Should test fitting longtube headers really be this difficult?

divit250r · Feb 29, 2012

divit250r said:
It looks ok, but aluminum is soft. Ideally you need 1-1/2 times the thread diameter for length of engagement. I wouldn't trust it at any less than 1 times the diameter in a pinch.

Scott

Maybe this didn't make sense, but I'm saying you need 5/16" of the threads to engage the holes as the minimum, but 1/2" would be best. If you have a 3/4 long bolt and 3/8 thick flanges, you should be ok.

divit250r · Feb 29, 2012

Double post

Venom351R · Mar 8, 2012

Gave the passenger side another try today thanks to some warm weather and time in my schedule. Unbolted the tranny mount and removed the motor mount and while the header did make it up further then it has before the tubes were still binding on the bell housing preventing it from going up any further. So needless to say with all the tricks and suggestions tried the last resort which I was hoping to avoid will have to be done. Wont be this weekend but weather permitting next weekend I'll be removing the tranny and bell housing.

It hits on the K member and the transmission but the transmission seems to be the bigger issue

Venom351R · Mar 17, 2012

Trans and bell housing are coming out today. I'll find out a lot more later on as far as if that is the only issue or if there is going to be further problems as far as fitment goes. Hopefully pulling the trans and bell housing will be the extent of it....I really really hope....

Also had the rear end rebuilt at Ford, all new bearings, races, pinion seal. Cost me $445.00 out the door. The only part I was missing was the oil slinger which did not come in the kit but should have been present in the rear end but wasn't. I never even heard of it before but they had one in stock and it was only $5. As soon as we get the rear end bolted back in the trans and bell housing will be coming off.

revhead347 · Mar 17, 2012

Venom351R said:
Also had the rear end rebuilt at Ford, all new bearings, races, pinion seal. Cost me $445.00 out the door. The only part I was missing was the oil slinger which did not come in the kit but should have been present in the rear end but wasn't. I never even heard of it before but they had one in stock and it was only $5. As soon as we get the rear end bolted back in the trans and bell housing will be coming off.

That really isn't a bad price.

Kurt

Venom351R · Mar 17, 2012

Thats what quite a few people have said. I talked to the tech that did the rear end and he said the bearings look good that he took out but he said the reason why there was no preload is b/c of the crush collar not being crushed enough or to much. Either way though I feel better having a fully rebuilt rear end so I know that is one component I dont have to worry about. There is another local guy who needed his rear end done and I told him to go to this dealer but they quoted him over $700. Didn't think it would make that much of a difference between bringing the car in VS just the rear end. He bought all the parts for his as well. The tech that did mine said it was a really nice kit kit came with everything. Its the American Muscle rebuild kit. The other guy ended up going somewhere else and got it done for 5XX something I think

revhead347 · Mar 17, 2012

Unfortunately I don't have pay other people money, so I'm going to have to figure it out on my own.

Kurt

Venom351R · Mar 17, 2012

well............ Got the passenger side header in. How close was I before.........really damn close. I just needed an extra set of hands to help out thanks to my friend that came down today. And surprise surprise....they went in from the top as well as the bottom, who would have thunk it. I did not take the other bolt off the motor mount but with it loosened up it was enough to give me the clearance I needed along w/ the tranny mount being unbolted. So overall the tranny did not have to come out. But it was all not a cake walk. One of the primary tubes was hitting on the inside of the engine bay so it had to be massaged with a BFH to properly fit. But as of now everything clears and I have good clearance on by the tranny mount for the prochamber. So now I can finally send them off to be coated and hopefully I can do that pretty soon.

Also got the rear end installed, none of the bolts are torqued to spec yet, once we got it so it would support itself we moved onto the headers so tomorrow I'll torque everything down. Over all I feel good with the progress made today. It was only a matter of time before things had to swing the other way as far as the header fitment issues

revhead347 · Mar 17, 2012

Congratulations man. Finally there.

Kurt

Venom351R · Mar 17, 2012

yeah I know, about time. We did not mess with the drivers side. That side will clear just fine w/ an aftermarket steering shaft. Just need to get and I'll be all set for that side as well.

