As of right now I'm trying to find a ride to autozone, to get some power steering fluid. In the mean time, is it certain that I need it? Yeah the power steering fluid is below the minimum mark, but barely. And there's no signs of a leak that I found yet. So the car must have always been barely below the mark. Why all of a sudden will it crap out? Also, I read a lot of posts on the tremec tranny problemss, and how everyone swear you have to use "this" kind of tranny fluid. Are we looking at the same situation for the power steering?
Serious brake problem at 24,000 miles. Please Help
- Thread starter me27821
- Start date
Well call me a noob (even though I've been posting here for 5 years). I'm in the military and I suck with abreviations. So what's ATF? Not auto tranny fluid I hope. And yeah my belt is on right. Looks to be spinning just fine too. Oh, the serpentine belt, is the "accesory belt", on the front of the engine, right?
So here's an update on everything. I haven't gone to autozone yet, but I messed with my car some more. Earlier I said it was just below the minimum mark. Later it was farther below. So I put a piece of tape at the level it was at. Then I noticed a puddle. The fluid in that puddle was red. So there it is. A leak in the power steering system. So I wiped everything clean, and gave it some time. Checked again, and no leak. Then I Started the engine and snooped around under the hood. What I noticed was the power steering fluid level went strait down. Maybe that's normal, I don't know. So I opened the resevior and looked inside. It basically looks like a draining washing machine. Everything was sloshing and spinning into a whirlpool kinda thing. It was also a dark orange, and foamy. Normal? I don't know. I shut the car off and the fluid rose a little. Not up to the tape though. Then I gave it maybe 2 hours roughly. Went out and checked it again, and the leak was back, so I wiped it clean again. The level was above the peice of tape, but still way below the minimum. If you picture the distance between the max and min marks, it's equal to that distance, below the minimum. I'm not sure exaclty how to describe where the leak is coming from, and I don't know terminology well (which is why you call me a noob), so here's some pics. You can notice where the front driver's side wheel is in the roundish pic, which helpt's to get you oriented with the angle it's veiwed from. And in the second pic, you can notice the fluid inside the circle. I suspect the leak is coming from both parts, but it may only be because it's leaking at the top circle, and dripping around and past the bolt in the bottom circle.
So my main concern is is, did the FR500 swap cause this? Like I said, I didn't hammer, jam, jerk, or manhandle it at all. Infact I was extrmely careful considereing.. -this is the second time I did this job, and I noticed the damage to the stock wheel, and popping sound from the steering column, before I did the job on my old Mustang-. On the other hand though. It did take an extreme amount of strength to turn the wrench on the puller to get the stock wheel off this new car. If I understand right, that puller tool rests on the front of the steering column. Then again, all force applied there should have been on the actual wheel, unless I was laying on the wrench pushing it back into the steering column (which I wasn't).
I'm clueless as to what's going on,but I have a few questions.
1. Is the power steering fluid resevoir supposed to look like a draining washing machine when the engine is running, and is it supposed to be foamy?
2. Is the power steering fluid supposed to smell sort of like hot, burned, or old electronics. Kinda like the smell of a nintento cartridge after playing it for a few hours.
3. Can swapping the stock to FR500 wheel in any way cause this problem, or is it really just a coincidence?
So here's an update on everything. I haven't gone to autozone yet, but I messed with my car some more. Earlier I said it was just below the minimum mark. Later it was farther below. So I put a piece of tape at the level it was at. Then I noticed a puddle. The fluid in that puddle was red. So there it is. A leak in the power steering system. So I wiped everything clean, and gave it some time. Checked again, and no leak. Then I Started the engine and snooped around under the hood. What I noticed was the power steering fluid level went strait down. Maybe that's normal, I don't know. So I opened the resevior and looked inside. It basically looks like a draining washing machine. Everything was sloshing and spinning into a whirlpool kinda thing. It was also a dark orange, and foamy. Normal? I don't know. I shut the car off and the fluid rose a little. Not up to the tape though. Then I gave it maybe 2 hours roughly. Went out and checked it again, and the leak was back, so I wiped it clean again. The level was above the peice of tape, but still way below the minimum. If you picture the distance between the max and min marks, it's equal to that distance, below the minimum. I'm not sure exaclty how to describe where the leak is coming from, and I don't know terminology well (which is why you call me a noob), so here's some pics. You can notice where the front driver's side wheel is in the roundish pic, which helpt's to get you oriented with the angle it's veiwed from. And in the second pic, you can notice the fluid inside the circle. I suspect the leak is coming from both parts, but it may only be because it's leaking at the top circle, and dripping around and past the bolt in the bottom circle.
