Question for AFR head users, or any 331/347 users

281pony · Oct 23, 2005

im looking at building a new 331 combo. im most likely going with afr 185's this time. i dont have the cash to upgrade springs along with everything else.

are any of you using the stock out of the box heads, with stock hardware/springs? are they working fine for you or are they really trash like some say? it wont be revved beyond 6k ever, should be a fairly simple cam also.

looking at this for my combo, what do you think aside from the first question? suggestions?

afr 185's, fti street cam, rpm 1 intake ported, 70mm tb, 80mm maf, 30# injectors, 1.625" equal lengths, 2.5" o/r h-pipe, 1.6 rockers.

this will be strictly a street car, i want it to be an f'n monster to about 80 mph. not a race/track car, just a car to go out and have some fun.

Hissing Cobra · Oct 23, 2005

I've got AFR 185's (58 cc's) on my 306 and I did not purchase their spring upgrade kit because my cam specs did not exceed their published spring rates. That's something you'll have to check into.

Contact AFR to find out what lift the standard springs are good until and choose your cam accordingly. If your cam specs exceed the rated spring pressure, you'll have to upgrade the springs.

Good luck!

281pony · Oct 23, 2005

yeah, i believe the stock springs are good to like .550 and nothing over 6k rpm's. might be off some.

aside from that, ive heard the valves are trash, and to just get bare castings. so you run them out of the box without issue, thats good to hear.

thanks for the input

90mustangGT · Oct 23, 2005

I don't have AFR's but I am considering getting them. From what I have heard, ARR's are the best out of box head out there. From what I have seen at the track, they are also probally the best out of box head out there. If you see an engine with AFR's, you can bet on that it is going to run good. Thier spring and calve packages are suposed to be good for most mild setups as you described. I can't say from experince though.

281pony · Oct 23, 2005

90mustangGT said:
I don't have AFR's but I am considering getting them. From what I have heard, ARR's are the best out of box head out there. From what I have seen at the track, they are also probally the best out of box head out there. If you see an engine with AFR's, you can bet on that it is going to run good. Thier spring and calve packages are suposed to be good for most mild setups as you described. I can't say from experince though.

yeah, thats what ive heard also. only complaints have really been about the hardware, so im just trying to get some feedback before we get them. the budget just wont allow for 300 dollar additions here and there, ect.

i also considered the tw heads for a cheaper alternate route, except i dont think the shortblock this stuff is going on has the reliefs for them. they are inline reliefs im 99% sure, not sure how much of a cam we could run without them on tw's?

i have an email in with ed for the cam, i will have to go from there. im building this for my cousin, so im kinda playing the middle man at this point for what he wants/asks me.

RacEoHolic330 · Oct 23, 2005

I have a set of stock 165's on my supercharged mustang with a .544/.544 cam. They've been on there for about 6k and I have yet to have any issues with them at all. Great heads IMO

Rick 91GT · Oct 23, 2005

It all depends on the cam and lobe profile. The stock springs have 120# of pressure and are fine on some soft ramp profiles and a mild cam, they tend to lose a few pounds almost immediatly from what I have seen.

With any of the custom cams, Ed's, Jay's or any other I have always upgraded the springs and seals. When using a asymetrical lobe it is needed.... I prefer to upgrade the springs and seals myself instead of the AFR upgrade which features a longer valve and a taller retainer.

I've used Ed's spring and seal upgrade $200

Modular2v · Oct 23, 2005

i have a set of 185s sitting in my garage for my 331 that i STILL have not had time to put on lol....but when i do i will let you know

EDC · Oct 23, 2005

331Pony said:
yeah, i believe the stock springs are good to like .550 and nothing over 6k rpm's. might be off some.

aside from that, ive heard the valves are trash, and to just get bare castings. so you run them out of the box without issue, thats good to hear.

thanks for the input

To add to Rick's notes...

The standard AFR valve springs are really more for a stock OEM hydraulic roller cams or a decent flat tappet camshaft.

Also, the "as provided" AFR valves ARE NOT trash if used in the criteria they were designed for. Just like anything in performance, you don't use street parts in a race application. Same holds true for the AFR hardware. When used in most street/strip applications, they'll be fine. I've sent out plenty of complete heads using the standard valves, in customer hands with no issues. If you have a power adder or want to use a high RPM cam profile, they need to be replaced with the proper parts. Common sense!

That being said, when the heads, camshaft and all the peripherals are correctly spec'd and properly installed, you'll have no problems other than worn out rear tires. Can't say the same if you pick mismatched, Ebay packages.

Ed

281pony · Oct 23, 2005

thanks rick/ed.

ill be in touch about the cam and we can go from there.

N8Miller · Oct 23, 2005

Rick 91GT said:
With any of the custom cams, Ed's, Jay's or any other I have always upgraded the springs and seals. When using a asymetrical lobe it is needed.... I prefer to upgrade the springs and seals myself instead of the AFR upgrade which features a longer valve and a taller retainer.

I've used Ed's spring and seal upgrade $200

rick can vouch for the fact that I should have upgraded my springs! just becasue a spring is "advertised" as a specific rate, doesnt mean that the "actual" rate is gonna be that.... Jay Allen told me that. As is, rick will probably be going my springs this winter... that is if he isnt too busy

davs5.0 · Oct 25, 2005

I think my combo is pretty close to what you are going to be using. I have the 185's with 60cc. I'm running a Lunati cam with 500/510 lift but with 1.7 rockers. I didn't want to spring for the new rocker arms so I kept the pedestal mount 1.7's. Works out to about .525/.530 lift. Car works great, no problems at all. Runs 12.20's and still haven't put the timing over 10 degrees yet. Just bracket racing so no changes made yet. Should get into the lower 12's or even high 11's.

KDK1988GT · Oct 25, 2005

Hey I'm running my 331... with AFR 185's 61cc with 2.02 & 1.6 Valves ... Comp Cam Xtreme Energy 224/232Duration @ .555/.565 Lift...

I'm running the AFR valves... I upgraded my springs on my own.... have had no probs...

As for other mods to the motor they are...
- Holley SysteMAX II Intakes
- 30 lbs Injectors
- MAC 1`3/4 Long Tube Headers
- D.S.S 331 Stroker Kit with D.S.S Pro Lite Series Pistons
- D.S.S Main Support
- .30 Over Stock Block
- ect....

The car ran 11.8's @ 117 all day.. and is very street... there is still lots more in the car... I need a set of taller tires because of the 4:10's I was crossing the line at 6200 rpm.. and I plan on running on the bottle.....

good luck with your combo...

89white50 · Oct 25, 2005

did you guys with the 331's have to clearence the block for the stroker to fit? sorry for stealing the thread...just a quick question.

Modular2v · Oct 25, 2005

89white50 said:
did you guys with the 331's have to clearence the block for the stroker to fit? sorry for stealing the thread...just a quick question.

yes i had to have the cylinder skirts notched in order for the rod bolts to clear

304billet · Oct 25, 2005

Had a set of AFR 185's pedestal mount on a 347 stroker with 20,000 daily driver miles. No problems at all. Cam was .531/.552 lift, 220/230 dur. w/ stock springs. Sold them with the 347 stroker, engine builder ported them, upgraded the springs, put in a Comp cam XE282HR, 30lbers and hit 400/400 @ the RW, NA.

U may even consider going to the 205's great head on a 331 or 347.

Question for AFR head users, or any 331/347 users

281pony

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Hissing Cobra

281pony

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90mustangGT

I felt sorry for girls because

281pony

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RacEoHolic330

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281pony

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davs5.0

KDK1988GT

89white50

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