Noobz347 · Mar 17, 2012

Venom351R said:
well............ Got the passenger side header in. How close was I before.........really damn close. I just needed an extra set of hands to help out thanks to my friend that came down today. And surprise surprise....they went in from the top as well as the bottom, who would have thunk it. I did not take the other bolt off the motor mount but with it loosened up it was enough to give me the clearance I needed along w/ the tranny mount being unbolted. So overall the tranny did not have to come out. But it was all not a cake walk. One of the primary tubes was hitting on the inside of the engine bay so it had to be massaged with a BFH to properly fit. But as of now everything clears and I have good clearance on by the tranny mount for the prochamber. So now I can finally send them off to be coated and hopefully I can do that pretty soon.

Also got the rear end installed, none of the bolts are torqued to spec yet, once we got it so it would support itself we moved onto the headers so tomorrow I'll torque everything down. Over all I feel good with the progress made today. It was only a matter of time before things had to swing the other way as far as the header fitment issues

WOOT! I've been following this thread pretty much since the start. Glad to see you finally got it licked.

Question: Now with the passenger side header in place, how much of a PITA will it be to access your starter?

Venom351R · Mar 17, 2012

probably impossible lol Actually I think with some extensions and swivels I would be able to get it undone if I needed to. Almost makes me tempted to throw a new one on now so I dont have to worry about it at some other time. Considering where the tubes and collector comes down I dont think it will be to much of an issue. Guess I'll find out when I actually put the starter back on to see how much of a PITA it will be to get it off if I had to.

Thanks for following btw

Noobz347 · Mar 17, 2012

Get yourself a mini-starter if you have it in the budget. Your knuckles and neck will thank you later.

revhead347 · Mar 17, 2012

Denso gear reduction is the way to go. They have dropped below $200 now.

Kurt

Venom351R · Mar 18, 2012

I know its not for the correct year but wouldn't you this would fit since its for a 351 with a M/T
http://www.nationsautoelectric.com/2-1881-FD-1.html

if not is this what I would need

http://www.nationsautoelectric.com/2-2072-ND.html

I dont really have the price of a starter in the budget, as of now I'm going to fall short when it comes to getting a catback system. I have enough extra to get the headers coated, cats, fluids, and clamps for the exhaust system. I'll have to save up for an exhaust system. I know now is the best time to do a mini stater and I maybe able to swing it cost wise but I have to keep the price as low as possible.

I also read on other forums that ours is a mini high tq starter to begin with. When I look up the mini starter from ford racing on the summit site it looks identical to what I have now, other then mine being used and looks crappy lol. This is exactly what I have now, how can I tell for sure if its actually a mini starter or not its hard to tell size wise just from a picture.
http://www.cjponyparts.com/MINI-STARTER-14KW-V8-1965-1995/p/STR1806/

revhead347 · Mar 18, 2012

The one in the second link is the only one that's worth it's salt. That's a gear reduction Denso starter. The others are just factory style ones. I think Advance actually has it a little cheaper under the Powermaster name. I would try the factory one first. If it doesn't fit, or it gets heat soaked, swap right to the gear reduction Denso. I went to a gear reduction Denso about a decade ago because the stock one was getting heat soaked from the longtubes. I tried about 2 different rebuilt stock ones, and putting a heat shield on it first, all of which were a waste of time. That Denso has unbelievable starting power.

Kurt

Venom351R · Mar 18, 2012

Ok I'll keep that in mind. What are the symptoms when it gets heat soaked so I'll know If I'm having that problem down the road.

1slow95 · Mar 18, 2012

Venom351R said:
Ok I'll keep that in mind. What are the symptoms when it gets heat soaked so I'll know If I'm having that problem down the road.

Pretty much the same thing as a dead/dying battery. After driving the car it won't start again until you let it cool for a couple hours.

Venom351R · Mar 18, 2012

sounds pretty simple. Once the long tubes are on for good I'll take pics to show how much or how little clearance there is between the header and the starter. Maybe I'll get lucky and wont have any issues.

ProKiller · Mar 19, 2012

i had heat soak issues after installing my long tubes. didn't think it was that common, but apparently it is. i went through two stock types before then heat wrapping the starter. it's been fine ever since.

EDIT: forgot to say congratulations on finally getting the headers in!

Should test fitting longtube headers really be this difficult?

divit250r

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divit250r

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Venom351R

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revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

Venom351R

revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

Venom351R

revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

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Noobz347

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Venom351R

Noobz347

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revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

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Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

Venom351R

1slow95

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Should test fitting longtube headers really be this difficult?

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