Since my car got tuned it has a lot more power but BUCKS..anyone else?
- Thread starter Pokageek
- Start date
-
Sponsors (?)
Ronman
Founding Member
my car does that. timing is set around 10 degrees for n2o. i just figured it was the stock computer and my heads intake and cam. it idles very rough though, like a stock car or something, i love it. with the rockers i think it has like a .529 lift or something, but opens up after bout 2500k til yellow light comes on.
welll, I'm gonna jump in this and throw my .02 in. Someone feel free to dispute this.
When your tuner tuned your car....u gained a good bit of hp. Unfortunately....it seems that with our cars (well any car really), a gain in horsepower/torque causes a loss in drivability. Maybe the tuner didn't get a good tune for the bottom part of the maf curve
I know that one thing that can cause this bucking is having too much timing advance when the buck is happening. Another thing could be too much or not enough fuel.
Have you tried cleaning ur maf/iac/changing O2 sensors/etc...the usual suspects? Maybe you could check for codes. That can tell novels as to car problems
When your tuner tuned your car....u gained a good bit of hp. Unfortunately....it seems that with our cars (well any car really), a gain in horsepower/torque causes a loss in drivability. Maybe the tuner didn't get a good tune for the bottom part of the maf curve
I know that one thing that can cause this bucking is having too much timing advance when the buck is happening. Another thing could be too much or not enough fuel.
Have you tried cleaning ur maf/iac/changing O2 sensors/etc...the usual suspects? Maybe you could check for codes. That can tell novels as to car problems
cbarr300 said:welll, I'm gonna jump in this and throw my .02 in. Someone feel free to dispute this.
When your tuner tuned your car....u gained a good bit of hp. Unfortunately....it seems that with our cars (well any car really), a gain in horsepower/torque causes a loss in drivability. Maybe the tuner didn't get a good tune for the bottom part of the maf curve
I know that one thing that can cause this bucking is having too much timing advance when the buck is happening. Another thing could be too much or not enough fuel.
Have you tried cleaning ur maf/iac/changing O2 sensors/etc...the usual suspects? Maybe you could check for codes. That can tell novels as to car problems
Thanks for the input cbarr300.
My car has a tendancy to run rich and he was able to bum the timing higher..it's probably 16* or so. It rockets n all gears now which is great. I doubt he mapped the timing lower in the under 2k rpm like you suggested though. My MAF is a new Lightening 90mm. IAC is new. o2 sensors are a year old. I am going to guess it is the timing but yes a diagnos would help. I have a switch to lower timing for the NO2 so I am going to turn it to the N02 postition and see if that fixes the prob. If so.. I guess I have my answer.
Pops Fun
10 Year Member
Thanks guys. :SNSign: I switched it over to the lower timing setting and it ran very "mannerly."
Sure Grady. On the tweecer - a resounding NO. I have to admit that I liked playing around with the BASIC settings BUT at the time - if I ran into real trouble, folks with that tweecer didn't want to give out answers readily. I don't know why. It's like they wanted you to suffer.
With my job, I didn't have time to play around begging for answers. 
PLUS the computer chip never got a good seal on my computer even after following the precise instructions. This may depend on the condition of the computer connectoid. I wasn't about to buy another computer just for that.
Then I had that problem after the H/C/I of the car not running and I said %^&* it. No more playing around. It turned out to be a MAF programing issue problem AND a crushed fuel injector..those two problems led me on a freaking wild goose chase that nearly caused me to sell the car for parts.
A few things you folks can take from opinion and learn from my experience:
#1 Don't ever use MD Performance. (Kauffman Motorsports got 20 more rwhp out of my car than they did.) They charged me $1200.00 PLUS to tell me that my MAF sensor, even though it was mapped for 24# injectors had to be manually programmed! Now that I have experience, I now that that is one of the FIRST things they should have checked. In my opinion, the gouged me (for lack of a "better" word).
#2 Don't assume you are ever going to slap on a MAF made for 24# injectors and see you car run.
#3 Don't make too many changes to a car at one time. It makes for tougher diagnosis. I changed out the H/I (cam was already in), MAF, injectors and fuel pump all at once.
If I don't like the setting, I can take it back to kauffman and they will fix it. As it is, I am ok as long as I know nothing is wrong.
Sure Grady. On the tweecer - a resounding NO. I have to admit that I liked playing around with the BASIC settings BUT at the time - if I ran into real trouble, folks with that tweecer didn't want to give out answers readily. I don't know why. It's like they wanted you to suffer.
With my job, I didn't have time to play around begging for answers. PLUS the computer chip never got a good seal on my computer even after following the precise instructions. This may depend on the condition of the computer connectoid. I wasn't about to buy another computer just for that.Then I had that problem after the H/C/I of the car not running and I said %^&* it. No more playing around. It turned out to be a MAF programing issue problem AND a crushed fuel injector..those two problems led me on a freaking wild goose chase that nearly caused me to sell the car for parts.
