Stiff (broken?) Suspension

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Hi everyone,

I know I have posted before about this when I first got my 1990 GT, but I hadn't really driven it much at that point. I thought it was just a really stiff setup, but I just recently took the car out of storage and have been looking a little further into it.

How much travel should the front suspension have? If I push on the fender it barely moves at all, and if I push up and down trying to get it bouncing it moves maybe an inch. To me that just can't be right. When driving it feels like there is a solid link between the tires and the car itself.

I tried jacking it up from the K member keeping an eye on the lower control arms making sure that they are moving and they did. Even once the tires were off the ground it looked like they had only dropped a few inches which might be normal. It was nice to see that the wheels at least dropped out of the fender a bit. I was concerned they wouldn't at all. The rear at least seems to move when I push down on it or try to bounce it. It is still stiff, but moves at least

Is there anything on these that is prone to failure that might cause this? It is almost completely stock and hasn't been driven much so I thought that maybe the struts have seized up. I have never seen this happen, but I don't know what else could have happened. It does seem strange that both sides are exactly the same so maybe it is just really stiff springs or struts?

Thanks for any suggestions.

 

[90sickfox]

I've seen springs stiffen up from sitting. My old 67 sat for years and it rode like a brick until I changed the springs.

My 88 that I have now doesn't bounce when the front is pushed on at all. Come to think of it....I haven't been able to bounce the front of any mustang I've ever owned.

Even with 4cylinder springs, in the front of one of my cars, I couldn't bounce the car. That thing would raise up and drove like a boat on the road, though.

For some reason these cars aren't set up like a lot of others. Maybe, its because our cars are so front heavy.....don't want all that weight being thrown around.

 

[Mustang5L5]

Pics of said suspension components and ride height?

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Thanks guys, at first I was thinking struts but then the more I though about it the more that didn't seem right unless they were bottomed out or something but the ride height appears right to me. I was thinking springs but didn't think they did anything other than got softer over time so that didn't make sense either but if they can stiffen up after sitting that makes sense. This car has done a lot of sitting over it's lifetime. I have a couple pics of the car sitting, the height looks consistent front to back. I don't have any of the suspension yet. I will have to get the wheels off for that.

 

[General karthief]

Good looking car, stock height.
Mine does not move much, rides good, corners really well and is also stock height.
As long as it don't thump or bang you're likely good.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

I think the previous post about riding like a brick is really accurate. I had it on a back road with a speed limit of 90 KM/H and hit a bump and the front end felt like it almost (or maybe did a bit) leave the ground. It came down really hard. I don't expect it to ride like a luxury car but I just can't believe this is normal. Same thing with speed bumps - I creep over them but it is still just violent. Even at city speeds every bump shakes the car and rattles everything. I am trying not to spend too much on things that don't need to be replaced, but for how low mileage the car is and how long it has sat maybe new struts and springs might not be a bad idea. I wouldn't be surprised if they are original.

 

[General karthief]

Try just replacing the struts and shocks, I think if your springs were bad it would sit lower

 

[90sickfox]

The struts springs and shocks would be a great idea....once you take off the struts and shocks you'll be just 4 caliper bolts, 2 tie rod end nuts, and 2 hammer whacks away from putting the springs in.

Forgot to mention the first possible reason for a hard ride....air pressures in the tires. They should be around 32psi.

Very nice car !!! I really like the tasteful mods done too it.

Karthief, is right about changing the struts and shocks....but, while you're there, why not change the springs, too ? It can only make the ride even better.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Thanks, it took a long time to find one that wasn't high mileage and rusty or that has had a lot of performance upgrades done. This is almost all stock, no rust and low mileage and the color combo was just too much to pass up.

I guess I will do the front springs and struts and see what I have after that. I think the back is OK. It is for sure better than the front. If it still doesn't feel right after that I will tackle the rear shocks and springs too.

Is there anything else I will need to replace in the way of bushings or spring seats, that type of thing? The springs and struts I am thinking of getting don't appear to come with anything.

 

[90sickfox]

Its a good idea to get spring isolators...the rubber that goes at the top and bottom of the springs.

Also, check the ball joints while you're there. The control arm bushings might be OK. They'll start cracking and tearing if they're bad. There shouldn't be any play in the front steering...

The hardest part of doing this type of work is finding a good place to jack the car up. Whatever you do....don't jack the car up on the pinch weld like a normal car. Don't jack on the radiator support either. They will both crush. I jack mine up on the front control arm edge and under the rear end in the back. Jack stands at the k member rear most two bolts and on the axle tubes or the square part of the body where the rear lower control arms bolt up.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Thanks, I will try to find those locally, I already placed the order for the springs and struts last night trying to get them here for the long weekend.