So my main concern is is, did the FR500 swap cause this? Like I said, I didn't hammer, jam, jerk, or manhandle it at all. Infact I was extrmely careful considereing.. -this is the second time I did this job, and I noticed the damage to the stock wheel, and popping sound from the steering column, before I did the job on my old Mustang-. On the other hand though. It did take an extreme amount of strength to turn the wrench on the puller to get the stock wheel off this new car. If I understand right, that puller tool rests on the front of the steering column. Then again, all force applied there should have been on the actual wheel, unless I was laying on the wrench pushing it back into the steering column (which I wasn't).
I'm clueless as to what's going on,but I have a few questions.
1. Is the power steering fluid resevoir supposed to look like a draining washing machine when the engine is running, and is it supposed to be foamy?
2. Is the power steering fluid supposed to smell sort of like hot, burned, or old electronics. Kinda like the smell of a nintento cartridge after playing it for a few hours.
3. Can swapping the stock to FR500 wheel in any way cause this problem, or is it really just a coincidence?
Attachments
1. No
2. No
3. No
can't see the pics
and yes, ATF is Automatic Trans Fluid. buy a quart or 2 of Mercon/Dexron III but i think now it's called Domestic Trans Fluid
Once the engine is running the fluid will begin pumping throughout the system. If you are low it will be sucking air and causing the foam and problems you describe. As for teh leak can you tell where it is coming from?
screamin gt
5 Year Member
put some fluid in there, and drive it back to your dealer to have them fix it. just drive it slow and careful and you'll be fine.
yes, the leaks are coming from the top cirle in the pics. I don't know why they wont load, but I'll try to fix that. I filled it to just above the max line with power steering fluid. I started the engine, and is still does that whirlpool thing. It's foamy too, just a little. The brakes are making that sound again, and there's no power steering at the wheels. I noticed too, the brake pedal will be stiff as usual at first, then sink away as the sound starts. Then like it's been doing, it jitters, then kicks back. Not safe to drive anywhere. No steering, no brakes, on a manual transmisson. The brain can't handle all that at once for a 14 mile drive. Hopefully the dealership will pay for the tow.
No luck on the pics. Looks like image shack is down for the time being.
No luck on the pics. Looks like image shack is down for the time being.
Yeah but in my case it cant be the rotors scratching. The car is not moving when it makes this sound. Anyway, the flatbed is on it's way right now to take it back to the dealership. I'm just gonna leave the FR500 wheel on it, and hope the guy doesn't notice. If so I'm telling him I swapped the wheel like 8 days before the problem started. Yeah it's a lie. However, EVERYONE tells me (on this forum, and offline), that a simple wheel swap did not cause it. But the dealership will look for any reason not to fix it. I'll keep everyone posted on what happens.
Same issue here, actually ever since i got my car ( 5 months ago) ive noticed its hard to turn at times when im sittin still at idle, but i just checked the fluid and for leaks, and had none , and the fluid was at the max line, so i just thought nothing of it. well sunday, im out driving and get this whineing loudly when i turn, and cant hardly get it to turn at a stand still unless i rev it up. ALSO im getting the vibration in the brakes as you are, its pulsating almost as if ABS is coming on, or something. and makes the same noise that i get when i turn the steering wheel.
Everyones told me its my power steering pump, So tonite i bought a new one and im putting it on. HOPFULLY that will fix it bc im supposed to go out of town friday lol. the main reason i assumed that its the power steering pump is that like i said ever since i got the car the power steering felt rather weak and hard to turn at times. I guess its just finally gona give out on me. but so far it still works, just not well at all. also i havnt noticed any fluid level drop of any sort so I know its not leaking.
anyone have any advice, ideas, comments, feel free. Ill post my results ASAP
Everyones told me its my power steering pump, So tonite i bought a new one and im putting it on. HOPFULLY that will fix it bc im supposed to go out of town friday lol. the main reason i assumed that its the power steering pump is that like i said ever since i got the car the power steering felt rather weak and hard to turn at times. I guess its just finally gona give out on me. but so far it still works, just not well at all. also i havnt noticed any fluid level drop of any sort so I know its not leaking.
anyone have any advice, ideas, comments, feel free. Ill post my results ASAP
well,my step dad and i broke two power steering pumps. lol
the stupid bolt and nut that comes with the new pump to ' press' the pulley back on, well both of them broke inside it both times. ****in piece of **** cheap ****.