A few things you folks can take from opinion and learn from my experience:
#1 Don't ever use MD Performance. (Kauffman Motorsports got 20 more rwhp out of my car than they did.) They charged me $1200.00 PLUS to tell me that my MAF sensor, even though it was mapped for 24# injectors had to be manually programmed! Now that I have experience, I now that that is one of the FIRST things they should have checked. In my opinion, the gouged me (for lack of a "better" word).
#2 Don't assume you are ever going to slap on a MAF made for 24# injectors and see you car run.
#3 Don't make too many changes to a car at one time. It makes for tougher diagnosis. I changed out the H/I (cam was already in), MAF, injectors and fuel pump all at once.
If I don't like the setting, I can take it back to kauffman and they will fix it. As it is, I am ok as long as I know nothing is wrong.
good to hear it was just running too much timing and it was nothing major ::thumbs up::
If you can take all that extra bucking....then by all means have at it
me...I'm STILL fighting a bucking issue....almost throws me out the car under 1200 rpms in first or second......but only when off the throttle.....I blame it on not FULLY knowing the tweecer.......plenty of tylenol involved with self-tuning
If you can take all that extra bucking....then by all means have at it
me...I'm STILL fighting a bucking issue....almost throws me out the car under 1200 rpms in first or second......but only when off the throttle.....I blame it on not FULLY knowing the tweecer.......plenty of tylenol involved with self-tuning
GTA_V6_Mustang
Active Member
cbarr300 said:good to hear it was just running too much timing and it was nothing major ::thumbs up::
If you can take all that extra bucking....then by all means have at it
me...I'm STILL fighting a bucking issue....almost throws me out the car under 1200 rpms in first or second......but only when off the throttle.....I blame it on not FULLY knowing the tweecer.......plenty of tylenol involved with self-tuning
Mr. Clay
Try pulling back a little spark in the lower load rows of the base table.
It might be help more if you confirmed the conditions (load/rpm) of the happening with a dlog before you started hosing around with the table
anyway ............ its a common known ...............
too much spark can cause the buck thing
inj timing can smooth things out as well
Before I worked with mine, I had a much more noticable lope at idle with the speed set at 950 rpm
Now it is much more smooth at a speed of 850 rpm
Grady
I cut all the lower load values down by about 25%...maybe I should do it more.
I haven't had my laptop for the last week so I haven't been able to log anything I'll have it back by tomorrow hough so I'll finally be able to see what pulling some timing did for me.
I have one problem with the injector timing....Its a custom ground blower cam.......and I have NO idea what the cam profile is. Is there a way to map out injector timing without knowing the specs of the cam?
Thanks grady
I haven't had my laptop for the last week so I haven't been able to log anything
I'll have it back by tomorrow hough so I'll finally be able to see what pulling some timing did for me.I have one problem with the injector timing....Its a custom ground blower cam.......and I have NO idea what the cam profile is. Is there a way to map out injector timing without knowing the specs of the cam?
Thanks grady
cbarr300 said:
Just for you Clay
I'm gonna now reveal
A method NEVER seen or exposed before
Grady's Plan "B" shoot from the hip method of Self Tuning
Its one of those mindset kinda things
Don't ya see
I'd find several similar application kinds of cam specs to yours
See the general tendencies of em all
Average up all the different specs
Upload them and see how is goes
Sometimes ... with all this new fangled high tech stuff .....
You gotta mix in a little ...... Old Fashion Common Horse Sense
Grady
A tweecer is a "self tuning" computer chip. It costs around $550 for the version that you need to do it properly plus another $200 I think for the wide band 02 sensors.
I paid $300 for my chip and $200 for my professional DYNO tune and I am done with it. No tinkering toying or anything and I know it is all done right. If I don't like I setting, they fix it for free and I spend my time doing other stuff.
It all comes down to personal preference and how much aggravation you want to put up with.
I paid $300 for my chip and $200 for my professional DYNO tune and I am done with it. No tinkering toying or anything and I know it is all done right. If I don't like I setting, they fix it for free and I spend my time doing other stuff.
It all comes down to personal preference and how much aggravation you want to put up with.
Pokageek said:
I could not agree with you more Sir
However .............
If I was trying to explain my Tweecer experience to this noobie
My "preference" in choice of words would have been
Enjoyment
With added comments of something kinda like
How many "New" and "Exciting" things do you wanna learn
or maybe
You will then be able to have "Total Control" over your tune
Again ... I don't have a prob with those who didn't have a good experience with self tuning.
It is just that ..........It ain't all black or white
or in other words
It is not as bad as "aggravation"
which means ... it ain't as hard as you make it out to be
It is also not "total bliss" either
which means ... it ain't as easy as I make it out to be
As Always ... There are two sides to every story
and
Reality is Usually ... Somewhere in the Middle
Grady
Haha, I feel special now Mr. Grady.
