panhard bar improvement?

[ocbaud]

well i'm trying to figure out what all i want to do to finish up my suspension. i'm going to be getting mm lower control arms and was wondering if its worth the money to get a decent panhard bar?

i'm wanting the car to handle as good as possible and i may get a coil over kit in the future also.

 

[BennyBlown2v]

MM XD control arms + coilovers + panhard = sex. Handles great and hooks INSANE!!

 

[ocbaud]

i'm guessing the MM panhard bar is one of the best?

so its worth the money for one? how hard are they to install?

 

[san~man]

You can get the PHB with your current setup and will notice a considerable improvement in the control of the rear end.

CO's will improve the ride comfort, but unless you plan on serious road racing duty, the price isn't worth it to me. I've had both btw.

 

[san~man]

i'm guessing the MM panhard bar is one of the best?

so its worth the money for one? how hard are they to install?

Read Torinalths experience with his installation.

 

[Torinalth]

to this day the PHB has been the most labor intensive installs i haev ever undertaken. i did it myself, with 2 ramps, 4 jackstands, and a single floor jack. by yourself its a friggen nightmare and expect to spend the entire weekend in the garage, especially if you are kinda new to massive installs. the difficulty of what has to be done is not that bad honestly, you just need to be super prepared and HAVE SOMEONE HELP!!!!! with this scenario you will get it on in less then 6 hours. with a lot of auto experience you will have it done in under 4. i cant stress enough how much ground clearance is a key player in how easy the install is. if you are doing it at home get the car as HIGH as possible.. buy 2x4s to get the jackstands higher. oh, and if yer fat with fat arms... pay someone to do it, i did well because i'm a skiiny sombish.

the MM is the best PHB on the market, personal opinion of course. you will notice a slight difference when getting just the PHB, however i will stress this point, you will notice more of an improvement once you ditch the UCAs and go true trilink (pm3l is a tad touchy for a standard road car). for some reason i have yet to equate the stock UCAs prevent the suspension from moving fully, even with LCAs, and the PHB... something is still missing.

even with that said the PHB is still worth it. my opinion, if you want it to handle well then get the phb, with LCAs, coilovers, and go ahead and get the torque arm, or do like me and get the EvM trilink (on backorder currently)

if you are planning suspension, and want it balanced, then be ready to move to the front once the rear is planted. after my trilink comes in and goes on i will be working on the front end with one large pusg (K member, A arms, solid steering shaft, tierod ends, coilovers, , self made CO isolators, and a handfull of other things).

before you move forward decide how much you are willing to sink into this project.... i have resigned to going full bore and with end up with the MM max grip package with a few slight twists. anyhow, i am having to replace my bilsteins, HR race springs, and my swaybars as they will be replaced by other things as i progress... bout 1k lost in parts with that. shrug, maaybe i'm just an addict and a freak of suspension madness.

Torinalth

 

[dlascoskie]

before you move forward decide how much you are willing to sink into this project.... i have resigned to going full bore and with end up with the MM max grip package with a few slight twists. anyhow, i am having to replace my bilsteins, HR race springs, and my swaybars as they will be replaced by other things as i progress... bout 1k lost in parts with that. shrug, maaybe i'm just an addict and a freak of suspension madness.

Torinalth

Do you race?? Because this seems like an awful lot to sink into a street car, when the stock stuff works just fine.

 

[BennyBlown2v]

Hey Torinalth atleast its not as bad as what I did...going with a IRS w/bushings and coilovers...then one day deciding I wanted a live axle again

The panhard bar install was easy for me...like real easy I did it in an hour by myself. Half of the instructions are just how to put the damn shock/axle mount on LOL. Subframe connectors were harder than PHB imo as I only had the car raised on ramps at all four corners so I had about 12" to work with lol....

 

[Torinalth]

i only had half the tools, and 12" my self, so when not owning all the correct tools, well, it takes longer and some inginuity. now that i've done it and know what it needs, it'd be cake.

and no i do not race, this is my DD car... though at some point 'd like to run up to VIr or road atlanta... maybe in a few years... shrug.

Torinalth

 

[Torinalth]

when the stock stuff works just fine.

wow, somehow missed this statement.... and in a word...NO

 

[san~man]

Do you race?? Because this seems like an awful lot to sink into a street car, when the stock stuff works just fine.

What "stock stuff" are you referring to?

 

[dlascoskie]

If you DON'T RACE, the stock rear end is sufficient for street use. i'm not saying that you shouldn't make improvements, but Torinalth has a ****-ton of mods for a daily driver. It's cool, it's a hobby, but seems a little over-the-top for a daily driver, imho.

By the way, I highly recommend track time........you'll be very surprised at how much faster you drive. It may feel fast on the street, but you're really just crawling compared to track use.

 

[Torinalth]

never been to the track, nothing close really. yes its a DD with 143k miles. frankly i couldnt stand the stock suspension floated like it was a mercury. i havnt touched the engine because i am still not happy with the feel of the car.

T

 

[atari]

never been to the track, nothing close really. yes its a DD with 143k miles. frankly i couldnt stand the stock suspension floated like it was a mercury. i havnt touched the engine because i am still not happy with the feel of the car.

T

I agree, my 2001 VW beetle handled better! My wifes Ranger corners better, Floating is a good way to put it.

 

[san~man]

If you DON'T RACE, the stock rear end is sufficient for street use. i'm not saying that you shouldn't make improvements, but Torinalth has a ****-ton of mods for a daily driver. It's cool, it's a hobby, but seems a little over-the-top for a daily driver, imho.

Everyone has different expectations of how a car should handle. Some will say that the factor suspension is good enough for them while others won't.

I'm one of those who say it sucks ****. To say it handles like a boat is generous at best. Although I will never take my car to a track event, I'm happy with my current setup. The only thing left for me to do in my situation is a T/A, but I want to work on the motor first.

 

[Torinalth]

i'll hit VIR or something once i have every suspension piece possible for my car. my goal is 1g skidpad with 275 Tires.... being able to out handle any vette on the road, take down a miata, and force **** a ferrari is where i want to be. i'll get ther in the turns first, then the motor will be become a hellion.

if you cand handle its not worth my money.

Torinalth

 

[Heratik]

I'd say do a IRS swap if you aren't going to drag race. I have benny's and I am loving it. The rear end stays planted no mater how rough the road.

 

[Torinalth]

irs rocks, especially for a DD where taking turns hard can be problematic when the turn is bumpy... on a track live axle is the king. however IRS is more expensive everything is a trade.

Torinalth