I know what you mean about where to jack the car up from. I had to do a search here to find out the best spots and concluded exactly where you have said. I am used to my 2007 Crown Victoria - there is no shortage of places to lift that car with the full frame.

Also, I guess after the struts and springs are changed I will have to get it to an alignment shop correct? It has been a long time since I have done any suspension work.

 

[Mustang5L5]

The camber will change if you drop the car. Depending on how low you go, there may not be any adjustment without aftermarket CC plates.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Ok, I want to stick with the factory height. I like the look of lowering them but where I live the roads are terrible so that probably isn't a good idea.

 

[90sickfox]

An alignment will be necessary afterwards. They sell camber bolts that take the place of one of the strut bolts on each side. With camber bolts you'll be able to dial in the camber if needed. Most of the time it only takes drilling a rivet out on the top strut plate and moving it a tad.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Ok, I think I have an alignment place that is about 5 minutes from my house so that will be fine. If I recall you can mark where the old strut was positioned before you take it off which will let you put the new one as close as possible to get it to a shop after.

 

[MFE92]

Springs do NOT get stiffer with age LOL. Bushings rot, balljoints gain friction struts seize, etc. People tend to way underestimate the effect old balljoints and bushings have on ride quality. If you don't address some of that, you're going to be sorely disappointed in the effort you put into changing springs. I wouldn't go as far as you're going without also changing the control arms, which will get you fresh bushings and balljoints.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Ok, good to know. My first thought was seized struts. With the car sitting as long as it has it makes sense I think. I have added ball joints to the list and will have a good look at everything else once it is apart.

Too bad it needs these repairs, I had my heart set on a new exhaust system, lol. But I guess it is best to fix real problems before spending money on the fun stuff. On the plus side when I put the car away last year it had a flashing air bag light which hasn't been an issue so far so that is nice. I'm sure it will be back because problems rarely seem to fix themselves, but so far so good.

 

[90sickfox]

Springs do NOT get stiffer with age LOL. Bushings rot, balljoints gain friction struts seize, etc. People tend to way underestimate the effect old balljoints and bushings have on ride quality. If you don't address some of that, you're going to be sorely disappointed in the effort you put into changing springs. I wouldn't go as far as you're going without also changing the control arms, which will get you fresh bushings and balljoints.

They do get stiff....some can even crack. It has something to do with the memory in the spring metal. I've been there...done that... It might not be true in other parts of the country where temps don't swing as much.

Springs wear out in a bunch of different ways...if driven a lot....then, yes, they'll soften and sag. If the car sits a lot they can get stiff. To each they're own...but I've been there...and seen it numerous times.

The spring is supposed to store energy. If the spring rest in one state, for many years, it will loose that memory and will no longer push up on the cars body the same...and it won't compress the same.

Another thing, these cars are known for is the bottom rung of the springs breaking inside the factory rubber isolator down in the front control arms...that could also give a hard ride. They break from getting old and brittle...ie; not flexing properly.

 

[MFE92]

No. They do not get stiffer, in the form of higher rate making them harder to compress. It's metallurgically impossible. They can and often do sag, the can and do break, but they don't get stiffer. If he has a broken spring, that's one thing. If not, the source of his ride harshness lies elsewhere, and to insist otherwise does the OP a real disservice.

 

[2007_Crown_Vic]

Thanks guys, I appreciate all the help and advice. I have springs and struts on the way and have priced out ball joints locally and an alignment. I am confident all of this will help get it running nice again. I am still leaning towards my first assumption that the struts were seized, or also maybe like I read elsewhere that sometime the fluid can thicken causing them to be rock hard like they are. I was going to just replace them but I never seem to win playing that game and know that I would be taking them back out a couple of weeks later to replace the springs like I should have done in the first place. Likewise with the ball joints. So I will just do all of them at once and inspect bushings and everything else while I'm in there.

I am kicking myself a bit because I had the front hubs off changing wheel bearings a couple of months ago but that was before I had the car out and was convinced the suspension needed work too otherwise I could have done all of this at once. Now with the wheel bearing noise gone I am really looking forward to getting the suspension fixed up. The car is already really fun to drive even with its current comfort issues, being smooth and quiet (well, suspension-wise anyway) will just make it even better. Next up assuming nothing else goes wrong will be exhaust.