That's one thing that I actually didn't think about...but it's definately a great idea. I do happen to know one thing about that cam...it has .536 lift. So that should narrow it down somewhat. Hey, worse comes to worst I can always just change it back
One thing is for sure....I can't wait til I get the dough for a N/A 427 build....should be about 8 more months. That way I know EVERYTHING that is inside that engine....and I can properly tune EVERYTHING out
:SNSign:
That's one thing that I actually didn't think about...but it's definately a great idea. I do happen to know one thing about that cam...it has .536 lift. So that should narrow it down somewhat. Hey, worse comes to worst I can always just change it back
One thing is for sure....I can't wait til I get the dough for a N/A 427 build....should be about 8 more months. That way I know EVERYTHING that is inside that engine....and I can properly tune EVERYTHING out
:SNSign:
Ok, I like to make the internet a great place for answers so as usual, follow up and conclusion.
Kauffman Motorsports was great as usual and added some fuel and took out a little timing under 2500 and when not in load. Car runs great - no charge. Thanks again to the guys at Kauffman's.
As for the rest of my day though it sucked. Maybe because it is the day after Thanksgiving and people have hangovers or something?
I personally officially hate Pennsylvania, not the people but the damn laws there. For one thing I hate having to freaking PAY to drive on the dam road. I never carry cash because it weighs me down and money is dirty anyway. So thats me , so anyway I get to the toll booth so I can pay to drive on their freaking road and I couldnt find any change in the car. I had to pull aside, fill out a form and mail the money in.
In the meantime one rude driver decided to take his bad turkey dinner out on me and sit behind me honking and shaking his head for me to get out of the way! He had plenty of room to go around but decided to go cromagna in front of his kid (what a loser, lol).
Then on the interstate, people were doing 90mph today for some reason. Well I got a ticket in PA a month ago and decided to stay in the right lane so what do some of the drivers do? They drive up behind me and have plenty of room to go around but instead they drive right up my a$$ AND THEN QUICK CUT TO THE LEFT LANE AND CUT IN FRONT.
OOPS caps..
So I start filming them. It is funny how all the sudden they back waay of and become responsible drivers when you do that.
So on my way back I stop by the comunist..oops I mean toll booth and try to pay and she says "its already in the computer so you'll have to mail in the money." So I get in my car and go to pull out and the roads are so suck that I must have drove over a huge bump with a crack in the pavement that sounded like the bottom of my car ws detaching.
But there's other reasons I hate PA - their BS taxes, the "townships" like to report you to your insurance carrier when you get a ticket, they will pull you over for the most rediculous speeds like 7 mph over, car inspections required EVERY year and if your car has been modified - even just lowered an inch, they have a right to tell you to put it back to stock and YOU pay for it!..in my that state is cose to communisim.. End rant.
Kauffman Motorsports was great as usual and added some fuel and took out a little timing under 2500 and when not in load. Car runs great - no charge. Thanks again to the guys at Kauffman's.
As for the rest of my day though it sucked. Maybe because it is the day after Thanksgiving and people have hangovers or something?
I personally officially hate Pennsylvania, not the people but the damn laws there. For one thing I hate having to freaking PAY to drive on the dam road. I never carry cash because it weighs me down and money is dirty anyway. So thats me , so anyway I get to the toll booth so I can pay to drive on their freaking road and I couldnt find any change in the car. I had to pull aside, fill out a form and mail the money in.
In the meantime one rude driver decided to take his bad turkey dinner out on me and sit behind me honking and shaking his head for me to get out of the way! He had plenty of room to go around but decided to go cromagna in front of his kid (what a loser, lol).
Then on the interstate, people were doing 90mph today for some reason. Well I got a ticket in PA a month ago and decided to stay in the right lane so what do some of the drivers do? They drive up behind me and have plenty of room to go around but instead they drive right up my a$$ AND THEN QUICK CUT TO THE LEFT LANE AND CUT IN FRONT.
So I start filming them. It is funny how all the sudden they back waay of and become responsible drivers when you do that.
So on my way back I stop by the comunist..oops I mean toll booth and try to pay and she says "its already in the computer so you'll have to mail in the money." So I get in my car and go to pull out and the roads are so suck that I must have drove over a huge bump with a crack in the pavement that sounded like the bottom of my car ws detaching.
But there's other reasons I hate PA - their BS taxes, the "townships" like to report you to your insurance carrier when you get a ticket, they will pull you over for the most rediculous speeds like 7 mph over, car inspections required EVERY year and if your car has been modified - even just lowered an inch, they have a right to tell you to put it back to stock and YOU pay for it!..in my that state is cose to communisim.. End rant.
Similar threads