anyways both times tryed to hammer the pulley the rest of the way on ( just about 1/8 inch from being totaly on' ( the first time i did it and didnt tell him lol and just swapped it out) then he did the same thing i did and i acted surprised.. like wow damnit.. hahahhah
anyways, we're gona ATTEMPT to return it again and this time use somones press hopfully that will work. if not i dont know wtf do to
word of advice never hammer on them, just the SLIGHTEST hits, will bust the bottom out of it and make it leak. ****, two swings is all it took me. with a small hammer just trying to tap. what a crock, beats me why the mother ****ers dont just come with pulleys on them.
the stupid bolt and nut that comes with the new pump to ' press' the pulley back on, well both of them broke inside it both times. ****in piece of **** cheap ****.
anyways both times tryed to hammer the pulley the rest of the way on ( just about 1/8 inch from being totaly on' ( the first time i did it and didnt tell him lol and just swapped it out) then he did the same thing i did and i acted surprised.. like wow damnit.. hahahhah
anyways, we're gona ATTEMPT to return it again and this time use somones press hopfully that will work. if not i dont know wtf do to
word of advice never hammer on them, just the SLIGHTEST hits, will bust the bottom out of it and make it leak. ****, two swings is all it took me. with a small hammer just trying to tap. what a crock, beats me why the mother ****ers dont just come with pulleys on them.
I kept trying, but couldn't get imageshack to work. Then a few days later I tried photobucket. So, the images I posted on page 1 last weekend are working now. You can see where the leak was. It was coming from the top circle of each pic. I filled it to the max line with fluid, and it still didn't work. Had it towed back to the dealership and had to listen to 10 minutes of "oh that's weird. usually the breaks and steering don't go out like that" "oh I've never heard of that before, that's strange". The next day, the shop told me what I already knew. The rack and pinion was shot. Leaking and needed to be replaced, and that was what caused my brakes to go out. I kept asking them, and stressed the issue on what caused it. The only responces I could get were "it was michanical failure", "the thing just went out", and "I'm not a ford person". They also replaced a line, and needed the car an extra day to bleed the system. They said it was fighting them. Whatever. The was no mention on any problems with the power steering pump. I can only hope they honestly did check it, and it checked good. The new part took several days to arrive, and cost $300. Labor was about $500 they said. That's a big fat bill that went strait to the used car department who sold me the car. Nothing cost me a dime, but although I'm not too sure, I think they test drove half a tank of gas out of my car. Also I was 3/4 of the way home before I noticed the wheel is not centered. Too bad for me though. I need a car NOW, and will just have to get that aligned some other time. Also the car doesn't pull to the left or right at all, which I like. (my old V6 mustang pulled to the right really hard. I think that's because I did all my donuts in the same direction. The car didn't have the power to do donuts turning to the left.)
So in the end, ther was nothing wrong with the brakes. After reading some replies, I kinda figured that anyway, especially after seeing the power steering fluid leak. I'd like to also add that the grinding sound was not coming from the rotors, or being cause by metal on metal contact involving my brakes. Any time I heard the grinding sound, the car was STOPPED, meaning there was no possible chance of movement or friction at the rotors. I'd also like to add (for anyone else in the future who might troubleshoot this on their car, that the ABS light in the dash NEVER stayed on. It only did the routine light up with all lights for a few seconds, then went out.
Now that I think about it. Maybe 4 days before it went out, the engine was running, it was in park, but the wheel was very hard to turn. The brake pedal has always been spongy, but never acted up until the steering went out. I do remember braking very hard one night, and the wheel made 2 small jerks to the right.
If it was my fault, it would have either been from that 1 hard stop, or swapping to the FR500 wheel. I honsetly don't think either is possible, but I can't ignore the coincidence. There's just too much of that in my life right now. Call it bad karma I guess.
So Yesterday I picked up the car, and it was the FIRST time I drove it knowing about this whole hydroboost system. I don't like it at all. I don't like how the steering performs differently while your braking, as it does while your cruising. I don't like how turning the wheel slightly at a stop, then pressing the brake will cause the wheel to pull back to center. I don't like how my RPMs drop slightly from idle when I step on the brake. I also don't like turning, then braking halfway into the turn, and noticing the difference. Most of all I don't like having the steering system, and brake system accociated in any way on my car. This is a safety issue here. Losing the steering means you will also lose your brakes. Those are the 2 ONLY evasive manouvers for avoiding a crash that's happening in front of you. It bothers me to think that if I ever have to take any evasive manouver, how I press the brake might effect my steering, and vice versa. This hydroboost thing is common on all new cars though, not just Fords.
So that's it. Looks like this issue is resolved, and we all now know, for future reference. I'm outta here now. I'm going to Panda Exress, which COINCIDENTLY was where I was trying to go last thursday, when I first noticed my brakes making that sound.
