No juice to starter?

[fox racer]

why is it that after my 5 speed swap my starter has no juice? everything else works, i think there are enough volts, and the cable on the start was bolted back as it was previously and it worked (previously). now why wouldt it work this time? even if i didnt have enough juice, wouldnt i get some sort of jolt from the starter or sumthing? i hear no noises or cranking or nothing whats going on? could it be a dirty connection? is it the fact the neutral sensor (on tranny) isnt plugged up? or that it tis still an AOD computer?

 

[my$100project]

you should have power to the starter. The wire as you probably already know runs directly from the coil (for lack of better terms, Name has slipped my mind at the moment.) I'm willing to bet it's the neutral safety switch. I'm not sure, I don't have access to a diagram, but it's probably in a normally open circuit that must be closed to engage the starter. You can take a butter knife and touch the end of the (coil?- again can't remember the name) where the battery terminal is to the terminal of the wire that leads to the starter. If the motor turns than it is ok. If not you have a bad connection, or starter. If it does turn you can take a cotter pin or paper clip and complete the circuit through the neutral safety switch. (assumming the neutral safety switch is run on a 2 wire circuit that must be closed to engage the starter) someone else may beable to verify if that is how the circuit is run.

 

[HISSIN50]

Did you redo the starter interlock circuit to convert from the AOD to 5 speed. It seems to me that one has to change a couple wires around.

Good luck.

 

[fox racer]

Did you redo the starter interlock circuit to convert from the AOD to 5 speed. It seems to me that one has to change a couple wires around.

Good luck.

can you elaborate? you always seem to kno wat your talking about, but i have never heard this in all the articles and write ups i have read about 5 speed swaps.

 

[txstang84]

i did that swap on a 4cyl/aod car to V8/t-5, and never had any problems...i do remember though, that the red wire w/blue stripe goes to the starter noid, and it goes through the tranny harness to keep you from starting it in gear.

 

[txstang84]

you should have power to the starter. The wire as you probably already know runs directly from the coil (for lack of better terms, Name has slipped my mind at the moment.) I'm willing to bet it's the neutral safety switch. I'm not sure, I don't have access to a diagram, but it's probably in a normally open circuit that must be closed to engage the starter. You can take a butter knife and touch the end of the (coil?- again can't remember the name) where the battery terminal is to the terminal of the wire that leads to the starter. If the motor turns than it is ok. If not you have a bad connection, or starter. If it does turn you can take a cotter pin or paper clip and complete the circuit through the neutral safety switch. (assumming the neutral safety switch is run on a 2 wire circuit that must be closed to engage the starter) someone else may beable to verify if that is how the circuit is run.

yeah, starter solenoid-you're on the right track...butter knives work (rotflmao)-but you might wanna try something with an insulated handle like a screwdriver-been there done that.

 

[my$100project]

yeah, starter solenoid-you're on the right track...butter knives work (rotflmao)-but you might wanna try something with an insulated handle like a screwdriver-been there done that.

:damnit: The name had slipped my mind; thank you. I might want to add not to do this in gear. The vehicle will pop forward on you. If the ignition is turned to the on position the vehicle may even start and take off, not a good scenario. If the starter does engage when you do this, then your off to a good start. Find the wire that you unplugged from the AOD and didn't plug into the t5. As I was saying earlier close the circuit (cotter pin or wire the two terminals together.) If that works then you will have to find a more permanent solution. Possible just slicing the two wires and soldering them together. They may even sell a plug that completes the circuit for you, so you don't have to cut into the wire. If it still doesn't engage I would condemn the starter solenoid. Good Luck.

yea, aButter knife may not be the best idea. Any good conductor with a insulated tip should work.

 

[jrichker]

Here's a checklist:

Since some of the tests will bypass the safety interlocks, make sure that the car is in neutral and the parking brake is set. Becoming a pancake isn’t part of the repair process…

Check battery, terminal connections, ground, starter relay switch (also known as solenoid) and starter in that order.

A voltmeter is handy if you are familiar with how to use it to find bad connections. Measure the voltage drop across a connection: more than .5 volts across a connection indicates a problem.
See http://www.fluke.com/application_notes/automotive/circuit.asp?AGID=1&SID=103 for help

1.) Will the car start if it is jumped? Then clean battery terminals and check battery.

2.) Check the battery to engine block ground, and the ground behind the engine to the firewall.

