 2004

In my experience, however....Fords customer service sucks! They dont know how to treat customers at the dealership. Getting a loaner is damn near impossible. My vehicles are always returned dirty. They dont check the car to make sure all is right.
I had a weird experience with an old Ranger i had. It would stall when you hit the gas, which could be a million different things, so i took it to a Ford Dealership and it took them 2 months to fix it, after returning it to me "fixed" about 4 times when it really wasnt. It really pissed me off, but in the end they did everything they could to make things right, after the first month of them having it they gave me a free '00 Contour loner car, i didnt pay one cent to borrow it! They ended up throwing almost 2k worth in parts on this truck before the problem was actually fixed, and the service manager cut me a deal and i only paid for parts at cost, no labor because it took them so long to fix. So in the end i had nearly every sensor replaced, new distributor, new mass air meter and sensor, new O2 sensors, but i still cant remember the actual piece that they decided fixed the problem. I think sometime after that i decided i was a Ford man.

willys1 · Jan 5, 2004

aahhhhh,I love the contraversy! Let me tell ya my 2-cents.The sixties laid the platform.In the eighties they tried to resurect the muscle car era,a pretty lame attempt!The only fast cars were the 87 Buick GN and the 5.0 mustangs.The 90's things started to pick up a little,especially on chevys behalf.But what we have now is a brand new 300, 400, and 500 HP musclecar war unraveling rite before our eyes!The Viper,The 300M(Hemi)and Mike,I bet any amount of money Chysler comes out with a new "Road Runner" or "GTX" or one of the old name plates.GM has the Vette,and now the "GTO"and in a year or two there making a "JUDGE ,and soon the Camaro and Firechicken will be back!Ford has the all the mustang,which in my opinion is the best looking stang ever!Not to mention the ass kicking trucks they make today.This is only the beginning you wait and see!!!!

Icepick · Jan 5, 2004

Speaking of customer service, i took my brand new Chevy in for service and they were great, far better than when i had my 02 GT and took it to Ford.

Asgard · Jan 5, 2004

I have to jump in and say something. The only 2 fords I like are the 88-93 mustang and the focus. Other than that I really can't stand fords. My friend had a 97 or so Chevy pickup with the 5.7 in it. Only 250hp or so and it smoked many cars. It has even beaten a few older mustangs. It is bone stock. Another friend of mine had a 99 Silverado with the 5.3. That truck hauled ***. It was also very comfortable, had a nice ride and was a blast off-road. Yet another friend of mine has a 99-ish F-150 with the 5.4 and about 10k miles on it. We took it for a ride one to day to drop some things off at a friends house who had an early 90's caravan(very boxy one). He didn't understand how much of a dog the truck was, so he got in his VAN and proceded to smoke us 0-90mph and 35-70mph. Not just a little bit either, he actually put about 1 and 1/2 car lengths on us. It was sickening. That and my mom has a 98 Gran Prix GTP that can hang with my mustang. It can also PASS my friends 99 Mustang GT from about 75-80mph and up. Again, sickening. From these few experiences as well as other ones, I have pretty much written off Ford.

85_SS_302_Coupe · Jan 5, 2004

Asgard said:
I have to jump in and say something. The only 2 fords I like are the 88-93 mustang and the focus. Other than that I really can't stand fords. My friend had a 97 or so Chevy pickup with the 5.7 in it. Only 250hp or so and it smoked many cars. It has even beaten a few older mustangs. It is bone stock. Another friend of mine had a 99 Silverado with the 5.3. That truck hauled ***. It was also very comfortable, had a nice ride and was a blast off-road. Yet another friend of mine has a 99-ish F-150 with the 5.4 and about 10k miles on it. We took it for a ride one to day to drop some things off at a friends house who had an early 90's caravan(very boxy one). He didn't understand how much of a dog the truck was, so he got in his VAN and proceded to smoke us 0-90mph and 35-70mph. Not just a little bit either, he actually put about 1 and 1/2 car lengths on us. It was sickening. That and my mom has a 98 Gran Prix GTP that can hang with my mustang. It can also PASS my friends 99 Mustang GT from about 75-80mph and up. Again, sickening. From these few experiences as well as other ones, I have pretty much written off Ford.

Yea sure and i can get into a Buick GN and waste all of the above. What's the point? Just because a minivan can leave an F150 behind 0-90 means nothing, lets see that minivan pull about 4 tons of weight behind it. Can you go off road with a minivan? No. Every car you listed is at least 10 years newer than the nearly every 5.0 made. As for the GTP, sure it's a fast car, i'll give you that one. My point is, you cant write off a car company because little things like a truck being left behind by a minivan. Believe me, i'm nobody to stick up for Ford, and i'm not bashing them either, you're just making unrealistic comparisons.

The other day i got walked by an F350 comming off a redlight. Should i be angry and sell my Mustang or something? I dunno, i think it's all about what you make out of your Mustang that counts. Havent you seen the turbo minivan video? That thing's faster than an '03 Cobra. Just think about who all were in on the HP wars in the mid 80s. Pontiac has been way behind Ford since the last 455 Trans Am, unless you wanna talk LS1s, but where are they now? Buick? Sure the GNs are legendary, but what now? My point is everyone has a couple bad experiences and they get sour with a company. There's this old belief that Fords are junk, found on road dead, whatever you wanna call it, but everyone takes shots at you when you're on top.

Mustang vs. Camaro

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