road racing guys i got a question

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 6, 2007

ok so this tax season im gonna buy a whole new suspesion for my car
so i can use all of my power in the twisties,right now i am looking at 2 kits from dugan racing the only diff between the two is one comes with a pan hard bar,
is this a neccesity?the kits also include,tokico shocks and struts,trick1 springs,offset rack busings+isolators,castor camber plates,sway bars,subframe connectors,upper and lower control arms.there is about a $400 difference in price.i feel this kit w/out the pan hard bar will make the car handle great but am unsure.i want to strat road racing the car so any imput is highly appriceated

thanks joe

autoX · Dec 6, 2007

Hi Joe,

When you say road "racing" are you really meaning racing competitively, or more like track days and HPDE? The reason I ask is the kit you mention is really just the tip of the iceberg if you're going to actually race competitively. But if you're talking about track days and stuff, then this would be an awesome start.

How does the price of this kit compare to a Maximum Motorsports or a Griggs racing kit? In my opinion the Griggs racing kit with torque arm and panhard bar combination (I think it's called the GR-40) is probably the ultimate setup. My brother has the real basic MM kit on his car and I really like how it rides and handles. I don't have any experience with the one you mention, but yes, the kit you talk about above is going to totally transform your car. And I think you could always add the panhard bar at some point as your skills improve. So if it were my money, I think I'd start with the base kit and add as funds allowed...

Hope that's somewhat helpful.

-Mike

Scooby5.0Doo · Dec 6, 2007

well if your thinking of auto crossing the stang you wont feel the pan hard bar very much most corrners are to short but if you plan on hitting the open track get the bar. i dont have one to help me learn to feel the car and corect constantly in corners. without a pan hard bar the rear axle WILL streer the car the way the rear axle wants the car to go not you. mustangs 4 link handles fast porshe drivers hate me cuz we go around the corrners the same or im a bit faster. BUT the mustang does not handle stably cuz of the rear that will float around and do what it want to do in longer corners

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 6, 2007

autoX said:
Hi Joe,

When you say road "racing" are you really meaning racing competitively, or more like track days and HPDE? The reason I ask is the kit you mention is really just the tip of the iceberg if you're going to actually race competitively. But if you're talking about track days and stuff, then this would be an awesome start.

How does the price of this kit compare to a Maximum Motorsports or a Griggs racing kit? In my opinion the Griggs racing kit with torque arm and panhard bar combination (I think it's called the GR-40) is probably the ultimate setup. My brother has the real basic MM kit on his car and I really like how it rides and handles. I don't have any experience with the one you mention, but yes, the kit you talk about above is going to totally transform your car. And I think you could always add the panhard bar at some point as your skills improve. So if it were my money, I think I'd start with the base kit and add as funds allowed...

Hope that's somewhat helpful.

-Mike

i am more or less looking at track days until i get used to the car then i was thinking of maybe going a little more competitive but i dont really want to set my car up per rule book.the mm kits seem to be to much $ but i havent looked at griggs racing,but thanks for the advise.

joe

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 6, 2007

SCOOBY5.0DOO AND AUTO X you have some very good pionts,i did look at griggs racing at the ultament street kit its about double but uses coil overs so it might
be a better idea,thanks for the gooed input now i just have to decide if i want to spend the money.

352Ford2 · Dec 7, 2007

Buy from companies that have real engineers, trust me; I have learned the hard way. There is a lot of junk in the aftermarket that will make your car handle worse than stock.

If you can’t afford Griggs, buy Maximum Motorsports.

MTMMAN · Dec 7, 2007

Skip right past the Dugan stuff. Go straight to Maximum or Griggs.
EVM and Agent 47 are good options too.
A great starting point is the Maximum Motorsports Starter Box or Sport Box. I would suggest only using Bilstein's or Koni's. You will end up spending money twice if you use Tokico. If you want to do some research head over to Corner-Carvers and use the search feature.

Rootus · Dec 7, 2007

Another vote for MM. The suspension is about the last place I'd want to go cheap on, because a part failure could mean the destruction of the car, and maybe the driver along with it.

autoX · Dec 7, 2007

Wow cool. I've been out of the Mustang scene for about 5 yrs now, so I wasn't sure if there was new stuff out there, but Griggs and Maximum Motorsports were very good companies a while back and it sounds like the still have a good rep. That's great. I'm going to be in the market for some new struts/shocks pretty soon here and wasn't really sure which way to go myself. I had Koni super sports on my first mustang and liked them, but wasn't sure if there was something else that was out there now. Maybe I'll just stick with what I know...

-Mike

MTMMAN · Dec 7, 2007

I have Koni DA's on my car. Thats what Griggs & Kenny Brown use for the most part. I really like the Bilsteins as well. The Maximum Motorsports race valved units are great.
The Koni DA's allow's you the ability tune the rebound and compression. A great feature if you know what your doing. If not it allows you to create issues. This is why I think for alot of people the Bilstein self valving units are better. You can focus on the your driving and let the shocks/struts do their thing.

Rootus · Dec 7, 2007

MTMMAN said:
I really like the Bilsteins as well. The Maximum Motorsports race valved units are great.

I wonder if they've had any luck convincing Bilstein to fix the strut mounts or if they're still doing the fix themselves. Guessing the latter, but I will be interested to see if Bilstein steps up.

Bullitt2343 · Dec 7, 2007

Another vote for MM

Here is the setup I installed on my Bullitt specifically for track use, but yet comfortable enough to be used as a daily driver if necessary.