So in the end, ther was nothing wrong with the brakes. After reading some replies, I kinda figured that anyway, especially after seeing the power steering fluid leak. I'd like to also add that the grinding sound was not coming from the rotors, or being cause by metal on metal contact involving my brakes. Any time I heard the grinding sound, the car was STOPPED, meaning there was no possible chance of movement or friction at the rotors. I'd also like to add (for anyone else in the future who might troubleshoot this on their car, that the ABS light in the dash NEVER stayed on. It only did the routine light up with all lights for a few seconds, then went out.
Now that I think about it. Maybe 4 days before it went out, the engine was running, it was in park, but the wheel was very hard to turn. The brake pedal has always been spongy, but never acted up until the steering went out. I do remember braking very hard one night, and the wheel made 2 small jerks to the right.
If it was my fault, it would have either been from that 1 hard stop, or swapping to the FR500 wheel. I honsetly don't think either is possible, but I can't ignore the coincidence. There's just too much of that in my life right now. Call it bad karma I guess.
So Yesterday I picked up the car, and it was the FIRST time I drove it knowing about this whole hydroboost system. I don't like it at all. I don't like how the steering performs differently while your braking, as it does while your cruising. I don't like how turning the wheel slightly at a stop, then pressing the brake will cause the wheel to pull back to center. I don't like how my RPMs drop slightly from idle when I step on the brake. I also don't like turning, then braking halfway into the turn, and noticing the difference. Most of all I don't like having the steering system, and brake system accociated in any way on my car. This is a safety issue here. Losing the steering means you will also lose your brakes. Those are the 2 ONLY evasive manouvers for avoiding a crash that's happening in front of you. It bothers me to think that if I ever have to take any evasive manouver, how I press the brake might effect my steering, and vice versa. This hydroboost thing is common on all new cars though, not just Fords.
So that's it. Looks like this issue is resolved, and we all now know, for future reference. I'm outta here now. I'm going to Panda Exress, which COINCIDENTLY was where I was trying to go last thursday, when I first noticed my brakes making that sound.
You shouldn't feel the things you are feeling...at least my car doesn't.
My steering doesn't feel any different while braking or not
My steering wheel does not move at all if i press the brake pedal
Again, i notice ZERO difference in steering if i am pressing the brakes or not
Also, how are you guys going through pads so quickly? I had 38K miles on my Gt when i took the stock brakes off and upgraded to 13" Brakes. I still had half my pad material on the pads and i brake HARD when i drive. I think i could have easily gone 50K before needing new pads.
neither of us are going through pads. lol
i sure aint. mine are great still
anyways, replaced the power steering pump, turns like a champ.
it resolved the whining noise/ brake pedal grinding issue.
turns out the brakes are dependent on the power steering pump . something to do with them getting pressure from it.. brake assist? sumthin
anyways. problem solved. $65 pump ( with core. ) ( without is $102)
just make sure you use a press to put the pulley on. i broke two pumps trying to get the pulley on it, using their nut and bolt method of putting the pulley on the new pump. also one of the bolts broke inside of the pump... how gay. cheap ****. lol
good luck with your problem man.
i sure aint. mine are great still
anyways, replaced the power steering pump, turns like a champ.
it resolved the whining noise/ brake pedal grinding issue.
turns out the brakes are dependent on the power steering pump . something to do with them getting pressure from it.. brake assist? sumthin
anyways. problem solved. $65 pump ( with core. ) ( without is $102)
just make sure you use a press to put the pulley on. i broke two pumps trying to get the pulley on it, using their nut and bolt method of putting the pulley on the new pump. also one of the bolts broke inside of the pump... how gay. cheap ****. lol
good luck with your problem man.
I'm not noticing the things like I did the first day I picked up the car. They did need an extra day to bleed the system, and said they still couldn't get all the air out. They also did say something about it getting better over time, or something about whatever. I don't know. Once I heard them say things like "I'm not a ford person", and laugh it off, I kinda stopped listening. I never tried the stop, turn, then brake thing to feel if the wheel moves again. I'm scared I'll break the junk. Also, doing donuts hasn't crossed my mind again, which is probly good in the long run. I will say that my steering is still EXTREMELY responsive. Sometimes the slight hand movement from me hitting the turn signal switch will cause the car to turn (just a little). On a 2 lane road my car drifts to the right in the right lane, and drifts to the left in the left lane. Just from the curve of the road surface. Pebbles feel like skateboards and garbage can lids, and potholes feel like the Grand Canyon. I better not sneeze ever at 70mph.
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