3.) Then pull the small push on connector (red wire) off the starter relay (Looks like it is stuck on a screw). Then jump between the screw and the terminal that is connected to the battery. If it starts, the relay is good and your problem is in the rest of the circuit.

4.) Remember to check the ignition switch, neutral safety switch on auto trans and the clutch safety switch on manual trans cars. If they are good, then the relay is bad. See http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/gif/large/0900823d80195963.gif for 88-90 year cars .OR see http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/gif/large/0900823d80195964.gif for 91-93 year cars. See http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiB..._us/0900823d/80/1d/db/3c/0900823d801ddb3c.jsp for 94-95 model cars.

5.) Jump the big terminals on the starter relay next to the battery with a screwdriver - watch out for the sparks! If the engine cranks, the starter and power wiring is good. The starter relay is also known as a starter solenoid.

6.) The starter may be hung, loosen up the bolts that hold it on, and give it a good whack with a big hammer. Tighten up the bolts and try again.

7.) If that doesn't work, use a jumper cable from the positive lead on the battery direct to the starter post where the big wire from the relay connects. If it cranks then, it is the power wire from the relay gone bad. This will be hard to do, since there isn't much room to do it.

8.) Pull the starter and take it to Autozone or Pep Boys and have them test it. Starter fails test, then replace it. If you got this far, the starter is probably bad.

 

[fox racer]

wow nice write up. but the thing i dotn get is everything worked flawlessly before. so it has to do with the t-5 harness. wat connector and i modifying? the on on the clutch pedal side or the quadrant side?

 

[fox racer]

ok, well i used insulated pliers to try to jump the staer at the solenoid and nothing.. no spark or anything at all... but i get lights and the interior chime and the fuel pump... how does that happen? o yea, one mor thing, when i did my headswap, i only connected the ground from the firewall to the rear of my cyl. heads, i left the other one ungrounded. so i took out the bolt, and put both ground on the same bolt on the back of the cyl. heads. is that ok? could that cause a problem?

 

[fox racer]

well i did the test again, but with that red connector taken off (on the stud on the starter solenoid) and it sparked initially but then nothig.... and the starter wasnt turned or anyhting

 

[fox racer]

wow im an idiot.. the car is a 5.0 AOD swap from $cyl 5 speed.. so i was able to hook up cruise and safety swwitch... but still nothing. all lights and suck go on. why the hell will it not work?

 

[HISSIN50]

It sounds like you have a half dead battery or bad battery connection, which makes troubleshooting much more difficult. I would make sure the battery has the CCA's to start the car. When you jump the two large lugs on the solenoid, you bypass all the starter interlock devices - the car should start (be sure you are in neutral, ebrake on, etc, since the car car lurch if you are in gear).

Good luck.

 

[fox racer]

k i can deall with that, ill put the car on jumper cable or sumtin.. thanks for your help hissin

 

[my$100project]

First off don't laugh at my damn stick drawing. Imagine this is your battery wire going from the battery to the starter solenoid -------- .this is your wire going from solenoid to starter----, and this is a picture of the two nuts on the starter solenoid 0 0. Now here is a diagram of how your system is set up. -------o o----. When the correct wires tell the starter everythings safe the solenoid goes from --------0 0--- to --------00-----. Basically it is just one wire striaght from the battery to the starter. I have to agree with hiss. It's deffiently one of those two things.
If when you crank the engine the starter doesn't click and the lights don't go dim. I would put my efforts towards a bad connection, most likely at starter solenoid or starter. Double check that on one side of the starter solenoid there is a wire going stright to the starter and on the other side the battery + cable is attached. follow the wire from the solenoid to the starter making sure it didn't somehow get smashed or cut.

 

[6SpeedLX]

i had the same problem after i converted from a T5 to a T56.....the car wouldnt crank at all and i replaced everything in the starting system....i never reconnected the Neutral Safety wire that went into the T5 because there was no place for it on the T56...found a wiring diagram and went under the car...theres 3 connectors hanging in the transmission tunnel.....the one with 4 wires going into it should be the one you're looking for...connect the pink and white wires together and it should start...mine did...the other 2 wires are for the backup lights i beleive..sorry if this post was of no help to you

 

[HISSIN50]

Just for perspective, if someone is jumping the car at the solenoid, it bypasses all the starter interlock devices. So if it wont start (or at least crank) at that point, there is another issue (bad battery, cables, etc).

Good luck.