MM Road & Track springs 800#-300#
MM Panhard bar
MM CC plates
MM 4-bolt K-member brace
MM full length SFC
HD Bilsteins
Adjustable control arms
Steeda X2 ball joints
Steeda bumpsteer kit
Steeda Offset A-arm bushings
Offset Steering rack bushings

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 7, 2007

well after doing some reaserch and your guys thoughts i think its gonna be worth the extra $1500.this is the kit i am looking at i think it will do a very good job.i will eventully go to a tubular k member but i dont know when yet
kit i am looking at this particullar kit
http://www.griggsracing.com/product_info.php?cPath=20_1070_2259&products_id=553

thanks joe

Scooby5.0Doo · Dec 8, 2007

ooo your getting a tq arm too thats a very complete kit. with some R compound dot tires and some 03 cobra brakes . you would have one of the fastest laping cars on a typical track day.

FoxBodyGT · Dec 8, 2007

Have you tracked or autocrossed this car (or any Mustang) before? If not, take the time and learn the car before you start throwing money into it. You can learn a whole lot more about the car without the expensive parts if you upgrade the nut behind the wheel, first.

JMHO, YMMV

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 8, 2007

Scooby5.0Doo said:
ooo your getting a tq arm too thats a very complete kit. with some R compound dot tires and some 03 cobra brakes . you would have one of the fastest laping cars on a typical track day.

that would be fun,i wonder what its gonna be like with my turbo
but i will probly run it for a while without it so i can get used to how it drives and handels

quote from fox body gt
Have you tracked or autocrossed this car (or any Mustang) before? If not, take the time and learn the car before you start throwing money into it. You can learn a whole lot more about the car without the expensive parts if you upgrade the nut behind the wheel, first.

JMHO, YMMV

to answer your question it is no.i probly shouldnt jump into it like this and spend this much money but why not its only money.the problem with learning the car it is a 4cyl car with rear coil overs with drag springs and if i want to make it handel i might as well put the money is the suspension and brakes because the power is there.granted my driving skills probbly are not the greatest,but i have always been interested in road racing i would say about the only experince i would have are with the go carts at k1 speed in bellevue,i used to go there alot when it was named something else.but that is a totally differnt ball game and this is alot more serious.the one thing i have learned with buying parts fo my car is you get what you pay for.and i dont like having to replace parts.

thanks joe

FoxBodyGT · Dec 9, 2007

Well, upgrading the car from drag race suspension to handling suspension is a good thing. I still would spend the money on safety stuff/maintenance stuff first; then invest in the driver with some driving schools of some sort. This is something you'll have to do anyway, especially in the NASA ranks. If I'm not mistaken, you need to prove to them that you can drive before you get a competition license. That means doing the HPDE 1-HPDE 4 track.

I understand it's "only money", but just because you have it doesn't mean you should just spend it and not think about safety for you and your "investment" of a car.

Good luck.

Scooby5.0Doo · Dec 9, 2007

i am a racer in this region both scca and icscc , icscc you need track days and prove to you instructors people like me because i am one of those too then you can be a novice where you only race with other 1st timers, scca just needs askes you to give them money and will let you out there with the sharks then youll be under review to see you can do other races beside the ones marked for novices to join. but turbo88coupe is not talking about racing yet just track days. and when you put a pan hard bar on a mustang it no longer handles anything like a stock mustang. oh and turbo88coupe its very easy to over heat stock breaks on a 5.0 fox im not sure if the breaks on a turbo are any better or not. i caught mine on fire even with break ducts.

P.S. i was assuming you had a turbo coupe not a turbo'd 5.0 if its the latter get better brakes before doing ANY track days youll have more fun

TURBO80LXCOUPE · Dec 9, 2007

Scooby5.0Doo said:
P.S. i was assuming you had a turbo coupe not a turbo'd 5.0 if its the latter get better brakes before doing ANY track days youll have more fun

i do have a turboed 5.0 but i will probly run na for a while until i get used to the car.i am going to do a sn95 4 wheel disc conversion with the cobra stuff hopefully.but i am not sure about if the spindal to caliper to rotor will clear with 94-95 gt or v6 spindals.
i am assuming i can use these spindals with cobra rotors and calipers and is is almost a bolt on with a small amount of fabrication and i foud a 95 gt rear diff with calipers and every thing. so that is mainly the braking aspect of the car.another kit i am looking at is the maximum grip box from MM

and foxbodygt i do understand what you are saying and i am planning on going to some driving schools,i have thought about going to bondurant in the summer.for safty stuff i do plan on definantly upgrade things like brakes and put a mm cage in the car.i have had to many freinds in california die screwing around on back roads.
and if i get more serious i was thinking about a fuel safe fuel cell and a haylon system.belive you and me safty is important to me

thanks joe

Scooby5.0Doo · Dec 9, 2007

TURBO80LXCOUPE said:
.i am going to do a sn95 4 wheel disc conversion with the cobra stuff hopefully.but i am not sure about if the spindal to caliper to rotor will clear with 94-95 gt or v6 spindals.

thanks joe

i have sn95 front spindles on my car now and the 94-04 cobra brakes will just bolt on i was thinking on doing that sometime if i keep the car(my fox will probly become my donor car). dunner on here drives a fox with that braking set up. and hes brakes right about where i brake in my race car. driving courses like bondurant, skip barber, jim russell. some classes at the end if you complete the week or 3-4 days you wil get an scca racing lisence and will not have to do any novice days with scca and only one observation race with icscc. so there is less hassle getting a full racing liscence

road racing guys i got a question

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